Sessions Update:Ramon signs T-Wolves OS (page 310 update)

midranger · Post #4241 » by **midranger** » Sun Aug 30, 2009 12:13 am

aboveAverage wrote:For those who want to pretend to know about Spinoza, here's the wikipedia link:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spinoza

Notice that "humble lens grinder" and "turning down rewards in life" appears in the first paragraph. You guys could have at least copied something from deeper in the article.

Busted out.

Time to go back to the cave Sigra.

Sigra · Post #4242 » by **Sigra** » Sun Aug 30, 2009 11:13 am

midranger wrote:

Busted out.

Time to go back to the cave Sigra.

I used lines from Wikipedia because my english is not that great so I decided to use words from there. But that doesn't mean that I don't read Spinoza. Here is me with some of my books:

Those same books in close:

Spinoza's Ethics:

Ethics opened:

Cave yes indeed. But I have some books in my cave :wink:

Sigra · Post #4243 » by **Sigra** » Sun Aug 30, 2009 11:21 am

Nebula1 wrote:How do you know Ramon wants more than anybody wants to offer?

Pure logic, Spinoza style. If Ramon is happy with offers he would already be signed. It is rather clear that he wants more than what any team is ready to offer.

Wise1 · Post #4244 » by **Wise1** » Sun Aug 30, 2009 12:29 pm

Hey Sigra, where's the Bible? That's all you guys need! :pray:

unklchuk · Post #4245 » by **unklchuk** » Sun Aug 30, 2009 1:41 pm

Someday some writer will capture the relationship between a dedication to Spinoza and the dedication to NBA hoops. In the same cranium. Then we'll all be "busted."

(Do the other teams' forums wander as far afield as this one?)

Post #4246 » by **MickeyDavis** » Sun Aug 30, 2009 2:07 pm

The reason this thread has wandered all over the place is because there has been ZERO news on Sessions all summer. Nothing, zilch, zip, nada. There have been a few rumors on various blogs/columns/tweets and that's it. Various "insiders" have gone back and forth and contradicted themselves over and over. That's why we have just one Sessions thread instead of 52. We'll keep the wandering in one place.

Post #4247 » by **paulpressey25** » Sun Aug 30, 2009 4:17 pm

This thread reminds me of the old ESPN board days. Where they didn't have "threads" just a succession of posts and you flowed with the conversation.

Love the photos Ilhan. You and your wife have to figure out a way to get to Milwaukee someday.

unklchuk · Post #4248 » by **unklchuk** » Sun Aug 30, 2009 4:17 pm

It's a Waiting for Godot type of situation, except we're a lot more animated and expressive than the Godot guys.

I wasn't complaining. Just marveling. Well, that's too strong, but it gives the general idea.

So far, no one's answered my question. Are other forums full of fans like the Bucks fans here? (I'm not sure if I should tell my snooty friends that Bucks fans are different than their stereotypes - or that sports fans in general are different than the stereotypes.)

BDUB_30 · Post #4249 » by **BDUB_30** » Sun Aug 30, 2009 6:37 pm

unklchuk wrote:It's a Waiting for Godot type of situation, except we're a lot more animated and expressive than the Godot guys.

I wasn't complaining. Just marveling. Well, that's too strong, but it gives the general idea.

So far, no one's answered my question. Are other forums full of fans like the Bucks fans here? (I'm not sure if I should tell my snooty friends that Bucks fans are different than their stereotypes - or that sports fans in general are different than the stereotypes.)

This goes way beyond rooting for a team or even following the team . People fall in love with their ideas and it doesnt take much time before peoples loyalty to their own idea surpasses their loyalty to the team .

With every decision these kind of fans become more fractured because its only a matter of time before the team decides something that doesnt go along with their " idea " . The amount of ego works in direct porportion to how much you critisize this team . WIthout a doubt . So those whom excist only in ego , flat out loathe this team and chastize every single decision down to the appearence of the cheerleaders , or the performance of the halftime music , the taste of the beer.

The bucks choosing not to sign Ramon will only increase the number of bruised egos. " Ohh you didnt do as i thought you should so now its time to get payback " .. I mean some flat out make it obvious . I read " If Hammond doesnt resign Ramon , im done with hammond " as almost a threat . As if to say " I will critisize hammond so heavily from here on out for not doing as me and my ego wanted him to do " .

People are now flat out rooting against this team simply because they are more fans of their own ego then they are to the team . It better be our way or their is no way . Theirs only a small handfull of these kind of posters on the site but they completly control all discussions with their limited view on the topic . So a thread about young players coming to camp early to prepare becomes a discussions about how bad hammond is because this isnt how you "change the culture " .. these youngs guys are irrelevant ...they wont win , hammond still sucks .. My ego is right , he was wrong . :lol:

Post #4250 » by **paulpressey25** » Sun Aug 30, 2009 7:04 pm

BDUB_30 wrote:[ My ego is right , he was wrong .

Or it could be as simple as we don't have a great GM, only a poor or mediocre one.

The responsibility is not on this board to cheer for every questionable move Hammond makes.

The responsibility is on Hammond to actually make a great move that pays off with significant wins on the court.

You know the old saying. The best way to silence your critics is to win.

BDUB_30 · Post #4251 » by **BDUB_30** » Sun Aug 30, 2009 7:14 pm

paulpressey25 wrote:
BDUB_30 wrote:[ My ego is right , he was wrong .

Or it could be as simple as we don't have a great GM, only a poor or mediocre one.

The responsibility is not on this board to cheer for every questionable move Hammond makes.
.

Nor should it be the responsiblity of the board to whine and over critisize every single decision that is made or isnt made .

Youve been on hammonds nuts from about 4 months into his carrer with milwaukee . Yeah , youre the voice of reason to suggest to us what is or isnt bias .

Post #4252 » by **paulpressey25** » Sun Aug 30, 2009 7:23 pm

BDUB_30 wrote:Youve been on hammonds nuts from about 4 months into his carrer with milwaukee . Yeah , youre the voice of reason to suggest to us what is or isnt bias .

This discussion is very similar to your take on the Ramon situation. If Ramon is as valuable as some here think, why doesn't he have a contract? If Hammond is a great a GM as some think, why aren't people lining up for tickets at the BC?

I don't think either argument is cut n' dried as there are major nuances in each that need to be accounted for. But we'll see this season how talented both Hammond and Ramon are (or aren't)

BDUB_30 · Post #4253 » by **BDUB_30** » Sun Aug 30, 2009 8:16 pm

paulpressey25 wrote:
BDUB_30 wrote:Youve been on hammonds nuts from about 4 months into his carrer with milwaukee . Yeah , youre the voice of reason to suggest to us what is or isnt bias .

This discussion is very similar to your take on the Ramon situation. If Ramon is as valuable as some here think, why doesn't he have a contract? If Hammond is a great a GM as some think, why aren't people lining up for tickets at the BC?

I don't think either argument is cut n' dried as there are major nuances in each that need to be accounted for. But we'll see this season how talented both Hammond and Ramon are (or aren't)

I agree 100% .

the only diffrence is , we havent given hammond enough time to see if he can fill the bc up . Where as Ramons situation is in the present and we have more concrete evidence .

Trust me a couple years from now , if were a fringe playoff team ...their will be enough evidence to justify hammond critisims . Or even at the end of this year . I guess what im trying to say is , im not to excited to read critisms that are based upon events unfolding . We kind of got a taste of that when we read in almost every thread how stupid hammond was for not trading RJ at the deadline because we wouldnt be able to sign cv / ramon or even our lottery pick . That type of prediction was argued as fact , and then when we got to the offseason , we had the money to sign all 3 we just decided not to to sign 2/3 . I read alot of hammonds critisisms that are based upon speculation but presented as fact .

You and I have done this dance enough so i apologize for sucking you into it once again .

LUKE23 · Post #4254 » by **LUKE23** » Sun Aug 30, 2009 8:49 pm

This season will show who is being a homer, who is being a pessimist, and who is being a realist. The proof is in the W/L. This is the bottom line: Hammond HAS contructed a WIN NOW roster. He's added veterans, he's going all the way up to the lux tax, and no big contracts were cleared. In HIS MIND he obviously feels this is a playoff team. If they do not make it, it will say a lot about his talent evaluation abilities, bottom line. We'll let the season bear everything out.

I just don't want to see the people that have supported every move making excuses as to why this team didn't make the playoffs if they don't.

As for me, I like how Hammond started the offseason (RJ trade) and I like both picks as of now. I don't like how we used money elsewhere, and I hate how he has basically ended all leverage in the Ramon situation, while also passing on other deals with him if we are going to let him walk.

But make no mistakes, this is a win now roster.

thomchatt3rton · Post #4255 » by **thomchatt3rton** » Sun Aug 30, 2009 8:56 pm

unklchuk wrote:It's a Waiting for Godot type of situation, except we're a lot more animated and expressive than the Godot guys.

I wasn't complaining. Just marveling. Well, that's too strong, but it gives the general idea.

So far, no one's answered my question. Are other forums full of fans like the Bucks fans here? (I'm not sure if I should tell my snooty friends that Bucks fans are different than their stereotypes - or that sports fans in general are different than the stereotypes.)

try visiting the memphis grizzlies realgm forum. i went on there the other night to see what grizz fans had to say about haddadi and his recent "star" comments, and i very quickly started to appreciate what we have here. there's tons more interest, activity and participation on our board. i think this sessions thread might have more posts than there entire forum has. obviously there are passionate knowledgeable fans down there- but nothing like we have here.
Or, have you been on the knicks board at all? Its a wasteland.
So, yeah, feel free to be a bucks elitist. :wink:

Sigra · Post #4256 » by **Sigra** » Sun Aug 30, 2009 8:57 pm

Wise1 wrote:Hey Sigra, where's the Bible? That's all you guys need!

No Bible here. Did you forget that I am Muslim? :wavefinger:

Nebula1 · Post #4257 » by **Nebula1** » Sun Aug 30, 2009 9:00 pm

BDUB_30 wrote:

the only diffrence is , we havent given hammond enough time to see if he can fill the bc up . Where as Ramons situation is in the present and we have more concrete evidence .

Trust me a couple years from now , if were a fringe playoff team ...their will be enough evidence to justify hammond critisims .

Wait what? We've had enough time to know what kind of player Ramon is (a season and change), but not enough to know what kind of GM Hammond is (2 offseasons and a season)? How does that make any sense?

Even if you equate Ramon's Ds work and Hammond's first offseason, they're just about equal. And if you count this offseason vs no summer work from Ramon, then we actually have MORE evidence of what Hammond is vs what Ramon is.

He has now spent nearly as much money as last season and will likely field a team with less wins and certainly less if Redd and Bogut would have been on the floor for the entire last season.

I'm being patient with Hammond, but be fair.

andonewheel · Post #4258 » by **andonewheel** » Sun Aug 30, 2009 9:33 pm

The way I see it is that we're in half-tank mode. Not yet on empty, so we aren't going to fill back up with a high draft pick, but the tank is still too empty to get us over .500

WEFFPIM · Post #4259 » by **WEFFPIM** » Sun Aug 30, 2009 9:35 pm

andonewheel wrote:The way I see it is that we're in half-tank mode. Not yet on empty, so we aren't going to fill back up with a high draft pick, but the tank is still too empty to get us over .500

That's what many call mediocrity

BDUB_30 · Post #4260 » by **BDUB_30** » Sun Aug 30, 2009 9:43 pm

LUKE23 wrote:This season will show who is being a homer, who is being a pessimist, and who is being a realist. The proof is in the W/L. This is the bottom line: Hammond HAS contructed a WIN NOW roster. He's added veterans, he's going all the way up to the lux tax, and no big contracts were cleared. In HIS MIND he obviously feels this is a playoff team. If they do not make it, it will say a lot about his talent evaluation abilities, bottom line. We'll let the season bear everything out.

I just don't want to see the people that have supported every move making excuses as to why this team didn't make the playoffs if they don't.

As for me, I like how Hammond started the offseason (RJ trade) and I like both picks as of now. I don't like how we used money elsewhere, and I hate how he has basically ended all leverage in the Ramon situation, while also passing on other deals with him if we are going to let him walk.

But make no mistakes, this is a win now roster.

Agreed 100% that his is a win now roster.

The only thing that could make me change this position is if somehow we go with a young lineup which i DOUBT will happen . If you see a high dose of bj/meeks/Ja/moute/erson realtivly early in the season then that means this team isnt trying to win and is trying to develop talent . Which i would honestly be ok with as well . Im really cool with either strategy.