Knicks Core vs. Nets Core

Rockice_8 · Post #141 » by **Rockice_8** » Thu Oct 22, 2009 4:36 pm

When will we see Hill in an NBA game is he even gonna play. I know he hasn't played but I'm getting ripped for having a 2 first rounder next year that we haven't even selected.

Who cares about a couple of lucky Douglas shots in the preseason.

method · Post #142 » by **method** » Thu Oct 22, 2009 4:36 pm

Magilla_Gorilla wrote:

16 and 6 playing PF. I think you'll see that I have been pretty specific mentioning the fact that all of those players/numbers pertain to Centers.

I hate to break it to you Frye would of put up better numbers at center because that is more his natural postion.And wouldnt of spent alot of energy guarding the better power forwards of the league.
Instead he would of went up against more offensively challenged centers.

method · Post #143 » by **method** » Thu Oct 22, 2009 4:41 pm

Rockice_8 wrote:When will we see Hill in an NBA game is he even gonna play. I know he hasn't played but I'm getting ripped for having a 2 first rounder next year that we haven't even selected.

Who cares about a couple of lucky Douglas shots in the preseason.

Im sure your winles Nets cared last night when they went back to there lockers,crying.

And Hill will be playing this year,dont worry about Hill.He put up awesome numbers at a big college.Thats not to say it will translate to the pros.But you seen him play last night.The kid got 2 turnovers for taking steps.He was nervous and still did decent.

method · Post #144 » by **method** » Thu Oct 22, 2009 4:44 pm

Magilla_Gorilla wrote:
KnicksGod wrote:
Magilla_Gorilla wrote: [Gallinari] as of now has done next to nothing in the NBA, Summer League, or preseason. ... all Gallo has done is get his back operated on and return to look pedestrian, again.

Then a couple of posts later ...

Magilla_Gorilla wrote:
Kid can shoot - never would or have denied that

I don't know if these two statements are blatant contradictions, but nonetheless -- this is the "Don't hit me, I'm wearing glasses" kind of shiftiness that I am talking about.

Gallo has done two things - have surgery and play pedestrian basketball. He can shoot, but take the cumulative value of what he has done - and its pedestrian - as evidenced by his PER.

Whats Dengs excuse?

Rockice_8 · Post #145 » by **Rockice_8** » Thu Oct 22, 2009 4:46 pm

Teppler wrote:Angry Nets fans swarm in here after we beat them 3x in preseason?

I'm just talking basketball man nobody's angry. It's preseason. We're not a playoff team right now and neither are you. It's just two bad teams arguing about their futures. Except for the few homers on this board everyone knows we're a threat and can't accept it.

Post #146 » by **K_ick_God** » Thu Oct 22, 2009 4:46 pm

I think the three most passionate Nets fans in the world are right here on the Knick message board.

method · Post #147 » by **method** » Thu Oct 22, 2009 4:50 pm

KnicksGod wrote:I think the three most passionate Nets fans in the world are right here on the Knick message board.

LOL...can you believe the nerve of these guys?We had just beat them with 2 rookies and 3 guys that are going to get cut.And there still talking crap.

Post #148 » by **K_ick_God** » Thu Oct 22, 2009 4:50 pm

Rockice_8 wrote:
Teppler wrote:Angry Nets fans swarm in here after we beat them 3x in preseason?

I'm just talking basketball man nobody's angry. It's preseason. We're not a playoff team right now and neither are you. It's just two bad teams arguing about their futures. Except for the few homers on this board everyone knows we're a threat and can't accept it.

A threat to do what exactly? Get LeBron?

So let me get this straight -- you're a homer if you think Gallo has more talent than Brook, or that Devin Harris is not a great player.

But you're NOT a homer if you think that the Nets, a team with no history and no place to play in New York ... wait, let me clarify: a team whose Brooklyn arena does not yet have even its first block of concrete on the ground ... is a threat for LeBron in 9 months?

Gotcha

TKF · Post #149 » by **TKF** » Thu Oct 22, 2009 4:50 pm

StutterStep wrote:
KnicksGod wrote:Kind of like someone who punches you and then puts on a pair of glasses so you don't hit back.

Line of the year

That was a killer line..

Rockice_8 · Post #150 » by **Rockice_8** » Thu Oct 22, 2009 4:53 pm

KnicksGod wrote:I think the three most passionate Nets fans in the world are right here on the Knick message board.

Thanks I'll take that as a compliment. I just love a good arguement and what better place to do it then right here against the fans of the team I hate the most.

Post #151 » by **K_ick_God** » Thu Oct 22, 2009 4:55 pm

method wrote:
KnicksGod wrote:I think the three most passionate Nets fans in the world are right here on the Knick message board.

LOL...can you believe the nerve of these guys?We had just beat them with 2 rookies and 3 guys that are going to get cut.And there still talking crap.

I would hope/think that before they came out with their guns blazing, it would be better if there was an actual shovel on the ground over in Brooklyn, rather than some cigarette butts and trannies, where the Nets' new arena is supposed to be. If they lose the lawsuit, they'll just be more cigarette butts and trannies, but no Nets and no LeBron.

Post #152 » by **mrpoetryNmotion** » Thu Oct 22, 2009 5:02 pm

This thread is hilarious...two non-playoff teams' fans arguing over who has the better core when both teams are likely to finish at the bottom of the eastern conference and both will probably not get Lebron. Both cores aren't that good.

method · Post #153 » by **method** » Thu Oct 22, 2009 5:09 pm

KnicksGod wrote:

I would hope/think that before they came out with their guns blazing, it would be better if there was an actual shovel on the ground over in Brooklyn, rather than some cigarette butts and trannies, where the Nets' new arena is supposed to be. If they lose the lawsuit, they'll just be more cigarette butts and trannies, but no Nets and no LeBron.

There is no way the Nets are coming to Brooklyn.

Not with all the people against it and not with the Dolans against it.

And if there is the possible chance it does,it wont happen at the soonest 2-3 years.

And it will never by compare to the Mecca.

What do they except people that have been fans of the Knicks since they were born because there fathers were Knick fans because there father were also are suddenly going to change and become Net fans?

Im mean come on son.

method · Post #154 » by **method** » Thu Oct 22, 2009 5:12 pm

mrpoetryNmotion wrote:This thread is hilarious...two non-playoff teams' fans arguing over who has the better core when both teams are likely to finish at the bottom of the eastern conference and both will probably not get Lebron. Both cores aren't that good.

You know I am so excited this time of year because there is new hope a new beginning a chance at the playoffs.And you have to come out with this crap.Have you ever heard of the 99 Knicks?

Post #155 » by **mrpoetryNmotion** » Thu Oct 22, 2009 5:15 pm

method wrote:
mrpoetryNmotion wrote:This thread is hilarious...two non-playoff teams' fans arguing over who has the better core when both teams are likely to finish at the bottom of the eastern conference and both will probably not get Lebron. Both cores aren't that good.

You know I am so excited this time of year because there is new hope a new beginning a chance at the playoffs.And you have to come out with this crap.Have you ever heard of the 99 Knicks?

Yea they had way better players than we have now.

They struggled a bit but would have never been the first #8 seed to advance all the way to the finals if it wasn't for the talent they had. Spree, Houston, Camby, LJ, and Ewing among others...I loved that team.

omerome · Post #156 » by **omerome** » Thu Oct 22, 2009 5:17 pm

mrpoetryNmotion wrote:
method wrote:
mrpoetryNmotion wrote:This thread is hilarious...two non-playoff teams' fans arguing over who has the better core when both teams are likely to finish at the bottom of the eastern conference and both will probably not get Lebron. Both cores aren't that good.

You know I am so excited this time of year because there is new hope a new beginning a chance at the playoffs.And you have to come out with this crap.Have you ever heard of the 99 Knicks?

Yea they had way better players than we have now.

But that's not the point. No one believed in that team to not only make the playoffs but to go as far as they did.

Sure this team right now isn't nearely as good as the team back then but if you want to win, you have to believe that you can win first. Otherwise, that defeatist attitude will land you in the lottery year after year...

Post #157 » by **mrpoetryNmotion** » Thu Oct 22, 2009 5:23 pm

omerome wrote:But that's not the point. No one believed in that team to not only make the playoffs but to go as far as they did.

Sure this team right now isn't nearely as good as the team back then but if you want to win, you have to believe that you can win first. Otherwise, that defeatist attitude will land you in the lottery year after year...

Yea, the players should have the mentality of winners, if they didn't I would question their heart for the game... IMO I don't think we are a playoff team. I hope for the best but in reality it doesn't seem likely to me as a fan.

method · Post #158 » by **method** » Thu Oct 22, 2009 8:06 pm

mrpoetryNmotion wrote:
omerome wrote:But that's not the point. No one believed in that team to not only make the playoffs but to go as far as they did.

Sure this team right now isn't nearely as good as the team back then but if you want to win, you have to believe that you can win first. Otherwise, that defeatist attitude will land you in the lottery year after year...

Yea, the players should have the mentality of winners, if they didn't I would question their heart for the game... IMO I don't think we are a playoff team. I hope for the best but in reality it doesn't seem likely to me as a fan.

Wow it really doesnt seem fun for you to be a fan.

Im mean I know theres probably no chance we will make the playoffs,but Im not going to quit on my team before the season even starts.Because that wouldnt be fun at all.

Im going to believe untill im proven wrong and then I probably still believe untill we are official ulimanated from the playoffs.

method · Post #159 » by **method** » Thu Oct 22, 2009 8:10 pm

omerome wrote:But that's not the point. No one believed in that team to not only make the playoffs but to go as far as they did.

Sure this team right now isn't nearely as good as the team back then but if you want to win, you have to believe that you can win first. Otherwise, that defeatist attitude will land you in the lottery year after year...

Thanks dude,couldnt of said it better.

Post #160 » by **j4remi** » Thu Oct 22, 2009 8:27 pm

Magilla_Gorilla wrote:
This is why stat-hounds fail often (peeks at Hollinger's predictions every year). You look at a stat-line and make assumptions without knowing what a player even looks like. Gallo had limited touches, minutes, and role but when he did drive he was effective and showed vision. His passing skills are pretty clear to anyone who's actually watched him play. His PER and the teams record even in his limited role show that he was effective on the floor (some other stats for you to mess around with and figure out), yet you'd say "let's look at the numbers" and ignore the most important one (aka Gallo on the squad had a .500 record). There are such things as empty stats, call them Zbo numbers if you'd like.

You mentioned PER - Gallo had a 13.4 - thats not good. 86% of Gallo's shots were jumpshots - he clearly didn't have any desire to drive - his FT attempts back that up.[/quote]

This is what I mean by stat hounds can make anything work for them. First, look at Gallo's FT per game in europe, you know...when he was healthy. Then look at his TS%...so uhm, the jumpshots were just fine. Watch a couple of preseason games and see him getting into the lanes and working the pick and roll and you'll realize he'll drive.

As far as the PER, league average is 15, that means including Vets and superstars. Gallo put up a solid PER for a rookie despite his back being hurt and hindering his game, not having a full season to improve and never getting consistent minutes. Context should help when looking at numbers, sadly most stat heads ignore it.