Western Conference Offseason: Winner and Losers
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Western Conference Offseason: Winner and Losers
- RickyRubio
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Western Conference Offseason: Winner and Losers
full article: http://www.hogtownraptors.blogspot.com/
I´ve already talked about the winners and losers that the Eastern Conference has to offer, but what about the West? The Western Conference has been much more competitive than the East for the last couple of years and each year they try to get even better, but teams in the West shouldn´t get too cocky as teams in the East probably won´t make a playoffs with a record like 38-44 anymore. No more easy wins in Eastern Conference trips for the West. Let´s take a look now who has re-enforced their team enough and who just had somebody like Babcock working for them (Timberwolves).
I´ve already talked about the winners and losers that the Eastern Conference has to offer, but what about the West? The Western Conference has been much more competitive than the East for the last couple of years and each year they try to get even better, but teams in the West shouldn´t get too cocky as teams in the East probably won´t make a playoffs with a record like 38-44 anymore. No more easy wins in Eastern Conference trips for the West. Let´s take a look now who has re-enforced their team enough and who just had somebody like Babcock working for them (Timberwolves).
Ricky Rubio is a Raptor!
Re: Western Conference Offseason: Winner and Losers
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Re: Western Conference Offseason: Winner and Losers
The Hornets arent winners this offseason, Chandler and paul were perfect with eachother and Okafor doesnt have **** for an offensive game
Re: Western Conference Offseason: Winner and Losers
- d-will8
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Re: Western Conference Offseason: Winner and Losers
Okafor has a hell of a lot more offensive game than Chandler. He may not be quite as good of a target for alley-oops and I don't think the Hornets drastically improved by making the trade, but still. Chandler was essentially worthless on offense before he hooked up with CP3.
Re: Western Conference Offseason: Winner and Losers
- HammerDunk
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Re: Western Conference Offseason: Winner and Losers
Somehow I don't see how the Lakers dumping a great talent and a guy that WON THEM PLAYOFF GAMES for an aging guy that is a nut case and overrated offensively as being winners. Ariza won them some big playoff games, plain and simple. I don't see the same coming from Artest...

Word is, South Beach is ecstatic that they
won't be seeing Millsaps talents again this season...
Re: Western Conference Offseason: Winner and Losers
- nghedman
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Re: Western Conference Offseason: Winner and Losers
I was beginning to wonder if there were a lot of NBA idiots out there. The Jazz did (have done) very well this off season but many preditions seem to say otherwise. wierd. But this is nice to know this author has done his homework on every team... and not just listened to others who haven't.
Jazz are better anyway you look at it right NOW. If Boozer slacks he has lost his paycheck next year big time.
Jazz are better anyway you look at it right NOW. If Boozer slacks he has lost his paycheck next year big time.
Go ReAL!
Re: Western Conference Offseason: Winner and Losers
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Re: Western Conference Offseason: Winner and Losers
Yes we have done very well: overpaid for an aging one-dimensional center, overpaid for a backup PF, alienated a starting PF, signed a bckup PG who wasn't good enough to play for us most of the year, and signed our first round draft choice.
Re: Western Conference Offseason: Winner and Losers
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Re: Western Conference Offseason: Winner and Losers
The Jazz should get a "DNP" designation for this offseason, since the front office did exactly zero to improve the team.
--J-Dub--
Re: Western Conference Offseason: Winner and Losers
- tylero87
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Re: Western Conference Offseason: Winner and Losers
JDubJazz wrote:The Jazz should get a "DNP" designation for this offseason, since the front office did exactly zero to improve the team.
Name one thing the Jazz could have done to make the team better. I'm tired of all this negativity coming from everyone on this board. The Jazz matched Paul Millsap..which makes the Jazz better. We brought back a PG (Price) who knows the system..which makes the Jazz better. We have another year of development from our wings with Brewer and Miles...which makes the Jazz better. Also the Jazz did not over pay for Okur, having a starting "all-star" center for 8-9 million a year is a BARGAIN.
There weren't really a lot of moves the Jazz could have made. I mean we could have blown up the roster, not signed Millsap, and traded Boozer for garbage. We'd be a mediocre west team doing the same thing Phoenix is doing, which is throwing in the towel.
You guys bitch now, but when the Jazz are healthy they are a top team....period. As it stands right now I would put the Jazz behind only the Spurs and Lakers. They are ahead of Denver because of their depth, and ahead of Portland because of their continuity and experience.
Have faith Jazz fans........

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Re: Western Conference Offseason: Winner and Losers
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Re: Western Conference Offseason: Winner and Losers
tylero87 wrote:JDubJazz wrote:The Jazz should get a "DNP" designation for this offseason, since the front office did exactly zero to improve the team.
Name one thing the Jazz could have done to make the team better. I'm tired of all this negativity coming from everyone on this board. The Jazz matched Paul Millsap..which makes the Jazz better. We brought back a PG (Price) who knows the system..which makes the Jazz better. We have another year of development from our wings with Brewer and Miles...which makes the Jazz better. Also the Jazz did not over pay for Okur, having a starting "all-star" center for 8-9 million a year is a BARGAIN.
There weren't really a lot of moves the Jazz could have made. I mean we could have blown up the roster, not signed Millsap, and traded Boozer for garbage. We'd be a mediocre west team doing the same thing Phoenix is doing, which is throwing in the towel.
You guys bitch now, but when the Jazz are healthy they are a top team....period. As it stands right now I would put the Jazz behind only the Spurs and Lakers. They are ahead of Denver because of their depth, and ahead of Portland because of their continuity and experience.
Have faith Jazz fans........
Keep on drinking that Jazz flavored kool-aid.
--J-Dub--
Re: Western Conference Offseason: Winner and Losers
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Re: Western Conference Offseason: Winner and Losers
Wishing that we have become a better team does not make it so. Other teams have made marked improvment while we are the same as last year. Portland has more talented young players, why won't they improve more than us. We are at least one notch if not two below Western conference contention. I would love for us to win as much as the next guy, but that doesn't mean it is going to happen. Dreams and wishes only count before the first game is played, then reality sets in.
Re: Western Conference Offseason: Winner and Losers
- HammerDunk
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Re: Western Conference Offseason: Winner and Losers
The only wish I have is that the team stay healthy this year. I know, it probably won't happen, but I think this team would be much better if they didn't have to deal with such big injuries. It's extremely wishful thinking, but if we could have an injury free season for the last year of Boozer's contract, things might be much better than you guys think.
Then again, injury free and Boozer don't mix...
Then again, injury free and Boozer don't mix...

Word is, South Beach is ecstatic that they
won't be seeing Millsaps talents again this season...
Re: Western Conference Offseason: Winner and Losers
- nghedman
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Re: Western Conference Offseason: Winner and Losers
JDubJazz wrote:tylero87 wrote:JDubJazz wrote:
Keep on drinking that Jazz flavored kool-aid.
I wish there was some more to drink because I would drink it but no one is serving this drink except me. Let me explain and maybe you will jump on my bandwagon because I'm driving fast but I will go slow for you that need it.
The Jazz had the most injuries to their starting five than any other team in the NBA last year. And they were six games out of 2nd place in the Western Conference Playoffs. I can say with full confidence that if the Jazz's starting five were only half as healthy last year they would have won at LEAST six more games and would have been seeded easily as 2nd seed (that would mean they were better than both the Nuggets and the Blazers).
Another subject: Milsap being over paid?!? He is the best back up PF by far in the NBA . Find another back up and point him out to me that is better than Milsap. It just aint there. And Milsap could easily start for half the NBA teams. With that said, 6-7 million is over paying a PF!?! Nawww, that is one of the biggest bargins in the NBA for a starting caliber PF.
Also they kept Korver (he opted in)
So on top of all that (injuries etc) the Jazz are young like the Blazers so ya, they are better than the Blazers. Stop drinking whatever it is in your cup if it aint the Kool aid what is it?

I'm with tylero87. Have faith (but remember the facts of last year). Jazz can be tons better than last year as long as they keep their team together (and they have!).
Go ReAL!
Re: Western Conference Offseason: Winner and Losers
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Re: Western Conference Offseason: Winner and Losers
A quick tally to support the pessimists:
1. Williams will be worse because he'll be healthier and somehow stupider: check.
2. Boozer will be injured for half the season because it's a contract year: check.
3. Millsap will be worse because he now has his contract, and his character has constantly been in question since he arrived: check.
4. Brewer will continue his downward spiral as a fourth-year bust: check.
5. Memo's 3-pt percentage will continue it's downward trend since he arrived in Utah: check.
6. Koufos is set to disappear with a depleted body and a horrible attitude: check.
7. Miles looks the most pathetic he has in years: check.
8. Korver's wrist should be 100% worse than last year: check.
9. Brevin Knight is still on board: check.
10. The Jazz' schedule is horrendous this year with 30 back-to-back games: check.
11. The Jazz have the least amount of depth in the conference: check.
This season is just sitting there waiting to suck. The Jazz will be fighting for 8th place all year. The only reason I'm still here is so that I can stick it to everyone who likes and respects Jerry Sloan by blaming him when LA wins again this year.
1. Williams will be worse because he'll be healthier and somehow stupider: check.
2. Boozer will be injured for half the season because it's a contract year: check.
3. Millsap will be worse because he now has his contract, and his character has constantly been in question since he arrived: check.
4. Brewer will continue his downward spiral as a fourth-year bust: check.
5. Memo's 3-pt percentage will continue it's downward trend since he arrived in Utah: check.
6. Koufos is set to disappear with a depleted body and a horrible attitude: check.
7. Miles looks the most pathetic he has in years: check.
8. Korver's wrist should be 100% worse than last year: check.
9. Brevin Knight is still on board: check.
10. The Jazz' schedule is horrendous this year with 30 back-to-back games: check.
11. The Jazz have the least amount of depth in the conference: check.
This season is just sitting there waiting to suck. The Jazz will be fighting for 8th place all year. The only reason I'm still here is so that I can stick it to everyone who likes and respects Jerry Sloan by blaming him when LA wins again this year.
sipclip - "Even though I love what I have seen from Mitchell if you were to ask anyone if they would rather have Booker and the 24th pick or Mitchell they would all take Booker and the pick."
Re: Western Conference Offseason: Winner and Losers
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Re: Western Conference Offseason: Winner and Losers
I wish there was some more to drink because I would drink it but no one is serving this drink except me. Let me explain and maybe you will jump on my bandwagon because I'm driving fast but I will go slow for you that need it.
The Jazz had the most injuries to their starting five than any other team in the NBA last year. And they were six games out of 2nd place in the Western Conference Playoffs. I can say with full confidence that if the Jazz's starting five were only half as healthy last year they would have won at LEAST six more games and would have been seeded easily as 2nd seed (that would mean they were better than both the Nuggets and the Blazers).
Another subject: Milsap being over paid?!? He is the best back up PF by far in the NBA . Find another back up and point him out to me that is better than Milsap. It just aint there. And Milsap could easily start for half the NBA teams. With that said, 6-7 million is over paying a PF!?! Nawww, that is one of the biggest bargins in the NBA for a starting caliber PF.
Also they kept Korver (he opted in)
So on top of all that (injuries etc) the Jazz are young like the Blazers so ya, they are better than the Blazers. Stop drinking whatever it is in your cup if it aint the Kool aid what is it?![]()
I'm with tylero87. Have faith (but remember the facts of last year). Jazz can be tons better than last year as long as they keep their team together (and they have!).
A healthy Jazz team went 8-15 to close the season. It was painfully obvious to everyone that the locker room was screwed up, and thats just supposed to have magically gotten better over the course of a summer where your #1 scoring option just went on a non-free agent tour?
Millsap absolutely is overpaid. On a championship caliber team, he is, at best, A BACKUP. Paying backup players at starter money is always a bad idea. Millsap is not a starting caliber PF. He's too short and has no offensive game.
You may be driving fast, bust you might want to consider that after drinking all that Jazz kool-aid, you might just be driving drunk, too.
--J-Dub--
Re: Western Conference Offseason: Winner and Losers
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Re: Western Conference Offseason: Winner and Losers
Today's NBA is meant for good jump-shooting teams. Take a look at the Laker's squad... Bynum aside, any other guy can make jump shots at a more than adequate rate, and several of them can make the clutch shot, making it very hard to stop their offense, so taking a huge physical toll for defenses to compete (moreover...they have that guy Bryant who's just the most unstoppable dude playing basketball on panet Earth...). You can say almost the same thing for the Pistons championship
team, or Spurs', or Celtics'... they had or have a bunch of good shooters...
Now take a look at the Jazz and you can see the situation is long ways from there. Williams, Korver, Okur and (may be) Miles aside, rival defenses can afford to pack against any other player; just remember Kirilenko and Brewer's defenders being several feet away from them. Then take into account Williams' the guy with the most pressure on Jazz O, so he's not primarily a shooter guy, and Okur is the guy usually rivals let a little bit open on the perimeter (mainly in the early part of Jazz posessions) because that scheme allows defenses to pack their big fella helping to contain Jazz PF, so Okur use to be a little bit open by D rivals design. That left Korver as the only wing to be consistently chased. This tale is not a matter of opinion, as we have all watched this stuff repeating itself night in night out!
Now, with that said, the first question on improvements should be: ¿did the Jazz bettered themselves as far as a shooting team? The answer is no. Did the Jazz address the issue of rivals packing? The answer is not.
Now see the D side. Why good teams use to torch us? Because they have all the options open. Remember the Schrempf "triple threat" commercial some years ago? That's exactly what Jazz perimeter defenders face every minute of every game. The guy with the basketball knows he can shoot, he can drive or he can pass, because Jazzmen lacks D attributes (and sorry but NO, HELP DEFENSE CANNOT SUBSTITUTE ON BALL DEFENSE OR ONE ON ONE DEFENSE... HELP DEFENSE IS JUST A PATCH OR A COMPLEMENT) So, can the Jazz suddenly go wild on D? No, they can't and they just won't.
All Jazz hopes for next season lies, right now, on:
- Health
- Maynor contributing as a real backup PG
- Koufos developement as a big PF
- Fesenko developement as a real NBA backup center
- CJ Miles bettered shooting touch
Can we consider the team has improved? No. Just a fact. No judgment intended against Jazz FO. This offseason the players (mainly Boozer) had all the cards.
Anyway, the only way to get really better is by the draft (a la Portland) or by money when Kirilenko and Boozer contracts finally get unloaded).
team, or Spurs', or Celtics'... they had or have a bunch of good shooters...
Now take a look at the Jazz and you can see the situation is long ways from there. Williams, Korver, Okur and (may be) Miles aside, rival defenses can afford to pack against any other player; just remember Kirilenko and Brewer's defenders being several feet away from them. Then take into account Williams' the guy with the most pressure on Jazz O, so he's not primarily a shooter guy, and Okur is the guy usually rivals let a little bit open on the perimeter (mainly in the early part of Jazz posessions) because that scheme allows defenses to pack their big fella helping to contain Jazz PF, so Okur use to be a little bit open by D rivals design. That left Korver as the only wing to be consistently chased. This tale is not a matter of opinion, as we have all watched this stuff repeating itself night in night out!
Now, with that said, the first question on improvements should be: ¿did the Jazz bettered themselves as far as a shooting team? The answer is no. Did the Jazz address the issue of rivals packing? The answer is not.
Now see the D side. Why good teams use to torch us? Because they have all the options open. Remember the Schrempf "triple threat" commercial some years ago? That's exactly what Jazz perimeter defenders face every minute of every game. The guy with the basketball knows he can shoot, he can drive or he can pass, because Jazzmen lacks D attributes (and sorry but NO, HELP DEFENSE CANNOT SUBSTITUTE ON BALL DEFENSE OR ONE ON ONE DEFENSE... HELP DEFENSE IS JUST A PATCH OR A COMPLEMENT) So, can the Jazz suddenly go wild on D? No, they can't and they just won't.
All Jazz hopes for next season lies, right now, on:
- Health
- Maynor contributing as a real backup PG
- Koufos developement as a big PF
- Fesenko developement as a real NBA backup center
- CJ Miles bettered shooting touch
Can we consider the team has improved? No. Just a fact. No judgment intended against Jazz FO. This offseason the players (mainly Boozer) had all the cards.
Anyway, the only way to get really better is by the draft (a la Portland) or by money when Kirilenko and Boozer contracts finally get unloaded).
Re: Western Conference Offseason: Winner and Losers
- nghedman
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Re: Western Conference Offseason: Winner and Losers
Paper Face wrote:A quick tally to support the pessimists:
1. Williams will be worse because he'll be healthier and somehow stupider: check.
2. Boozer will be injured for half the season because it's a contract year: check.
3. Millsap will be worse because he now has his contract, and his character has constantly been in question since he arrived: check.
4. Brewer will continue his downward spiral as a fourth-year bust: check.
5. Memo's 3-pt percentage will continue it's downward trend since he arrived in Utah: check.
6. Koufos is set to disappear with a depleted body and a horrible attitude: check.
7. Miles looks the most pathetic he has in years: check.
8. Korver's wrist should be 100% worse than last year: check.
9. Brevin Knight is still on board: check.
10. The Jazz' schedule is horrendous this year with 30 back-to-back games: check.
11. The Jazz have the least amount of depth in the conference: check.
This season is just sitting there waiting to suck. The Jazz will be fighting for 8th place all year. The only reason I'm still here is so that I can stick it to everyone who likes and respects Jerry Sloan by blaming him when LA wins again this year.



All this talk about defense, and help defense. Okur is NOT a help defender. Only one guy onthe Jazz is a help defender and we all know that is kirilenko. Okur can post up defend the best of them. Don't sell him short. I could site many situtations against Shaq, Duncan, Howard etc. Okur gets the bad rap because he doens't know how to sag off and help defend, But he does great in the middle , only those drinking the kool-aid (or something else) thinks the Jazz need a big man defender in the middle.
Go ReAL!
Re: Western Conference Offseason: Winner and Losers
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Re: Western Conference Offseason: Winner and Losers
I don't think the Jazz need a big man defender in the middle. I do think they need an intimidating presence there in clutch spurts (Fesenko can be such a thing... if he finally put his mind together)
Re: Western Conference Offseason: Winner and Losers
- d-will8
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Re: Western Conference Offseason: Winner and Losers
JDubJazz wrote:I wish there was some more to drink because I would drink it but no one is serving this drink except me. Let me explain and maybe you will jump on my bandwagon because I'm driving fast but I will go slow for you that need it.
The Jazz had the most injuries to their starting five than any other team in the NBA last year. And they were six games out of 2nd place in the Western Conference Playoffs. I can say with full confidence that if the Jazz's starting five were only half as healthy last year they would have won at LEAST six more games and would have been seeded easily as 2nd seed (that would mean they were better than both the Nuggets and the Blazers).
Another subject: Milsap being over paid?!? He is the best back up PF by far in the NBA . Find another back up and point him out to me that is better than Milsap. It just aint there. And Milsap could easily start for half the NBA teams. With that said, 6-7 million is over paying a PF!?! Nawww, that is one of the biggest bargins in the NBA for a starting caliber PF.
Also they kept Korver (he opted in)
So on top of all that (injuries etc) the Jazz are young like the Blazers so ya, they are better than the Blazers. Stop drinking whatever it is in your cup if it aint the Kool aid what is it?![]()
I'm with tylero87. Have faith (but remember the facts of last year). Jazz can be tons better than last year as long as they keep their team together (and they have!).
A healthy Jazz team went 8-15 to close the season. It was painfully obvious to everyone that the locker room was screwed up, and thats just supposed to have magically gotten better over the course of a summer where your #1 scoring option just went on a non-free agent tour?
Millsap absolutely is overpaid. On a championship caliber team, he is, at best, A BACKUP. Paying backup players at starter money is always a bad idea. Millsap is not a starting caliber PF. He's too short and has no offensive game.
You may be driving fast, bust you might want to consider that after drinking all that Jazz kool-aid, you might just be driving drunk, too.
I totally agree that the lockerroom dynamics were probably somewhat messed up towards the end of last season and that Boozer could quite easily be a disruptive factor if he is a member of the team this year.
On the other hand, I disagree with your assesment of Millsap. It is true that he is ideally suited to be a backup big on a championship, or a much, much better version of Malik Rose. However, that does not mean that he can't be a starting PF or that he's irrefutably overpaid. He put up great numbers as a starter and while he's not and may never be a go-to caliber offensive player he certainly has some game on that end. That is, unless solid footwork in the post, great finishing ability, an improving mid-range J and the ability to put the ball on the floor don't qualify as components of offensive "game." It's not like he won't improve there, either.
He's undeniably a little bit on the short side, but so is Udonis Haslem, who, I probably don't need to tell you, was the starting PF for the Heat when they won the 'ship. Then there's Brandon Bass, who will more than likely be the starting PF for the Magic, who, I think most people would agree are a championship caliber team, whether or not they actually win the thing. Granted, those teams had/have a dominant center, which the Jazz don't, but that Millsap could quite conceivably be the starting PF on a championship caliber team naturally follows from the fact that he is essentially a rich man's version of guys like that.
We would all love to have a seven footer with elite offensive skills manning the four, but there are only about 4 of those in the entire league, so I'll settle for a highly effective and hard working, if undersized, guy who recorded 19 double-doubles in a row at one point and is only going to get better. If the Cavs are going to be paying Anderson Varajeo (a true example of a 4 with no offensive game) 50 million dollars over 6 years, I feel pretty good about paying Millsap the money we will be, but that's just me.
Re: Western Conference Offseason: Winner and Losers
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Re: Western Conference Offseason: Winner and Losers
JDubJazz wrote:A healthy Jazz team went 8-15 to close the season.
That's pretty funny. Only the most sardonic of comedians would deem Boozer playing himself back into shape and screwing up the team's chemistry "healthy", so bravo.
sipclip - "Even though I love what I have seen from Mitchell if you were to ask anyone if they would rather have Booker and the 24th pick or Mitchell they would all take Booker and the pick."
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Whats even more funny is someone trying to claim that Boozer returning after what has happened this off-season, forcing everything he does purely to drive up his numbers, will NOT screw up the chemistry even more than "playing himself into shape" supposedly did.
Good one.
Good one.
ColdBlue wrote:I think NJN should go to the cave and whip up a Sloan + NJN + anal lube = Championship sig.