Lakers to explore starting Odom, not Bynum

[Kilroy]

smart idea or stupid idea?

my argument is this---
clearly lamar is better starting than benched, and bynum is DEFINATELY better starting than benched....
so why not start lamar and bynum..and bring gasol (who will be a solid contributor regardless) off the bench with more minutes?

Bad idea...
Because no matter how good Lamar and Bynum are starting, Pau is still better and more consistant.

I'm also not really ready to say Lamar is definately better starting, these last three games have seen us play very fast, and in the open court a lot which plays to Lamars strengths more than the set, half-court offense.

[TommyTheCat]

But the challenge still stands -- anybody who is legitimately satisfied with the way we've been playing over the past few months is more than welcome to step up to the plate and state their case.

and that's different than when during the phil coached years? his teams always play their best from march on.

this is a lot to do about nothing. phil's not going to change his starting lineup at this point in the season and it's probably all a zen mind trick to spark a fire.

Almost all of the Bulls teams played at a high level throughout. The 1999-00 team might have actually been better during the regular season than the playoffs. And last year, did we really have a true peak outside of winning the title? Granted, those were different teams with different personnel in different years, but the notion that his teams always work themselves into peak form late isn't totally true.

Besides, this isn't so much about panic but exploring all of our options. We're going to win a ton of games, and be a championship contender, on talent alone. But in my mind, the Gasol-Bynum tandem hasn't worked quite as expected. Maybe they haven't had enough time together in light of Gasol's injuries. Kobe's injuries obviously haven't helped, either. Nonetheless, I haven't been as impressed as I'd hoped.

The numbers say standing pat would be the best move. I just wouldn't mind giving Odom a few starts -- 10? -- and see how he and Andrew respond. If this team truly doesn't peak until late, what's the harm in a little pre-playoff tinkering?

i'm a big bynum fan but i truely believe the guy's psyche is pretty fragile. i'm hoping it has more to do with being young than an inherent trait. so that's why i'd be hesitant to make the move. i hate to think that the lakers are gonna need to walk on eggshells to deal with him, but at this point in the season, i believe in the 'if it ain't broke, don't fix it' philosophy. especially since pau and bynum have been getting better and more consistent in terms of playing together. i'd like to see them get as much time together on the court heading into playoffs. imo, bynum will need to be big come playoff time if the lakers are to repeat.

[crazyeights]

I wouldn't be opposed to this, but honestly I think Bynum looks like **** a lot of times where he's left in with Farmar/Brown/Walton/Odom or Powell.

Rarely do I see him carrying the bench like he should. They just look inexperienced. They either don't force it inside, or they do and Drew holds it too long and doesn't move the ball.

Maybe he'd readjust after a few games and just turn to dominating.

Either way, starting doesn't matter so much as who plays the final 6 minutes of the 4th. Lamar and Pau currently own that spot. If anyone recalls it was a huge deal that Bynum played over Pau in that Boston game.

[Sedale Threatt]

i'm a big bynum fan but i truely believe the guy's psyche is pretty fragile. i'm hoping it has more to do with being young than an inherent trait. so that's why i'd be hesitant to make the move. i hate to think that the lakers are gonna need to walk on eggshells to deal with him, but at this point in the season, i believe in the 'if it ain't broke, don't fix it' philosophy. especially since pau and bynum have been getting better and more consistent in terms of playing together. i'd like to see them get as much time together on the court heading into playoffs. imo, bynum will need to be big come playoff time if the lakers are to repeat.

I agree, or at least understand, a lot of what you're saying. Especially the last sentence -- we will undoubtedly need a significant contribution from Andrew to repeat.

The only thing I don't agree with is Pau and Andrew getting better and better in terms of playing together. If anything, it seems worse to me -- and I'm not backing that up with anything besides the impression I'm gathering from watching.

The two don't really play well together at all, in my opinion, on either end of the court. They're not bad, mind you; both are going to do damage simply because they're both big and very talented. But it seems clear to me that they don't mesh well, to the point that I don't think they're both ever going to be as good as they can be while playing significant minutes together.

And that's frustrating, because no lineup change is going to change that. As I said earlier, somebody's always going to be left out because there just aren't enough minutes/touches to go around. Oh well -- there could certainly be worse problems to have, like being forced to start Smush Parker and Kwame Brown.

[Sedale Threatt]

I need to watch some old Celtics games and figure out how they did it with McHale and Parish. Maybe because they had a god-like passer in Larry Bird to keep them both involved.

[TommyTheCat]

plus bird was lights out from the perimeter (and ainge could do some damage) which probably opened thing up much more. the lakers perimeter game has been poop for the most part and teams are sagging in for a good portion of the game.

as for bynum and gasol playing together..........i agree that they are not where i'd want them to be but i still see some improvement over what it was. sometimes chemistry isn't natural and needs time to develop. hopefully they'll continue to improve.

[dula14]

I don't see Bynum adjusting to a role off the bench very well. The kid seems to lack the maturity it takes to accept a demotion, and still provide the effort necessary for him to be effective. When Phil went with Odom in the starting lineup early in the playoffs last year, Bynum seemed to sulk and show a complete lack of interest on the court. I know he was still not 100% at the time, but the least he could have done was play with effort and emotion.

It's pretty obvious that the combo of Gasol/Odom is more effective than that of Gasol/Bynum, but I think the best thing would be to continue to start Bynum when healthy in an effort to keep him engaged. The last thing the Lakers need is a high priced, pouting diva like Bynum feeling sorry for himself because he lost his starting spot.

[TommyTheCat]

I don't see Bynum adjusting to a role off the bench very well. The kid seems to lack the maturity it takes to accept a demotion, and still provide the effort necessary for him to be effective. When Phil went with Odom in the starting lineup early in the playoffs last year, Bynum seemed to sulk and show a complete lack of interest on the court. I know he was still not 100% at the time, but the least he could have done was play with effort and emotion.

It's pretty obvious that the combo of Gasol/Odom is more effective than that of Gasol/Bynum, but I think the best thing would be to continue to start Bynum when healthy in an effort to keep him engaged. The last thing the Lakers need is a high priced, pouting diva like Bynum feeling sorry for himself because he lost his starting spot.

sad but true. i'm hoping he'll mature like artest. i had concern regarding him coming in and accepting his role and a lesser spot light but he's done great with it. i don't think that would be the case if it happened to him earlier in his career. hopefully bynum will get there.

btw, dula14.........................welcome to the board.

[crazyeights]

Was Bynum a high priced diva by that point last year? I thought he was still on his rookie contract extension

Also bear in mind that Bynum was what? 21?

[HunterSThompson]

Jawanda beat me to the punch but how about Gadsoft come off the bench. He can replace either Bynum or Lamor at the 6 minute mark for the one in foul trouble, not playing team defenem or not rebounding. Make it clear to both Lamar and Bynum that fundamentals are the most inportant to playing time. Bynum benifits becuase Lamar is our best passer. Lamr benifits becuase Bynum actually boxes out opponents now. Gasol benifits because he feasts off lessor competition.

you know, just speaking to the "gasoft" bull, dude aint soft, unless you wanna call tim duncan and lew alcinder soft too...he is skinny, and lanky, and plays i'd say, at least 80% of the times above expectations...which is more than most pro athletes, let alone nba players usually do

that aint soft...lets end this crap right now....and oh yes i did compare pau gasol to kareem abdul jabbar...what! closest we'll see to cap in our lifetimes...

[That Nicka]

I need to watch some old Celtics games and figure out how they did it with McHale and Parish. Maybe because they had a god-like passer in Larry Bird to keep them both involved.

Parish played in the high post a lot. More than Gasol does.

[That Nicka]

smart idea or stupid idea?

my argument is this---
clearly lamar is better starting than benched, and bynum is DEFINATELY better starting than benched....
so why not start lamar and bynum..and bring gasol (who will be a solid contributor regardless) off the bench with more minutes?

How do you know Bynum is DEFINITELY better starting? Do you even remember the last time Bynum consistently came off the bench? He started the 07/08 season coming off the bench behind Kwame and he played fine. All these people saying Bynum would play worse off the bench are just hypothesizing.

And I'm not saying bynum will absolutely be better coming off the bench or that our team will be better, but the prospect is at least worth taking a look at. Like I said before, it's not like we cant go back to the original starters if it doesnt work out.

[triangleoffense]

they need to adjust their lineup according to the matchups they are faced against. Against slower half-court defensive teams I believe Bynum is the right choice to anchor the d and run the offense. Against faster up tempo teams Odom is most likely the correct choice.

[HunterSThompson]

they need to adjust their lineup according to the matchups they are faced against. Against slower half-court defensive teams I believe Bynum is the right choice to anchor the d and run the offense. Against faster up tempo teams Odom is most likely the correct choice.

this. really the most reality based solution to the question.

[HunterSThompson]

reading through the wiretap and general board, they are saying its a strong chance that amar'e will go to cleveland...if so, i guess that makes this discussion relevant...if that were true then it would , i think, makes our it imperative that pau and drew learn to play well with eachother...thats of course assuming we both make it to the finals

[Jajwanda]

I doubt they get him but if they do they'll need to upgrade the team. Even if Gasol-Bynum-Odom match the Cavs front court, LeBron is just... Can't have Fisher out there making it harder for the team.

[Anklebreaker702]

Something i'd like to point out also. If we could be guaranteed Lamar would keep playing at this type of level I think i'd be all for it, but more than likely Lamar would just fall back into complacency. Remember when it was just him & Kobe? He could never step up. Remember this comment? I'm not a 25 15 guy (or whatever numbers it was) that';s just not me.

So what Phil asks him to do he usually doesnt want to comply. So now that Kobe & Pau & sometimes Ron Ron can shoulder the load he's that guy now? not as far as points but consistency? I hope so but i'll believe it when I see it.

you guys act like Lamar hasnt been here and been doing the same thing for years. His numbers always go up as the season goes on and he's never been worse than 14/10 as a starter for us. He is inconsistent from game to game, but he is consistently 14/10 as a starter, and even better in the playoffs.

This was only a problem when it was just Kobe and Lamar as we needed a 2nd option that could score more than 14 points every night (and he often didnt even show up for that much) but now that he's one of 5 offensive weapons for his, the fluctuation from game to game will not be a big deal. He'll still be the same player he's always been over the coarse of the season though.

So are you trying to tell me you don't see Lamar's inconsistency?

[That Nicka]

B-Forgotten how once Odom gets used to starting his level of player drops again.

uhm what?... Lamar Odom has always been inconsistent, regardless if he is starting or coming off the bench. However he is historically better after the All-Star break and even better yet in the playoffs. Historically and predictably.

Lamar has always be inconsistent. It was only really a problem though when he was our 2nd best player. Now that we have so many offensive weapons (Kobe, Gasol, Bynum, Artest) he can be inconsistent and we will be fine. What's more important is how our offense flows, and our defensive intensity.

[Jakay]

I think it comes down to Drew. If he could actually handle coming off the bench, I think it would make the front line endlessly punishing all game long, AND give him the offensive touches he wants. But, I don't think he's got it in him to accept that role either, so don't mess with what's rollin. I think he'd pout to the team's detriment.

Lamar... man, he's just how he is, doesn't seem to matter if he gets to start or not. Any change seems to motivate him for a stretch. Regardless, he's gonna get his burn either way, and in the end, it'll be him and Gasol playing down the stretch, so it's sort of irrelevant who gets the nod for an intro.

[Jajwanda]

Interesting food for thought. The Cavs lineup this year has been most impressive with Ilgauskas instead of Shaq.

Go check out a couple of the five-man splits for the Cavs' lineup and you'll see that in fact they're not very strong with Shaq in there except against a couple of key teams such as Orlando. I have a feeling that Boston is going to strangle Cleveland in the playoffs.