Ronald Flip Murray

SmushedPennies · Post #1 » by **SmushedPennies** » Sat Aug 15, 2009 10:22 am

Hey guys, Heat fan here. I was wondering what your opinions were on why Flip is such a journeyman despite his skills. I feel like he can really help bolster the Heat's bench, but I'm concerned that he never seems to stick anywhere.

evildallas · Post #2 » by **evildallas** » Sat Aug 15, 2009 11:13 am

Flip can score the ball, create his own shot, has good handle, and actually played better d for us than I expected. I think that he's always had trouble finding the right fit and I thought that he may have had it here, but management wanted to upgrade the position. He fit Woodson iso heavy system well though.

Here's his downside: he lacks either instincts or court vision to hit the open man which limits his effectiveness as a PG. When he penetrates you can play him exclusively for the shot. At some of his stops he's tried to force the playmaking and the rest of his game suffered. At the same time he lacks the ideal size to play the SG position. Also although he shot well from long range last year his career 3 pt numbers are suspect and in general he's not a high percentage shooter. He's a scorer meaning that he needs minutes and attempts to put numbers. If he doesn't get steady minutes then sometimes he'll be hot from the get go, but others he'll shoot you out of a game. The minutes help average out the good and the bad for decent production.

Bottom line is he's a very serviceable backup combo guard, he plays hard and when he gets hot he can carry a team in spots (even to wins). He's not going to make those around him better though. I think he's a lot better player than the other guards available at this stage in the off-season. Last year his production per minute and Allen Iverson's were about identical. The biggest difference being that Flip is willing to accept his role while AI still thinks he should be the center of any team he's on. I actually hope that you guys don't sign Flip because he has the potential to stick to us every time we play out of spite.

CViggity · Post #3 » by **CViggity** » Sat Aug 15, 2009 5:27 pm

He's extremely underrated

http://www.82games.com/0809/ONSORT6.HTM

Adobozz · Post #4 » by **Adobozz** » Sat Aug 15, 2009 7:32 pm

I loved FLip, he is a baller.. If we didn't get Jamal i would love to have him back..... I mean i have nothing, but positive words for Flip so i am not gonna waste my time....

SmushedPennies · Post #5 » by **SmushedPennies** » Sat Aug 15, 2009 8:18 pm

evildallas wrote: The biggest difference being that Flip is willing to accept his role while AI still thinks he should be the center of any team he's on. I actually hope that you guys don't sign Flip because he has the potential to stick to us every time we play out of spite.

Exactly why I want him over AI. Plus, I feel like Flip is a better long-range shooter now.

Thanks for the info so far guys

C_Money · Post #6 » by **C_Money** » Sun Aug 16, 2009 4:22 am

I like him alot. I don't understand why nobody's signed him yet.

td00 · Post #7 » by **td00** » Sun Aug 16, 2009 12:58 pm

If you need points off the bench, and with JJ and Bibby struggling at times, we needed a punch off the bench.
He took any minutes that would have gone to Acie and Speedy and made them expendable, even if they have seen their opportunities fly by.
Flip is instant offense; he would fit well in Miami or in a role that needed a bucket or 2. I take him over AI or Wally based on production alone. The $$ it takes to sign Flip makes it sensible to bring him in.
Will he be back here? I haven't heard one way or the other. Apparently, we have our roster for anyone that can come in and contribute. I think it is a mistake; I would simply like to have Flip back for insurance, despite the major minutes that Crawford can log. I think he can still contribute here.

CViggity · Post #8 » by **CViggity** » Sun Aug 16, 2009 3:44 pm

He's about as good a defender as my grandmother though

johnny878 · Post #9 » by **johnny878** » Sun Aug 16, 2009 9:25 pm

CViggity wrote:He's about as good a defender as my grandmother though

lol he played respectable defense last year. much better than either bibby or joe johnson

shortstuff5023 · Post #10 » by **shortstuff5023** » Sun Aug 16, 2009 11:38 pm

he did lead the team in steals, didn't he?

evildallas · Post #11 » by **evildallas** » Mon Aug 17, 2009 2:41 am

johnny878 wrote:
CViggity wrote:He's about as good a defender as my grandmother though

lol he played respectable defense last year. much better than either bibby or joe johnson

I agree with the Bibby part. Flip played much better D under Woodson that at any other stop in his career. Joe's normally a much better defender, but he's been having more lapses of effort more often. Flip isn't a great defender, but he gave good effort on D for us.

td00 · Post #12 » by **td00** » Mon Aug 17, 2009 6:26 pm

I haven't heard a good enough reason yet not to bring him back. I think he contributes to our wins and was a key to last year.
I wouldn't have been sad had we decided to go with him over Bibby either. Are we gonna get our $$'s worth out of him? I hope so, but he is just as one-D as anyone.

raleigh · Post #13 » by **raleigh** » Mon Aug 17, 2009 6:58 pm

The reason to not bring him back is often called "Jeff Teague."

It's really that simple.

joeshmoe · Post #14 » by **joeshmoe** » Tue Aug 18, 2009 9:08 pm

mrhonline wrote:The reason to not bring him back is often called "Jeff Teague."

It's really that simple.

If Teague can't earn minutes w/ Flip here, he could always play in the D-league.

Also, I bet we could get Flip for the league minimum.