OT - Aaron Rodgers, elite QB

Post #1 » by **ReasonablySober** » Tue Aug 18, 2009 7:47 pm

Great read.

LUKE23 · Post #2 » by **LUKE23** » Tue Aug 18, 2009 7:51 pm

The man.

Fandom · Post #3 » by **Fandom** » Tue Aug 18, 2009 7:58 pm

Good stuff.

Excitement continues to brew!

El Duderino · Post #4 » by **El Duderino** » Tue Aug 18, 2009 8:05 pm

Thompson has made a number of mistakes as GM, but the incredible importance of drafting Rodgers can't be understated.

One only needs to look at many franchises around the NFL and how long they've gone in having a top quarterback. For the Packer to have a roughly 15 year run with a HOF QB in Favre and then slide right into having Rodgers is pretty amazing.

There aren't many players in the NFL that i'd trade Rodgers for

Post #5 » by **MickeyDavis** » Tue Aug 18, 2009 8:20 pm

Absolutely. I had my doubts given the track record of Tedford QB's but he definitely showed he can play and he should keep getting better. And given the other weapons we have on offense this year we should be scoring a ton of points.

El Duderino · Post #6 » by **El Duderino** » Tue Aug 18, 2009 8:26 pm

To show that importance, just imagine instead that the QB's in camp were only Brohm, Flynn, and some nothing special veteran. I'd have no high hopes for the season, but with Rogers in place, i'm confident that in most years, at worst we should be able to compete for a division title. That's what having a quality QB does for an NFL franchise.

Newz · Post #7 » by **Newz** » Tue Aug 18, 2009 8:29 pm

I wouldn't say that he is 'elite' yet after just one season. I think he is top 10 though and I certainly think he could be every bit as good as Drew Brees, if not better... Though I doubt he can get to the Mannings/Brady levels, but who knows.

Favorite player in the NFL right now, by far.

Sky High · Post #8 » by **Sky High** » Tue Aug 18, 2009 8:55 pm

I feel like an idiot for not purchasing a Rodgers jersey yet.

I really like this guy and I can't wait for this season. So much to be excited about.

SpReEfOrAlL · Post #9 » by **SpReEfOrAlL** » Tue Aug 18, 2009 11:17 pm

I like Rodgers as well. I was skeptical, i wont lie. About his injuries mainly. But i hoped for the best. And got just that.

mbucks22 · Post #10 » by **mbucks22** » Wed Aug 19, 2009 3:19 am

LukePliska wrote:I wouldn't say that he is 'elite' yet after just one season. I think he is top 10 though and I certainly think he could be every bit as good as Drew Brees, if not better... Though I doubt he can get to the Mannings/Brady levels, but who knows.

Favorite player in the NFL right now, by far.

As Harris was quoted as saying in that article, maybe once Rodgers wins a Super Bowl, he'll get the kind of recognition that Manning/Brady get. He's very quickly approaching that talent level though. He should be in the MVP race this season IMO.

Siefer · Post #11 » by **Siefer** » Wed Aug 19, 2009 3:41 am

He's easily become one of my favorite players in the league. How he's handled the Favre soap opera, the locker room, and developed his game are all truly remarkable. If he stays reasonably healthy, we're in an amazing spot as a franchise, for another 6-8 years at least.

Edit: typo

Newz · Post #12 » by **Newz** » Wed Aug 19, 2009 4:25 pm

mbucks22 wrote:
LukePliska wrote:I wouldn't say that he is 'elite' yet after just one season. I think he is top 10 though and I certainly think he could be every bit as good as Drew Brees, if not better... Though I doubt he can get to the Mannings/Brady levels, but who knows.

Favorite player in the NFL right now, by far.

As Harris was quoted as saying in that article, maybe once Rodgers wins a Super Bowl, he'll get the kind of recognition that Manning/Brady get. He's very quickly approaching that talent level though. He should be in the MVP race this season IMO.

More like once he has a winning record or leads a team to the playoffs... Or even wins a playoff game for that matter.

To be considered elite, you have to win something... It's like that in any sport.

I think A-Rod has a chance to be great. But to be considered as good as Brees he has to get to the playoffs and continue to perform... To be considered as good as Manning/Brady he has to increase his level of play as well as win a Super Bowl.

That's just how it is.

El Duderino · Post #13 » by **El Duderino** » Wed Aug 19, 2009 7:38 pm

I don't know that he'd have to win a Super Bowl given that a number of very good NFL quarterbacks never won a ring while scrubs like Dilfer have a ring.

Newz · Post #14 » by **Newz** » Wed Aug 19, 2009 7:40 pm

El Duderino wrote:I don't know that he'd have to win a Super Bowl given that a number of very good NFL quarterbacks never won a ring while scrubs like Dilfer have a ring.

What would he have to do to be considered as good as Brady/Manning without winning a Super Bowl ring?

He would have to break so many single season and career records that it would be ridiculous.

I like Rodgers, I think he is a top 10 QB that could easily be top 5 and eventually top 3... But to say he can be as good as those two without winning a Super Bowl is a reach, to say the least.

El Duderino · Post #15 » by **El Duderino** » Wed Aug 19, 2009 8:00 pm

When i saw you say Manning, Eli came to my head and not Peyton. I'd rather have Aaron than Eli Manning. While i like Rodgers a lot, i'm not holding out any hope that he's ever a Brady or Peyton Manning.

Post #16 » by **ReasonablySober** » Wed Aug 19, 2009 8:06 pm

Saying that in order for Rodgers to be as good as Brady or Manning he needs to win a Super Bowl inherently means that a Super Bowl victory rests on the shoulders of your QB. The fact is football is a team sport an you can win a title without a great QB. Brad Johnson, Trent Dilfer, etc. Does it help to have an elite QB? Absolutely. But Peyton Manning, maybe the greatest ever, has only won one. John Elway couldn't in the years he was dominating the league and needed a 2000 rusher in Terrell Davis to get a ring. Eli Manning had a 77 QB rating in the year the Giants won it all.

You could say that in order for Rodgers to be as successful as Brady or Manning he needs to win a Superbowl or two.

But in terms of ability or talent or skill...winning a Super Bowl really means nothing. So when Harris says this,

“I think he’s an elite quarterback right now,” said Packers cornerback Al Harris(notes). “He can make every single throw. He can put it on a line. He’s got touch. His decision making is good. He’s quick. He goes through his progressions really quickly. I think he’s very underrated by the people in the league and the so-called experts. Once he wins a Super Bowl, I guess that’s maybe what changes that perception.”

he's correct. Maybe Rodgers does have all the tools and he shows it this season with an MVP caliber performance. Maybe the Packers do win a Super Bowl. That will change the perception, which we both know doesn't always equal reality.

Ayt · Post #17 » by **Ayt** » Wed Aug 19, 2009 8:10 pm

LukePliska wrote:
El Duderino wrote:I don't know that he'd have to win a Super Bowl given that a number of very good NFL quarterbacks never won a ring while scrubs like Dilfer have a ring.

What would he have to do to be considered as good as Brady/Manning without winning a Super Bowl ring?

He would have to break so many single season and career records that it would be ridiculous.

I like Rodgers, I think he is a top 10 QB that could easily be top 5 and eventually top 3... But to say he can be as good as those two without winning a Super Bowl is a reach, to say the least.

I thought Manning was best QB I'd ever seen before he won his ring at age 30. Marino never won a ring. He was an elite player.

Team success is definitely important, but I disagree with the idea that you need to win a SB to be truly elite.

Edit: What DB said.

Post #18 » by **ReasonablySober** » Wed Aug 19, 2009 8:14 pm

LT has never played in a Super Bowl and hasn't exactly had the greatest track record in the playoffs. But for a 6 year stretch he was the NFL's best runningback. You can't tell me he wasn't (isn't?) elite.

Ayt · Post #19 » by **Ayt** » Wed Aug 19, 2009 8:24 pm

Reggie is one of the best defensive players in history and he didn't win a ring until he was 35 when he had the best offense in football led by a back to back MVP winner on the other side of the ball. Likewise, as good as Favre was, he only won one ring and had Reggie and the #1 defense in the league on the other side of the field.

Newz · Post #20 » by **Newz** » Wed Aug 19, 2009 8:29 pm

DrugBust wrote:LT has never played in a Super Bowl and hasn't exactly had the greatest track record in the playoffs. But for a 6 year stretch he was the NFL's best runningback. You can't tell me he wasn't (isn't?) elite.

Running back and defensive end are COMPLETELY different positions than QB. (Regarding the post on Reggie White as well as this one)

I didn't say that he had to win the Super Bowl to be elite, I said he had to win it if he wanted to be considered as good as Brady/Manning... I said he had to get into the playoffs and continue to produce at a high level if he wants to be considered as good as a guy like Drew Brees.

To say he is elite (and this is coming from someone who thinks Rodgers is already very good) is absolutely foolish before he even takes a team to the playoffs or has a .500 record for that matter.

Super Bowls obviously don't mean everything. I'd rather have Rodgers than several guys who have won the Super Bowl... But when you compare players that are on similar skill levels (like comparing Tom Brady and Peyton Manning with a guy like Favre) you are ultimately going to look at how much they won paired with statistics.

You guys can continue to say he is elite, that he is in the same company as Brady, Manning and Brees... And he very well could get there, I think he is talented enough and I believe he could be mentioned with those guys soon... But saying that he is on that level right now, after one season of starting on a 6-10 team, is just stupidity.