Questions: For all those that want Amare gone...

MaryvalesFinest · Post #1 » by **MaryvalesFinest** » Tue Oct 13, 2009 6:35 pm

1) Why do you want Amare gone in the first place?

2) Do you want to see him traded or walk to free up money?

2A) If you answered traded what deal would you most like to see? (Be realistic)

2B) If you answered walk, who would you like to see the Suns sign with that money? (Be realistic)

3) Can anyone currently on the Suns do a decent job at the PF position if Amare is traded or leaves?

4) Do you think he will recover and be the same player he once was or close to it?

5) If he doesn't get a max contract with the Suns do you see him getting it with another team?

Gorilla Warfare · Post #2 » by **Gorilla Warfare** » Tue Oct 13, 2009 6:42 pm

We want Amare traded not gone so we can get somebody good in return. If we trade Amare we could potentially get another top 15 player in the league. If he walks nobody great from the 2010 would sign with us anyways and we would be screwed for years. Nobody on our team can play the PF position half as good as Amare can, if Clark bulks up he could possibly be in the next 3 years.

Post #3 » by **rsavaj** » Tue Oct 13, 2009 6:45 pm

1) I want to trade him if he won't sign for less than max
2) Probably traded because there's no guarantee that we'll get a good FA
2A and B) No idea
3) No
4) Maybe but I'm doubtful since doctors said MF was a temporary fix
5) Yeah teams always overpay

sunsfever68 · Post #4 » by **sunsfever68** » Tue Oct 13, 2009 6:55 pm

the only realistic trade that works for both teams but would only work if both players signed contract extensions would be Amare for Bosh straight up pretty much. If salaries don't work completely toronto could throw in a scrub.

I wouldn't be opposed to this trade. I like Bosh's game alot

thamadkant · Post #5 » by **thamadkant** » Tue Oct 13, 2009 9:39 pm

You're one of those fans Maryvalesfinest.

No one wanted Stoudemire "gone for nothin'".

The smart fans simply see the following.

(1) Stoudemire's lack of leadership skills
(2) Doubt over his knees in the long run, 3+ years from now.
(3) Doubt over his ability to be a "decent" defender.
(4) Doubt over his ability to be a "decent" rebounder.
(5) Doubt if he will be the same threath under a different system. Suns cannot run and gun post Nash.
(6) His lack of IMPACT overall to the game, to justify $20+ Million a year contract.

The smart fans see that with Stoudemire as a trade piece or by letting him go, the benefits are.

(1) Bulls trade, T.Thomas and J.Noah. Tyrus will give you 14 points/8 rebounds/2.5 blocks/1.5 steals with Nash and the Suns offense. Noah will give you another 12 points/11 rebounds/2.5 blocks also.
To me THATS DEFINITELY worth Stoudemire. As Suns have shown they can score 100+ easily even WITHOUT Stoudemire.

(2) A young prospect + a draft pick, I dunno. Maybe lets say a Grizzlies trade. Gay is a 20/7/3 player and still getting better. And with Grizzlies they are a threath to be a lottery team for the next few seasons. You have a star in Gay and draft pick. Which gives the Suns good rebuilding blocks... POST-Nash era.

(3) Warriors trade, If Curry deal went through, it would of been very good for the Suns for now.. and for the future. Biedrins, Curry, Wright, Bellineli... all potential players that are being wasted in a system where they have ball hogging point guards.

(4) Let him walk, and get another FA.... I dunno... Dwayne Wade perhaps?

TXSun · Post #6 » by **TXSun** » Tue Oct 13, 2009 9:44 pm

Jesus! enough of this. it's like the same thread only re-worded.

thamadkant · Post #7 » by **thamadkant** » Tue Oct 13, 2009 9:45 pm

I dont like Bosh's game.

He doesnt bring the defensive game that will help the Suns from being "bad" to "average". If anything the Suns stay the same with Bosh.

Bosh is less of a threath to score inside... as he relies on mid range and "soft touch" inside to score. Stoudemire, gives you a dunk and a foul on the other team's big man trying to guard him. Offensively, Stoudemire is more efficient.

Bosh is a "softer" Stoudemire... a taller weaker Boozer.... its a horizontal move at best...
Although Bosh's attitude > Stoudemire's attitude... also Bosh's IQ slightly better than Stoudemire.

So its even really.

I'd do Stoudemire for Haslem + Beasley.
Beasley should be atleast a poor man's Carmelo, putting up 20 points, 8 rebounds in a couple of years. And Haslem is a work horse, gives you the rebounding and hustle and at the very least defensive effort to impact the Suns slightly.

-SDU- · Post #8 » by **-SDU-** » Tue Oct 13, 2009 10:28 pm

i want to keep him

i would give him the max

i would give it to him right now without seeing how he comes back from eye surgery

hes a max player and we need to keep him

Frank Lee · Post #9 » by **Frank Lee** » Tue Oct 13, 2009 11:49 pm

I am almost in SDU's camp on this. Without Stat we are a bottom dweller. It is impossible to predict who we would get from a trade, or FA signing. I just want a productive season out of him. A minor defensive improvement would warrant a max deal, and we ought to think long and hard about what we would be like less Amare but with whoever. To afford him, we need 5 or 6 very reasonable salaried, contributing players (Hill, Lou, Dud, Clark, Dragic, lopez.... Barbs, I hate to say could be good trade bait, and JRich providing he excels in this offense, could be re-signed at a much better price) It is not how much money we give Stat that is the question.... it is, can we build a significant supporting cast around he and Nash within our holy budget ?

I also think inking up Nash for the next 3 is a nice enticement for Stat to stay. Perhaps a middle ground is available... ie a 3 yr deal ? One thing for certain, he pulls up lame again, and/or production drops, he may just use his player option for '10.... and then its rinse and repeat for another year.

Anyway you look at it, his return to dominance is our only hope for an entertaining and possible sunderella year. (Krikies... another twinge of optimism :oops:

? Lets get this party started )

DirtyDez · Post #10 » by **DirtyDez** » Tue Oct 13, 2009 11:53 pm

I honestly don't see anyone giving him a Max deal if he doesn't have a huge year. With injuries and defense/rebounding inabilities and only excelling in our system (unless maybe GS or NY) provides too much risk ecspecially with multi-millions of $. I wanted us to blow it up but i'm guessing he'll stay here for less than Max money

Post #11 » by **lilfishi22** » Wed Oct 14, 2009 3:24 am

I've always been a huge supporter of Stat's even though there are a number of question marks surrounding his return to form, loyalty and ability to be a franchise guy. However, I'm not willing to drop a max deal on him until I see he can be at least 80% the Amare we saw towards the end of the 07-08 season. 28/9/2/2 on 59% fg was his stats in the last 3 months of that season.

He'll need to give us 24/9/1/1 on 52% fg. I don' think it's a big ask considering his career average is 21/9/1.4/1.5 on 54% fg

I doubt he's going to take his 2010 money and play that year, the salary cap is going to keep shrinking and if he doesn't look for a deal next season, he won't get the same money in 2011. He's going to get a deal next off season whether it's here or with another team and I'm positive if our FO don't think his productions at the end of the season warrants a max deal, there will be someone else stupid enough to give him that. But I'm sure if he's playing anywhere close to 85%-90% of a max deal, he's gonna get paid.

nashrambler13 · Post #12 » by **nashrambler13** » Wed Oct 14, 2009 7:36 pm

thamadkant wrote:(5) Doubt if he will be the same threath under a different system. Suns cannot run and gun post Nash.

lol, it is possible to run the run and gun w/o steve nash. a number of teams do it today, successfully. also, most PG's prefer the run 'n gun, like say, goran dragic, who i honestly believe can become a solid starting point gaurd with Amare.

thamadkant wrote:(1) Bulls trade, T.Thomas and J.Noah. Tyrus will give you 14 points/8 rebounds/2.5 blocks/1.5 steals with Nash and the Suns offense. Noah will give you another 12 points/11 rebounds/2.5 blocks also.
To me THATS DEFINITELY worth Stoudemire. As Suns have shown they can score 100+ easily even WITHOUT Stoudemire.

(2) A young prospect + a draft pick, I dunno. Maybe lets say a Grizzlies trade. Gay is a 20/7/3 player and still getting better. And with Grizzlies they are a threath to be a lottery team for the next few seasons. You have a star in Gay and draft pick. Which gives the Suns good rebuilding blocks... POST-Nash era.

(3) Warriors trade, If Curry deal went through, it would of been very good for the Suns for now.. and for the future. Biedrins, Curry, Wright, Bellineli... all potential players that are being wasted in a system where they have ball hogging point guards.

(4) Let him walk, and get another FA.... I dunno... Dwayne Wade perhaps?

1- i would do that trade in a heartbeat. would the bulls?

2- gay hasnt been that great, but it seems like a plan to me- as long as the pick is for this year, in a PF heavy draft.

3- hasnt that been dead for a while now. it was too good to be true though...

4- i wish. would dwyane play with nash well?

statisback · Post #13 » by **statisback** » Wed Oct 14, 2009 8:14 pm

I could see a possible trade with the Bulls. Amare for Noah and TT. However, I dont think that works salary wise. Maybe Bulls need to throw in another player. Suns do need a defensive stopper at center and Noah can be that. Tyrus has tons of potential as well.

As much as I dont want Amare to leave, it almost seems like its the best for both parties.