Best second team in the league

[JoshB914]

^^^ MaceCase is a Hawks fan what are you talking about?

how can he not realise his own teams 2nd unit is superior?

Wrong again. Portland's second unit is clearly superior to Atlanta's'.

[CViggity]

This is silly. Portland is clearly better. The 1st team is way better. The 2nd team is way better. Portland is way better than Atlanta, that's just how it is. They are actually in consideration for a championship run. Atlanta has a 0% chance of winning a title this year.

Also, I'll take Rudy over Jamal Crawford every day and Sunday. People are conveniently avoiding how bad teams have been with Jamal Crawford leading the offense. Also Mo Evans is not better than Batum coming in to 2010. Batum has significantly bigger upside and with even marginal improvement next year is a clear upgrade.

It's frustrating when Hawks fans can't be realistic about this stuff. THE HAWKS AREN'T AS GOOD AS THE PORTLAND TRAIL BLAZERS. Say it to yourself a couple times, let it sink in. Their depth chart is better at every single position than Atlanta, it's just how it is.

[azuresou1]

Portland has 0% chance of winning a title this year.

They have a nice bunch of role players, but other than Roy and Aldridge, they're just that: role players. And I suppose Oden, but he has to show that he can actually play for more than 20 mpg.

Jamal Crawford's teams:
Chandler/Curry Bulls where he was forced to be #1 option as a rookie
Isiah Thomas Knicks (with Z-Bo, Marbury, Eddy Curry)
Last year's GSW

Rudy's played one year the the league, and he's shown he can be a decent 6th man. Jamal Crawford's shown that he can drop 52 pts on Dwyane Wade in 39 minute on 66% shooting.

Portland is a highly, highly overrated team. Everyone rides them because they're young and talented, but honestly a lot of their players are already capped out in terms of potential. 2nd round exit at best.

[tbhawksfan]

Why is he sporting a Hawks logo with statements like those. If he said LAL, CLEV I might be like ..OK, but PORT Naaaah !

They're a nice young team, like us.

[JoshB914]

Portland has 0% chance of winning a title this year.

They have a nice bunch of role players, but other than Roy and Aldridge, they're just that: role players. And I suppose Oden, but he has to show that he can actually play for more than 20 mpg.

Jamal Crawford's teams:
Chandler/Curry Bulls where he was forced to be #1 option as a rookie
Isiah Thomas Knicks (with Z-Bo, Marbury, Eddy Curry)
Last year's GSW

Rudy's played one year the the league, and he's shown he can be a decent 6th man. Jamal Crawford's shown that he can drop 52 pts on Dwyane Wade in 39 minute on 66% shooting.

Portland is a highly, highly overrated team. Everyone rides them because they're young and talented, but honestly a lot of their players are already capped out in terms of potential. 2nd round exit at best.

And how many teams have won championships or competed for them with two stars and a "bunch of role players?" That list is too long to even get into. My argument would be that LMA isn't quite the no. 2 option for them to win a championship, but your argument that they are "Roy, Aldridge, and a bunch of role players" doesn't hold weight imo.

I don't think Portland are overrated at all. They already have the hardest part in building a championship team in Brandon Roy who is one of the few true superstars in the league, and they are also ridiculously deep. If they can get some consistent play from the PG position (which Miller should give them) and a little bit of development from Oden they are a team that will contend in the WC for many years to come.

[azuresou1]

List of NBA Finalists since 05

San Antonio Spurs - Detroit Pistons
Dallas Mavericks - Miami Heat
San Antonio Spurs - Cleveland Cavaliers
Los Angeles Lakers - Boston Celtics
Los Angeles Lakers - Orlando Magic

Spurs - Duncan, TP, Manu
Pistons - Extremely balanced offense, amazing defensive team
Mavs - Dirk, Howard, Jet, Stack
Heat - DWade and Shaq >>> Roy and LMA
Cavs - This would be the exception, and they got absolutely humiliated by the Spurs in the Finals
Celtics - KG, PP, Jesus
Magic - Dwight, Shard, Hedo
Lakers - Kobe, Pau, Odom

Roy, LMA, and role players will get them as far as it got Gary Payton and Shawn Kemp. They're not winning a championship without either major development from one of their players like Oden, or a trade for a third star. Roy is great, but he's not Kobe or Wade or LeBron, and LMA would currently be option 2.5 or 3 on a real championship team.

[JoshB914]

^^^ GP and Kemp went to the NBA Finals only to be one of many great teams to lose to MJ's Bulls. I don't see your point there regarding them not having the pieces to contend.

Whether they can be a championship team remains to be seen. But what makes Portland different is that they already have the bona fide superstar that you need to win a championship. We see so many teams make all the right moves but fail to contend because they don't have that one superstar that can put them over the top (we are a perfect example of that as Joe just isn't on that level). I agree Roy isn't as good as Kobe/Wade/LBJ, but he is one of the few guys in the league who can put his team on his back and carry them whenever they need him the most. If they take care of the easy part and build a solid core around him as they appear to be, they very well could be winning titles in the coming seasons. Just my two cents though,

[johnny878]

Why is he sporting a Hawks logo with statements like those. If he said LAL, CLEV I might be like ..OK, but PORT Naaaah !

They're a nice young team, like us.

cviggity in pretty much every thread he post in, just hypes up portland.

[johnny878]

Portland has 0% chance of winning a title this year.

They have a nice bunch of role players, but other than Roy and Aldridge, they're just that: role players. And I suppose Oden, but he has to show that he can actually play for more than 20 mpg.

Jamal Crawford's teams:
Chandler/Curry Bulls where he was forced to be #1 option as a rookie
Isiah Thomas Knicks (with Z-Bo, Marbury, Eddy Curry)
Last year's GSW

Rudy's played one year the the league, and he's shown he can be a decent 6th man. Jamal Crawford's shown that he can drop 52 pts on Dwyane Wade in 39 minute on 66% shooting.

Portland is a highly, highly overrated team. Everyone rides them because they're young and talented, but honestly a lot of their players are already capped out in terms of potential. 2nd round exit at best.

And how many teams have won championships or competed for them with two stars and a "bunch of role players?" That list is too long to even get into. My argument would be that LMA isn't quite the no. 2 option for them to win a championship, but your argument that they are "Roy, Aldridge, and a bunch of role players" doesn't hold weight imo.

I don't think Portland are overrated at all. They already have the hardest part in building a championship team in Brandon Roy who is one of the few true superstars in the league, and they are also ridiculously deep. If they can get some consistent play from the PG position (which Miller should give them) and a little bit of development from Oden they are a team that will contend in the WC for many years to come.

i agree about aldridge.

i dont see the hype surrouding him. 18 and 7 is nice but near as nice as all his hype.

[tbhawksfan]

^ specially since he plays next to a true big with talent (Oden, Pryz) on a talented team.

[johnny878]

Portland's second unit could very much be a 40 win starting unit so I will give the edge to them all day every day. The only way our second unit can win this debate is if we change it to best 6th man and even then we'd only be top 5 rather than #1.

this is such an absurd comment

you really thikn

Steve Blake
Rudy Fernandez
Nicholas Batum
Jeff Pendergraph
Joel Pryzbilla

would win 40 games in the west?

that lineup no, but the actual second unit of
Blake
Rudy
Webster
Outlaw
Pryzbilla
is a pretty decent team considering each of those players have and can start on most teams. Flame away but Blake has been a serviceable point with range, Rudy is a crafty scorer with a handle, Webster spaces the floor, Outlaw can score well himself and Pryz is a legit defensive center. To even question the talent on that lineup or compare our unit of a rookie, Crawful, an undersized journeyman, a 34 year old journey man and Zaza is what is absurd.

ya, crawful just made your post "absurd"

[johnny878]

This is silly. Portland is clearly better. The 1st team is way better. The 2nd team is way better. Portland is way better than Atlanta, that's just how it is. They are actually in consideration for a championship run. Atlanta has a 0% chance of winning a title this year.

Also, I'll take Rudy over Jamal Crawford every day and Sunday. People are conveniently avoiding how bad teams have been with Jamal Crawford leading the offense. Also Mo Evans is not better than Batum coming in to 2010. Batum has significantly bigger upside and with even marginal improvement next year is a clear upgrade.

It's frustrating when Hawks fans can't be realistic about this stuff. THE HAWKS AREN'T AS GOOD AS THE PORTLAND TRAIL BLAZERS. Say it to yourself a couple times, let it sink in. Their depth chart is better at every single position than Atlanta, it's just how it is.

oh man, this post is just too good.

[JoshB914]

It's one game. Crawford is growing on me but I'd still think twice before taking him over Rudy. Batum is hurt right now, but he is a better player and prospect than Mo as well.

[azuresou1]

Batum is out for 4 months, and there's no telling what he'll be like when he comes back. Jamal Crawford is streakier than Rudy, but he's also far, far more dangerous.

[MaceCase]

ya, crawful just made your post "absurd"

Atlanta Hawks bench totals:
39 points-8 assists-7 rebounds

Portland Trailblazers bench totals:
31 points-13 assists-9 rebounds

No let's see how good your reading comprehension is

The only way our second unit can win this debate is if we change it to best 6th man

Jamal Crawford-
27 points-7 assists-2 rebounds.
rest of bench unit-
12 points-1 assist-5 rebounds

Explain to me where I'm far off? Oh cuz we won this matchup so you feel emboldened? Hmm

Season total averages:
Hawks-
38.3 points-5.7 assists-9.6 rebounds over 5 players.

Blazers-
31.3 points-6.4 assists-17.4 rebounds over 4 players.

They are playing a man less in their rotation yet are beating us in 2 out of the 3 categories listed. Hope you didn't spend too long digging this thread up.