Tom Moore 2.0

radrmd216 · Post #1521 » by **radrmd216** » Mon Aug 17, 2009 4:35 am

Miller shot more shots than what most PG's shoot, but he shot more becuase that was what the Sixers needed. Miller is getting older, but I think his stay in Phiily showed that he is a good PG. He can run an offense and find the open man or he can pick up the slack scoring if the team doesn't have a lot of offensive options.

Miller and Iggy played very good in the Orlando series. Miller played good for the last few years, but it was his time to go because he isn't in the Sixers long term plans. Overall I think Miller was and is still a good becuase he can run an offense and adapt to different situations.

sweetlou23 · Post #1522 » by **sweetlou23** » Mon Aug 17, 2009 11:56 am

ankle420breaker wrote:
Dedicated_76ers_fan wrote:Should Andre Miller average around 18 shots a game? Yes or no? Do you accept Miller as a PG?

I'm sorry, but Iggy, Thad are two good guys you can pass the ball to, Sam's a guy for the occasional alley, jumper.

He shouldn't have to take 18 shots. That's 2nd tier caliber shots.

You obviously aren't going to look at the numbers yourself, so here they are for the series vs. Orlando.

Iguodala - 23.2ppg - 47%
Young - 11.4ppg - 40%
Miller - 22ppg - 51%
Williams - 9.4ppg - 40%

With Brand injured and limited talent around him, I had no problem with Miller taking 16.5 shots per game (not 18 as you keep saying, stop just picking numbers out of the sky), especially when he's converting at 51%. I sure hope his successor can get us to the playoffs, let alone produce as much as Miller did if/when he gets there.

the sixers have talent, but it needs to be developed. And the sixers put making the playoffs last year above talent development. I think miller definitely had some ball hog tendencies last year but thats how the sixers wanted him to play. I think that coaching was one of the main reasons we were not better offensively. we simply had no offensive scheme. if we weren't running we were playing one on one ball. other than the occasional back door cut or lob, the half court offense was stagnant. that not millers fault, that's the coach's fault for not having an offensive scheme. Miller got his, but when he was being aggressive as a scorer it did not translate into easy baskets for the sixers. miller did what was asked of him, help the team make the playoffs.

bigdavid · Post #1523 » by **bigdavid** » Mon Aug 17, 2009 4:29 pm

Dedicated_76ers_fan wrote:Andre Miller took 18 shots per game in the playoffs, only maybe once at his 12. He cost us the playoff series. If ANYONE should take 18 shots on that team, it's Iggy/Young. Not Miller.

Miller was a ball-hog, it's time to forget about him.

The only one who keeps bringing up Miller is you Dedicated. You never liked him and you have already made your point. Give it a rest.

tmoore · Post #1524 » by **tmoore** » Mon Aug 17, 2009 4:33 pm

Perhaps Miller's offensive contributions -- for his teammates and himself -- will be better appreciated by the end of November.

Post #1525 » by **tk76** » Mon Aug 17, 2009 5:13 pm

tmoore wrote:Perhaps Miller's offensive contributions -- for his teammates and himself -- will be better appreciated by the end of November.

Sounds like a painful lesson I would rather not watch. If this is the case its more an issue of the team electing to not replace Miller with a proven PG than anything else. Hopefully Lou and Jrue will surprise us.

sixerfan1976 · Post #1526 » by **sixerfan1976** » Mon Aug 17, 2009 5:13 pm

Tom,
Hear anything about the color guy with Zumoff? I havent heard anything since I last asked ya...other than Mad Dog under consideration.

Nothing much else going on.

Phillyboy · Post #1527 » by **Phillyboy** » Mon Aug 17, 2009 7:29 pm

tmoore wrote:Perhaps Miller's offensive contributions -- for his teammates and himself -- will be better appreciated by the end of November.

Well said, sir.

Andre Miller will not be remembered as a Sixer great that's true but he has made his contributions. He's relatively slow, shoots a flat shot and is not going to dazzle you BUT-

When we traded "what's his name" we all expected to enter a mini ice age and we did not. Why? Because of Andre Miller. Before the trade it was one guy dominating the ball while the rest of the team watched. Guys like Kyle Korver almost forgot what the basketball looked like.

But Miller changed that. He involved the rest of the players (especially the young boys) as a team for the first time in many years. If this team wins big someday with the young core they have you can thank Miller for the first few steps in the right direction.

I also didn't want him back (because i don't think he fits long term) but I won't look away from what he accomplished either.

Post #1528 » by **tk76** » Mon Aug 17, 2009 7:49 pm

Phillyboy wrote:
tmoore wrote:Perhaps Miller's offensive contributions -- for his teammates and himself -- will be better appreciated by the end of November.

Well said, sir.

Andre Miller will not be remembered as a Sixer great that's true but he has made his contributions. He's relatively slow, shoots a flat shot and is not going to dazzle you BUT-

When we traded "what's his name" we all expected to enter a mini ice age and we did not. Why? Because of Andre Miller.

Yeah. People forget the team had the worst record in the NBA at the time of the AI trade. They have essentially been a .500 team since. Ironically, it may have been BK's mistake not letting the team really bottom out, but that does not take away from Miller, and how much he did to keep this team comepetive.

ankle420breaker · Post #1529 » by **ankle420breaker** » Mon Aug 17, 2009 8:42 pm

Miller was the engine. I understand that his age was at odds with the direction this team is heading, so I can understand the parting of the ways, but I'm not going to belittle what he did while he was here. I hope I'm wrong, but I think those expecting his loss to be masked by the Princeton offense or the apparently imminent rise of Lou Williams, are in for a rude awakening.

phillyborn_jacksonite · Post #1530 » by **phillyborn_jacksonite** » Mon Aug 17, 2009 8:47 pm

i have moved on from Andre Miller, he plays in portland now.

Post #1531 » by **tk76** » Mon Aug 17, 2009 9:05 pm

ankle420breaker wrote: I hope I'm wrong, but I think those expecting his loss to be masked by the Princeton offense or the apparently imminent rise of Lou Williams, are in for a rude awakening.

Replacing a solid PG/scorer with an erratic one is a big loss, but there are other areas where the team might be improved. I think if Brand returns to some semblance of his former self and we see continued improvement by Iguodala, Young and Speights the team could end up being O.K.

sweetlou23 · Post #1532 » by **sweetlou23** » Mon Aug 17, 2009 9:25 pm

Phillyboy wrote:
tmoore wrote:Perhaps Miller's offensive contributions -- for his teammates and himself -- will be better appreciated by the end of November.

Well said, sir.

Andre Miller will not be remembered as a Sixer great that's true but he has made his contributions. He's relatively slow, shoots a flat shot and is not going to dazzle you BUT-

When we traded "what's his name" we all expected to enter a mini ice age and we did not. Why? Because of Andre Miller. Before the trade it was one guy dominating the ball while the rest of the team watched. Guys like Kyle Korver almost forgot what the basketball looked like.

But Miller changed that. He involved the rest of the players (especially the young boys) as a team for the first time in many years. If this team wins big someday with the young core they have you can thank Miller for the first few steps in the right direction.

I also didn't want him back (because i don't think he fits long term) but I won't look away from what he accomplished either.

tmoore · Post #1533 » by **tmoore** » Mon Aug 17, 2009 9:40 pm

sixerfan1976 wrote:Tom,
Hear anything about the color guy with Zumoff? I havent heard anything since I last asked ya...other than Mad Dog under consideration.

Nothing much else going on.

SF, I haven't heard anything. Asked someone employed by the team and he didn't know. Will try to contact somebody at CSN to see if I can find anything out.

Dedicated_76ers_fan · Post #1534 » by **Dedicated_76ers_fan** » Tue Aug 18, 2009 7:22 am

For every pass Andre Miller makes, he shoots a shot. This may have been needed in 06 and 07. But when we got Brand last year and Thaddeus Young showed his strides as a 15 PPG scorer(And a 20 PPG scorer in March/April). It was time for Miller to take a back-seat. It was time for him to pass first, maybe pass 2nd. Shoot when you need to.

Miller did not do this, remember when we were complaining last April about Young not getting touches down low in the post? Guess who was taking those shots? Andre Miller(to the tune of 18 FGA) And Willie Freaking Green!

Could Miller do some of those things in Instances? Yes, but never for a game. When Andre Miller did decide to make plays for himself and his team, we won. Plain and simple. When Miller hit 7 AST
against Orlando, we won that game. Almost won the other one.

One post I remember a few weeks back, a Sixer fan asked if you'd take this yr Miller or Kidd. Kidd, by a LONG shot. Never mind his developing a 3pt shot(Had he done so earlier, he'd be an Magic Johnson level PG). But Kidd orchestrated the Mavs running attack, he passed first, second and even sometimes a 3rd time. He averaged 8.7 APG last year, just 0.5 short of his career average of 9.2 per game.

Kidd played like an all-star PG last year. Miller had the passing ability, but never the desire to make those plays. He had Carmelo, and J.R and what else? What was the point of the Iverson trade(Den)

To pair a legitimate 2nd option to Allen Iverson. It worked, they won 100 games together. It failed, because the supporting cast wasn't there defensively.

A.I is not Michael Vick, he's not a criminal or even a basketball cancer. A.I' is like Jamie Moyer, he still got it. Not like he used to, but he still got it. If A.I were to go on a team where he can successfully log 25-28 minutes a night? He'll sign that dotted line.

He even said he would accept a 1 yr deal. Stefanski: There's no sixth man better in basketball then Iverson.

steveb21 · Post #1535 » by **steveb21** » Tue Aug 18, 2009 1:37 pm

He even said he would accept a 1 yr deal. Stefanski: There's no sixth man better in basketball then Iverson.

That's part of the problem. AI has repeatedly said that he would retire before he comes off the bench. Sound like a team player to you?

I think that if Stefanski thought AI would be a fit here then he would've made him an offer already. Bottom line is he's not a fit here...let's move on already.

83SixersRocked · Post #1536 » by **83SixersRocked** » Tue Aug 18, 2009 2:29 pm

Bottom line is he's not a fit here...let's move on already.

Nor is Miller - we're beating a pair of dead horses. As for Magic, IMHO he's the best to ever play the game. But thats a discussion we've had that could dominate another thread.

ankle420breaker · Post #1537 » by **ankle420breaker** » Tue Aug 18, 2009 3:56 pm

Only Dedicated could flip an Andre Miller conversation to Kidd being Magic Johnson into Iverson being our 6th man... in one post.

I also love the argument for Miller shooting too much, while at the same time advocating an Iverson return.

Phillyboy · Post #1538 » by **Phillyboy** » Tue Aug 18, 2009 8:44 pm

Not to worry. Uncle Ed will never allow that "little darling' to ever come back.

God bless Uncle Ed for that.

tmoore · Post #1539 » by **tmoore** » Tue Aug 18, 2009 9:18 pm

Hear the Sixers may go to camp with 17 players, though none of the 2-3 wing players competing for what could be the 13th spot have been finalized. Christmas' non-guaranteed invitation stands, though he could go to Europe or to another camp.

Lapinski · Post #1540 » by **Lapinski** » Wed Aug 19, 2009 12:46 am

tmoore wrote:Hear the Sixers may go to camp with 17 players, though none of the 2-3 wing players competing for what could be the 13th spot have been finalized. Christmas' non-guaranteed invitation stands, though he could go to Europe or to another camp.

Any word or speculation on who those players might be?