Hilton Armstrong added...

[cdt3]

Armstrong 25 6-11 235lbs 3 years in the NBA
3.6/2.7/0.5 blocks in 13mins a game on 2.6 touches

Sean Williams 23 6-10 235lbs 3 years in the NBA
4.3/3.6/1block in 15mins a game 3.4 touches

I would say Armstrong has to work harder for his stats on a team with in their prime David West/Okafor/Chandler ahead of him. Williams played with Brook Lopez but nobody else.

Williams is probably a better shot blocker but Armstrong is more mentally stable. The same reason the Nets kept Josh Boone (the same size, age and production as Armstrong) instead of Williams.

Armstrong is healthier than May for us and cheaper than Shelden Williams or Diogu would have been.

Good pickup for Petrie.

TOUCHES?? You kidding me? There is a stat as to how many times a player touches a ball? At least thats what its supposed to be?

Williams got cut by a terrible young team with plenty of minutes available that needed him. Armstrong got cut by a vet filled playoff team where he was not needed. The same reason we let go of Hedo and Gerald Wallace when they were young. Not because they were headcases, like Williams.

How do you expect to compare a players production when they are on the floor? John Salmons used to avg 4 points a game when he played behind Iverson but when he came to Sac he avgd almost 15. HE GOT MORE TOUCHES.

Look at JT he gets 12 touches a game and is putting up a 14/9/1 on 12 touches a game this year. Bosh is putting up 24/11/1 on 16 touches. JT has identical production per touch as Bosh since you get more points and rebounds if you get get more touches.

Did you think school was just your nap time? Don't walk with the grown ups if you can't keep up...

[rwheeler]

Great post by the way cdt3....way to sock it to em. Touches are not the type of stat that is typically found in a box score or even in a players stat profile, but they are a very good source of evaluating a players performance on the floor. Any player can get minutes, but its what they do when they get the ball thats more important IMO rather than basing thier stats off of the total number of minutes they may have played in a game.

You'll soon witness what we are talking about when K-Mart and Cisco return. Casspi will start getting less touches which will obviously impact his offensive production.

[Draino]

Armstrong 25 6-11 235lbs 3 years in the NBA
3.6/2.7/0.5 blocks in 13mins a game on 2.6 touches

Sean Williams 23 6-10 235lbs 3 years in the NBA
4.3/3.6/1block in 15mins a game 3.4 touches

I would say Armstrong has to work harder for his stats on a team with in their prime David West/Okafor/Chandler ahead of him. Williams played with Brook Lopez but nobody else.

Williams is probably a better shot blocker but Armstrong is more mentally stable. The same reason the Nets kept Josh Boone (the same size, age and production as Armstrong) instead of Williams.

Armstrong is healthier than May for us and cheaper than Shelden Williams or Diogu would have been.

Good pickup for Petrie.

TOUCHES?? You kidding me? There is a stat as to how many times a player touches a ball? At least thats what its supposed to be?

Williams got cut by a terrible young team with plenty of minutes available that needed him. Armstrong got cut by a vet filled playoff team where he was not needed. The same reason we let go of Hedo and Gerald Wallace when they were young. Not because they were headcases, like Williams.

How do you expect to compare a players production when they are on the floor? John Salmons used to avg 4 points a game when he played behind Iverson but when he came to Sac he avgd almost 15. HE GOT MORE TOUCHES.

Look at JT he gets 12 touches a game and is putting up a 14/9/1 on 12 touches a game this year. Bosh is putting up 24/11/1 on 16 touches. JT has identical production per touch as Bosh since you get more points and rebounds if you get get more touches.

Did you think school was just your nap time? Don't walk with the grown ups if you can't keep up...

lol first of all the hornets didn't need Armstrong?? and who exactly were those veterans at his position? Last year Chandler and West, this year Okafor and West.... and umm yea he was the 3rd option.... Second... SEAN WILLIAMS IS BETTER THAN HILTON ARMSTRONG.

As for the whole "touches" stat, how do you actually measure that? Since IVE NEVER SEEN THAT AS A ACTUAL STAT... how does a player touch the ball 2-3 times a game and score 3.6 ppg and average 2.7 rebounds.... that alone says he touched the ball at least 4 times (of course he would have to be 100% shooting) so you CAN'T MEASURE HOW MANY TIMES A PLAYER TOUCHES THE BALL lol thats one of the most idiotic things ive ever seen posted on this board, and oh by the way, Armstrong won't last past this season with the Kings anyways....

[a-rod]

This is a low risk, high reward type of trade. i like it...

Sean Williams > Hilton.
But, whateva.

True. but we need size..

[pillwenney]

Guys, calm down a little.

And Hilton didn't get a lot of opportunities elsewhere because he's just not very good. Plain and simple. There were minutes there for him. He was the only real backup center the team had for a number of years. Before this year in particular, NO always had really bad front court depth. Hilton had opportunities. He's just not a very good player.

[rwheeler]

As for the whole "touches" stat, how do you actually measure that? Since IVE NEVER SEEN THAT AS A ACTUAL STAT... how does a player touch the ball 2-3 times a game and score 3.6 ppg and average 2.7 rebounds.... that alone says he touched the ball at least 4 times (of course he would have to be 100% shooting) so you CAN'T MEASURE HOW MANY TIMES A PLAYER TOUCHES THE BALL lol thats one of the most idiotic things ive ever seen posted on this board....

You've never seen it because like I said previously, its not a typical stat. "Touches" is a stat I think has developed over time thanks the world of fantasy sports. Its a stat that only the most hardcore analysts will follow. I really feel like it should be taken more seriously because the whole point behind it holds true - if you're not getting touches in a game, its hard to produce offensively (unless you are a cleanup man). I mentioned Casspi's case when K-Mart and Cisco return. Not only will his minutes decrease, so will his touches even when he's on the floor. If it's not Casspi, it's going to be somebody.
For a coach's gameplan, I know they like to try and determine a certain amount of touches each player will receive a game. It's a way of finding offensive balance and keeping every player happy with their roles. It's determined by the talent each team has; obviously the coaches wants the best player(s) touching the ball the most, which leads to the number of plays that is designed for each player. Are you getting the point yet?
Iverson was the perfect player cdt3 could have used for his post, since Iverson was once a one-man army. Look at his production over the past few seasons without as many touches...its gone down. Give him more touches, sure he'll produce, but we know it won't equal a lot of wins. I really wish I could explain the way to measure how many times a player touches the ball, but trust me there are people out there that do it. I am very curious to know where cdt3 is getting his data from though....

[rwheeler]

Guys, calm down a little.

And Hilton didn't get a lot of opportunities elsewhere because he's just not very good. Plain and simple. There were minutes there for him. He was the only real backup center the team had for a number of years. Before this year in particular, NO always had really bad front court depth. Hilton had opportunities. He's just not a very good player.

Agreed. For the record, I was not trying to defend Armstrong's production based upon his "touches". I know he's had his chances being in the league 3 seasons now, and he hasn't done squat.

[Three34]

Maybe I'm wrong. I just don't see a ton of options out there for small deals like this that are especially valuable. And again, for bigger deals, the 125% rule more or less covers the cap space we had.

Yeah, s'pose.

[Draino]

my point exactly.... i wont complain about the move, it was cheap and it could POTENTIALLY be a good thing for us, BUT... he hasn't been good... i liked him in college, but it never transfered in the NBA... Williams SHOWED flashes of what he can bring to the table his rookie year, which means HE HAS WHAT IT TAKES... he just needs someone to push him to get there, which is exactly why i think Sean Williams would have been a better addition (not that its still out of the question for us to get him, cut Sean May and we have a solution).

[PELICANSFAN]

Hopefully he develops for you. If you have someone internally that can light a fire under his butt, maybe he will.

Well we do have Truck Robinson, and IMO he has done a great job bringing his hard-nosed style as a assistant coach for our bigs. I've really feel like our rebounding has vastly improved from recent seasons. All I got to say is if Armstrong is as lazy as some say, I think he's in a for a rude awakening. He might be also be able to learn a thing or two from Shareef. Let the experiment begin!

Truck Robinson - I loved watching him as a kid. He was with the New Orleans Jazz teamed with Pistol Pete!

[cdt3]

Petrie hates head cases he likes production. The Kings had Artest for years but despite all the muscles the guy had the same production as Peja with far less headaches.

Petrie is not a guy who drafts according to vertical or speed or passing or name, just production. He drafted Evans as a 6-6 PG who nobody in the NBA thought was an elite athlete or could run a team. Now we have a special PG. Evans is not a head case and brings almost all positives.

Why would you invest millions in someone who is a major head case?