Favre: What are your feelings if he wins MVP or a Ring?

[LUKE23]

It looks like he was right. He doesn't need training camp, but he does need talent around him. He got TT and MM paid, and they turned their backs on him. I'm happy for Favre.

The moral of the story is that some individuals are more important than 'the team' and those individuals shouldn't be pushed out before their time.

They turned their backs on him because he retired, un-retired, they chartered a plane to bring him back, and he called them up the day before and said he changed his mind again? Hmmm.

Favre felt "disrespected" because TT/MM didn't kiss his ass enough in Favre's mind. That is what it comes down to. He felt he should be enshrined, not just wanted, but begged for.

And no, individuals are never above the team. That is why it is called the Green Bay Packers, not the Green Bay Favres. And last I checked Rodgers is playing amazing with no OL and an average running game.

And he got TT/MM paid how? TT's first year they were 4-12, TT's second year and MM's first they were 8-8. TT/MM were paid well before Favre finally had a stellar year in 2007. It's not TT/MM's fault Favre can't make up his goddam mind. They have a job to do in terms of getting ready for the season.

[paulpressey25]

Interesting comments from everyone. I wish we weren't in this situation.

Hopefully these last five games can vindicate TT with good Packers play and at the same time we'll see the December/January Brett that we all know and love. But they've got to get him some outdoor games now in the cold. Having New Orleans and their dome involved, it is possible Favre stays indoors throughout the playoffs. What a ridiculous irony that would be. The guy who sucked in domes his first 10-years now can't play without them.

[Rockmaninoff]

They turned their backs on him because he retired, un-retired, they chartered a plane to bring him back, and he called them up the day before and said he changed his mind again? Hmmm.

Favre felt "disrespected" because TT/MM didn't kiss his ass enough in Favre's mind. That is what it comes down to. He felt he should be enshrined, not just wanted, but begged for.

And no, individuals are never above the team. That is why it is called the Green Bay Packers, not the Green Bay Favres. And last I checked Rodgers is playing amazing with no OL and an average running game.

And he got TT/MM paid how? TT's first year they were 4-12, TT's second year and MM's first they were 8-8. TT/MM were paid well before Favre finally had a stellar year in 2007. It's not TT/MM's fault Favre can't make up his goddam mind. They have a job to do in terms of getting ready for the season.

We can disagree on this if you want.

In my opinion, all of TT and MM's efforts were made begrudgingly. Remember when TT offered to ship Favre his old locker? That was a nice touch. It seems pretty apparent that Favre could sense that he was no longer wanted. Feeling wanted is pretty important. I think you're exaggerating.

I never said that the team should have changed their name for him. Just that great individuals elevate 'the team' and are therefore more important in the long run. It's the effect that Brandon Jennings is starting to have on the Bucks.

While Rodgers has very nice stats, to me he is the Kevin Durant of quarterbacks. He's not an alchemist. Guys don't elevate their game because of him and he doesn't make people better. He just doesn't have that charisma. I like Rodgers, and I think that you can win with him, but I don't know if he is the main ingredient. And it could be argued that Rodgers is now more of gunslinger/swashbuckler than Favre.

I believe TT and MM both received contract extensions on the back of Favre's phenomenal final season in Green Bay. Correct me if I'm wrong. Since then, the results have been mediocre. What happened in the meantime?

[LUKE23]

In my opinion, all of TT and MM's efforts were made begrudgingly. Remember when TT offered to ship Favre his old locker? That was a nice touch. It seems pretty apparent that Favre could sense that he was no longer wanted. Feeling wanted is pretty important. I think you're exaggerating.

This was AFTER Favre had a tearful PC saying he was done. It's not like it was the day after the season and TT said to Favre, "we're sending you your locker". And why does the fact that even after he changed his mind and wanted to come back they chartered a plane to Mississippi always get ignored. They WANTED HIM BACK.

I never said that the team should have changed their name for him. Just that great individuals elevate 'the team' and are therefore more important in the long run. It's the effect that Brandon Jennings is starting to have on the Bucks.

That doesn't mean that said player gets to hold the team hostage though. TT/MM have a job to do. They have to prepare for the upcoming season. Favre wanted them to hold everything for him. That is why we had the drama we did.

While Rodgers has very nice stats, to me he is the Kevin Durant of quarterbacks. He's not an alchemist. Guys don't elevate their game because of him and he doesn't make people better. He just doesn't have that charisma. I like Rodgers, and I think that you can win with him, but I don't know if he is the main ingredient. And it could be argued that Rodgers is now more of gunslinger/swashbuckler than Favre.

Charisma? What does charisma have to do with anything? Production is what matters.

Rodgers is a gunslinger? He has 22 TD and 5 INT on the season. One of his best attributes is taking care of the football.

And Kevin Durant is a stud, so no idea where that comparison is going.

I believe TT and MM both received contract extensions on the back of Favre's phenomenal final season in Green Bay. Correct me if I'm wrong. Since then, the results have been mediocre. What happened in the meantime?

And the Packers were a combined 12-20 the two years prior to that. What happened then? It's funny that Favre gets lauded for one great year out of how many. Lets keep in mind that the guy hasn't been good in the playoffs for a long, long, long time.

Under TT/MM Favre was 25-23 and Rodgers is 13-14. Favre won one playoff game in 3 years. Rodgers 0 through 1+. We'll see where they both are after year 3.

[Rockmaninoff]

This was AFTER Favre had a tearful PC saying he was done. It's not like it was the day after the season and TT said to Favre, "we're sending you your locker". And why does the fact that even after he changed his mind and wanted to come back they chartered a plane to Mississippi always get ignored. They WANTED HIM BACK.

Begrudgingly chartered a plane. We can disagree.

That doesn't mean that said player gets to hold the team hostage though. TT/MM have a job to do. They have to prepare for the upcoming season. Favre wanted them to hold everything for him. That is why we had the drama we did.

He wanted more talent and he wanted to miss training camp. You and I just see this situation differently, so we can disagree.

Charisma? What does charisma have to do with anything? Production is what matters.

Rodgers is a gunslinger? He has 22 TD and 5 INT on the season. One of his best attributes is taking care of the football.

And Kevin Durant is a stud, so no idea where that comparison is going.

Intangibles might be as important as skilled production.

Rodgers likes to hold onto the ball and chuck. He's efficient at it, but then sacks aren't detrimental to his QB rating. Not a lot of long, sustained drives.

I mention Kevin Durant because he is another stat stuffer, that seems to lack the intangibles, and he hasn't won dick.

And the Packers were a combined 12-20 the two years prior to that. What happened then? It's funny that Favre gets lauded for one great year out of how many. Lets keep in mind that the guy hasn't been good in the playoffs for a long, long, long time.

What happened? Favre was playing with guys like Taco Wallace. Those two years were the beginning of TT's 10 year rebuild.

Favre was pretty good in the 2007 playoffs. I guess we'll see how he does this year.

[LUKE23]

Begrudgingly chartered a plane. We can disagree.

How do you begrudgingly charter a plane?

He wanted more talent and he wanted to miss training camp. You and I just see this situation differently, so we can disagree.

So he gets to make personnel decisions and he gets preferential treatment of not practicing with his teammates, and that is OK with you? Gotcha.

Intangibles might be as important as skilled production.

Rodgers likes to hold onto the ball and chuck. He's efficient at it, but then sacks aren't detrimental to his QB rating. Not a lot of long, sustained drives.

I mention Kevin Durant because he is another stat stuffer, that seems to lack the intangibles, and he hasn't won dick.

Intangibles are what people use to argue things when they don't have a lot of other concrete evidence. Is intangibles throwing INT's in the playoffs? Or are you saying we need Rodgers to slap hands with the referees and just "have fun playing the game" like Favre did? I could give a laundry list of cliches.

Durant hasn't won dick? Good grief, the guy is a beast and they might make the playoffs this year with a core 23 or younger and max cap space and picks to use. I believe we wagered on this before the year, you're going to lose the 35 win bet.

What happened? Favre was playing with guys like Taco Wallace. Those two years were the beginning of TT's 10 year rebuild.

Favre was pretty good in the 2007 playoffs. I guess we'll see how he does this year.

He had a 70.7 rating vs. the Giants and the last throw was a typical Favre duck INT in the playoffs. Check his playoff numbers since the turn the of the century:

14 TD, 16 INT, 3-5 record. My guess is TT and MM are hoping Rodgers can do better. And he can.

Regarding this year, if he can't win with that OL, Peterson, and Harvin/Rice/Berrian/Shiancoe, then God help him. That offense has no weaknesses.

[WRau1]

I like how all the pro-Favre fans like to point out how Aron holds the ball to long but they can't seem to remember how many games Favre cost us by chucking the ball in the air, which would result in an INT, whenever there was a defender within 5ft of him.

[LUKE23]

I like how all the pro-Favre fans like to point out how Aron holds the ball to long but they can't seem to remember how many games Favre cost us by chucking the ball in the air, which would result in an INT, whenever there was a defender within 5ft of him.

Yep. Rodgers definitely has to improve in terms of getting rid of the ball and throwing it out of bounds, but I will take a sack over an INT any day of the week. Favre this year is the exception, not the rule.

[Rockmaninoff]

Durant hasn't won dick? Good grief, the guy is a beast and they might make the playoffs this year with a core 23 or younger and max cap space and picks to use. I believe we wagered on this before the year, you're going to lose the 35 win bet.

No. I said that if the Thunder win 35 games, that James Harden would be the difference, and so far he is.

I know you like Wages of Wins, so here is a quote from Dave Berri saying the exact same thing.

Let me close by noting the play of James Harden. So far Harden is only averaging 19.7 minutes per game. But if his WP48 of 0.219 continues – and his minutes per game don’t change – he will produce 7.4 wins by the time the season ends. Such production could be what pushes the Thunder past the 41 win mark; or the mark that divides “good” teams from “bad” teams. Harden probably may not play enough minutes to warrant consideration for Rookie of the Year (he plays the same as Thabo Sefolosha). But in a discussion of “good” rookies in 2009-10, Harden’s name should be mentioned.

I knew I shouldn't have responded to this thread. We just see things differently, but you are adamant that you're right. It's like talking politics with Neo-Cons.

Anyway, go Packers.

[Shoot it FatBoy]

"I never said that the team should have changed their name for him. Just that great individuals elevate 'the team' and are therefore more important in the long run. It's the effect that Brandon Jennings is starting to have on the Bucks."

You are aware that Favre is 40 right? There is nothing long run about him. Jennings just turned 20 a few months ago.

[zmanishere11]

I would be pissed at both Favre and Thompson. How could Thompson be so wrong on the talent Favre still had and pissed at Favre for being able to play like this now, yet he looked like an old man 2 years ago. Can you name a player impacted by emotions as much as Favre?

If you ask me, this is exactly the issue. Favre has always had the talent, and it may be YEARS before he actually loses the ability to play at this level. The problem was, he just wasn't going to do it with the Packers anymore.

[mnstinks]

and it may be YEARS before he actually loses the ability to play at this level.

Too bad he doesn't have some cold weather games coming up...

[Kerb Hohl]

To me, I don't think Thompson necessarily missed on the talent if we throw all of the emotional arguments aside.

What I think they might have seen was the oncoming arm issues and wagered that at 39, to bank on him getting that repaired whenever and coming back to full strength before the rest of his body got too old was probably not going to happen.

I guess it did.

I've argued the emotional/etc. aspect on here before and won't right now(though I always get baited into it). No one didn't think the guy had talent. They might have known about his arm issues.

[A Diddy2231]

I just dont see any way you can be upset with Thompson for letting Brett go only because of how well Rodgers is playing. What is Farve going to put us over the top last year? Is Favre going to put us at 10-1 this yr? Favre would be probably be so banged up right now with this Oline and he cant scramble like he used to obviously.

With all that said, do you think Favre hangs it up after this year if the Vikings win the Superbowl???

[Kerb Hohl]

I don't care what he does, as long as they don't win the Super Bowl.

I literally won't be able to watch my favorite team anymore because of all the douchebags around me that have jumped ship, hate the administration, etc. 20 years down the road when we have Peyton Manning Jr. at QB, we'll still be listening to the Favre gawkers bitching about ****.

[skones]

My feelings if either happens:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HY-03vYYAjA

[trwi7]

It will be interesting to see how Favre performs next year if he comes back. He doesn't have the great schedule where the lowest temperature he has had to play in so far is 48 and there's likely only to be one true cold weather game against the Bears.

Next year the Queens are going to have road games against us, the Bears, Philadelphia, Washington, the Jets and New England. You'd think at least two of those games are going to be cold weather and they'll also likely have Arizona at home and New Orleans on the road.

But they got really lucky with the schedule this year. Only four games on the road against cold weather teams. One was against Cleveland opening week, two were in late October/early November when it's tolerable still and then against the Bears in late December.

[LarryHarris]

I hope neither happen, and I feel like he washes away a sizable portion of his Packers legacy by winning the Super Bowl in a Vikings jersey.

I never felt this was Thompson's fault and perhaps our former QB would have never achieved this level of success if he hadn't felt so slighted by the Packers...

[RiotPunch]

I can live with an MVP-- but no way in hell can I live with the Queens winning a superbowl. That would be the worst feeling in the entire world to see Brett get a ring with those clowns.