Singleton, AT, JH/New Guys Apprehiation Thread

[hands11]

I found a pet player already. I like Singleton

Howard has some talent for sure but Singleton is a hustle strong dude.

Ross looks a little thin. Should be interesting to see what they do when they gel.

[montestewart]

Singleton never gave up on a play, and he knows where to place his body on offense and defense. Tough, high energy player that I knew virtually nothing about prior to the trade.

[hands11]

Singleton never gave up on a play, and he knows where to place his body on offense and defense. Tough, high energy player that I knew virtually nothing about prior to the trade.

And he seems to have a great attitude and he made some outside shots.

[verbal8]

Singleton never gave up on a play, and he knows where to place his body on offense and defense. Tough, high energy player that I knew virtually nothing about prior to the trade.

And he seems to have a great attitude and he made some outside shots.

He is like an athletic version of Ruffin with some semblance of an offensive game. I thought the throw-ins made the Dallas deal worse, but it looks like Singleton has some value.

[hands11]

http://www.nba.com/playerfile/al_thornt ... stats.html

Not a bad addition. Right ?

Should be interesting without a viable center. McGee is going to get a crash course I guess.

If Z isn't going to step foot here then I just hope we find a way to keep Blatche at PF.

I guess McGee and Fabs are our centers ?

Mike James is about to go inactive again. Not sure what the motivation is for him to do a buy out since no one else is going to pick him up. May as well sit back and collect the cash. He is probably done in this league anyway.

[yungal07]

Al Thornton is getting hated on, but I'll stand up for the guy.

Liked his game at FSU - I always thought his size and decent shooting touch would translate well to the pros. The problem with Al -- as with many players that went to schools where they were stars -- is that he developed into a very selfish players during his years in college. Even when he made it to the pros, he was given the green light to shoot first, pass second. Not until this year has the Clips coaching staff really try and force him to play a team game, and it did not bode well for his numbers. The guy is already 26, so pretty much what you see is what you're going to get, but he brings those abilities you would want in a sub. A decent shooting touch, an inate ability to score, a decent rebounder, and the physical gifts to defend. He's not a guy you want to give 30+ minutes a night to, but he can definitely be a guy you can keep around to round out your 9 man rotation. Not a bad insurance policy if M&M leaves, but ideally I want to resign Mike and have Thornton and Singleton back him up.

[Hoopalotta]

Thornton has a fantastic NBA body. I could seem him as instant inefficient offense off the bench. If we're smart, we'll be a pretty bad team next year and that could have some utility in a limited volume. I mean, ideally there would be some passing involved, but....

Singleton look like a keeper. I'm calling it now, $2.25 million for two years. By giving him a mini multi-year deal, we show faith in him which has him bring that much more enthusiasm and excitement than if he was just on a one year minimum deal. Obviously it was his first game and there was lots of adrenaline, but he looks like the kind of guy who's energy level is going to be a boost to the whole team, in that, if he's playing hard, ery'body gotta play harder if they don't want to look bad.

Buys into the program. Sets picks. D's up. Unselfish. I would be shocked if he wasn't a good practice player. What's not to like? Solid fourth big on a scrappy lottery team at least.

[verbal8]

Thornton has a fantastic NBA body. I could seem him as instant inefficient offense off the bench. If we're smart, we'll be a pretty bad team next year and that could have some utility in a limited volume. I mean, ideally there would be some passing involved, but....

Singleton look like a keeper. I'm calling it now, $2.25 million for two years. By giving him a mini multi-year deal, we show faith in him which has him bring that much more enthusiasm and excitement than if he was just on a one year minimum deal. Obviously it was his first game and there was lots of adrenaline, but he looks like the kind of guy who's energy level is going to be a boost to the whole team, in that, if he's playing hard, ery'body gotta play harder if they don't want to look bad.

Buys into the program. Sets picks. D's up. Unselfish. I would be shocked if he wasn't a good practice player. What's not to like? Solid fourth big on a scrappy lottery team at least.

I like him a lot better than Oberto. He isn't young, but he have a couple more years before he starts to decline.

[TsunamiZC]

James is a great hustle guy, I'm interested to see what he can do with actual minutes, he couldnt get much when he was in Dallas, he was always stuck behind Bass or Humphries, and he has developed at decent jump shot with some range.

[dobrojim]

Singleton never gave up on a play, and he knows where to place his body on offense and defense. Tough, high energy player that I knew virtually nothing about prior to the trade.

+1 on all that. In some ways he reminds me of a more thuggish (in a good way)
DMac. Except he actually hit a jump shot. His statline, 2-6 shooting, didn't bother
me when I read it.

I thought he did a better job on AlJeff than McGee did, which may be damning
with faint praise. But at his size, Jeff should have abused him. But he didn't.
Limited sample size.

[dobrojim]

Al Thornton is getting hated on, but I'll stand up for the guy.

Liked his game at FSU - I always thought his size and decent shooting touch would translate well to the pros. The problem with Al -- as with many players that went to schools where they were stars -- is that he developed into a very selfish players during his years in college. Even when he made it to the pros, he was given the green light to shoot first, pass second. Not until this year has the Clips coaching staff really try and force him to play a team game, and it did not bode well for his numbers. The guy is already 26, so pretty much what you see is what you're going to get, but he brings those abilities you would want in a sub. A decent shooting touch, an inate ability to score, a decent rebounder, and the physical gifts to defend. He's not a guy you want to give 30+ minutes a night to, but he can definitely be a guy you can keep around to round out your 9 man rotation. Not a bad insurance policy if M&M leaves, but ideally I want to resign Mike and have Thornton and Singleton back him up.

I'll say this - I'm not sure either of these trades was that bad from a value standpoint.
I like Thornton and agree from what limited I seen, with your assessment.

On the DAL deal, I think it's arguable that we got the player in Howard that had
the highest NBA accomplishment on his resume, 2nd best player on the reg season
champ, WESTERN CONF all-star. Caron's number look better and has 2 AS appearances
to Howard's one, so Caron's peak was achieved over a more sustained time. But I'd
say Howard's peak was higher if briefly.

My point being that one way to grade trades is to simply look at who got
the single best player in the trade. I won't say that that is always the
best way to grade trades, but it can be useful to consider.

I'll miss Haywood a ton. That said, I had to shake my head somewhat when
I kept hearing the ESPN guys say he has great hands last night. Haywood
is going to love playing with Kidd for sure, but that hasn't changed his
skillset. At least Haywood will finally get the proper recognition for
what he is. Perhaps now he'll begin to be OVER-rated. Still hoping
DAL knocks off LA though.

[SaintofKillers]

James Singleton
Singleton is a great energy guy and fans (naturally) fall in love with guys like that whenever they bring it. But the reality of the situation is: he's an average 6'8" C/PF. If he had a consistent jumper he could pass off as a 3 (like we did last year) but it's just not something you can get away with for more than a few games and spots here and there.

Quinton Ross
Now that Bowen's gone, the best perimeter defender in the league I have ever seen is Ross, hands down. Unfortunately, unlike Battier and company -- he has no offensive game to speak of. Think of how much of an offensive juggernaut Battier is and then look at Ross again. He's the offensive liabilities of all offensive liabilities.

Josh Howard
His first 3 years Josh was my favorite Mav. He understood his role as a defender, rebounder, hustle guy who will take a maximum of 10 shots all within the offense. He wasn't athletic, but the guy made up for it with super energy and a work horse attitude.

Then after the loss to Miami, Avery decided that we should give him the ball every freaking time and make Dirk a decoy. That was the year he became an "all star", I believe -- even though those were the most (Please Use More Appropriate Word) 20 points I have ever seen. That led to the Josh we're seeing now who shoots stepback jumpers with reckless abandon like he's the inbred son of Michael Jordan and Larry Bird. Worse: when his shot is off (and it almost always is), he sulks off completely on other areas of his game.

Oh and let's not forget the injuries. I'm too lazy to look at his stats but it's impossible to see him and Devin on the floor together because they were injured all the time. You can throw in their IR buddy Quis there as well.

[montestewart]

James Singleton
Singleton is a great energy guy and fans (naturally) fall in love with guys like that whenever they bring it. But the reality of the situation is: he's an average 6'8" C/PF. If he had a consistent jumper he could pass off as a 3 (like we did last year) but it's just not something you can get away with for more than a few games and spots here and there.

Quinton Ross
Now that Bowen's gone, the best perimeter defender in the league I have ever seen is Ross, hands down. Unfortunately, unlike Battier and company -- he has no offensive game to speak of. Think of how much of an offensive juggernaut Battier is and then look at Ross again. He's the offensive liabilities of all offensive liabilities.

Josh Howard
His first 3 years Josh was my favorite Mav. He understood his role as a defender, rebounder, hustle guy who will take a maximum of 10 shots all within the offense. He wasn't athletic, but the guy made up for it with super energy and a work horse attitude.

Then after the loss to Miami, Avery decided that we should give him the ball every freaking time and make Dirk a decoy. That was the year he became an "all star", I believe -- even though those were the most (Please Use More Appropriate Word) 20 points I have ever seen. That led to the Josh we're seeing now who shoots stepback jumpers with reckless abandon like he's the inbred son of Michael Jordan and Larry Bird. Worse: when his shot is off (and it almost always is), he sulks off completely on other areas of his game.

Oh and let's not forget the injuries. I'm too lazy to look at his stats but it's impossible to see him and Devin on the floor together because they were injured all the time. You can throw in their IR buddy Quis there as well.

Yeah, Ross is bad offensively; career FG/3P/Ft percentages of .422/.336/.727. Why, that almost as bad as . . . Deshawn Stevenson. As to Singleton being average, if an average player's coming off the bench, he's usually above average. Singleton's numbers look a little below average, but if he always does what he did in the first game, he's an above average bench/role player.

[verbal8]

Josh Howard
His first 3 years Josh was my favorite Mav. He understood his role as a defender, rebounder, hustle guy who will take a maximum of 10 shots all within the offense. He wasn't athletic, but the guy made up for it with super energy and a work horse attitude.

Then after the loss to Miami, Avery decided that we should give him the ball every freaking time and make Dirk a decoy. That was the year he became an "all star", I believe -- even though those were the most (Please Use More Appropriate Word) 20 points I have ever seen. That led to the Josh we're seeing now who shoots stepback jumpers with reckless abandon like he's the inbred son of Michael Jordan and Larry Bird. Worse: when his shot is off (and it almost always is), he sulks off completely on other areas of his game.

Oh and let's not forget the injuries. I'm too lazy to look at his stats but it's impossible to see him and Devin on the floor together because they were injured all the time. You can throw in their IR buddy Quis there as well.

The Josh Howard story does not sound terribly different from what happened with Butler in Washington. Both guys broke out but basically ended up being in situation where they started to force things too much. Also both have injury issues. I think Howard's have more of a potential to threaten his career, where Butler does not have any one serious issue but always seems to miss 15-20 games. Hopefully Howard finds his grove in Washington and someone wants him in a S&T for a little over the MLE.

Yeah, Ross is bad offensively; career FG/3P/Ft percentages of .422/.336/.727. Why, that almost as bad as . . . Deshawn Stevenson.

The difference between Ross and Stevenson is Ross is paid what his role warrants.

The Wizards still need a defensive minded back-up center(hopefully McGee takes the starting spot). But I think Singleton can make Oberto and DMac(already done) expendable.

[closg00]

I don't know Jack about Thornton other than he was a lotto pick so I picked-up some pro-con stuff from the Clips board. The concensus is that he has not lived-up to where he was picked (like Young?), but some love his hops.

Again we don't need to sign a max player we need to get assests that could help us next season. We get some young hungry talent in here and things could look better this is poor direction by the franchise. We gave up a lotto player for trash

I agree that the important thing is to get assets and build a good team. Thornton was a lotto player, that hasn't looked like a lotto player for quite some time. He has gotten a lot of hate from fans based on his play and lack of development (regression). I defended the dude like crazy, trying to focus on the positives as opposed to the negatives, but he hasn't shown that he is worth this franchise penciling him in as an important cog into the future.

Seems like you're the one OVERRATING Thornton. If you really have watched every Clipper game, you'd notice that he's a black hole with a low bball IQ. The guy has a 40" vertical and supreme athleticism, yet has no idea how to use it. He would be great on a 10-win team. But if the Clippers are gonna be serious about contending for a playoff spot, Thornton has no room on this team. SF's like him are a dime-a-dozen.

And yes, I would go after D-Wade without a doubt.

Actually, I'm okay with this trade. Thornton is just not where he should be right now, given his physical abilities. While it's not like I wanted to get rid of him badly, but if we had to get rid of one of our core players, it might as well be him. I am going to miss his occasional Kobe-esque fadeaway shots.

[montestewart]

The difference between Ross and Stevenson is Ross is paid what his role warrants.

I'm open to the difference being more than that, based on the following:

Now that Bowen's gone, the best perimeter defender in the league I have ever seen is Ross, hands down.

Those are strong words, more than I've heard about Ross. I've always heard he was a good defender, but I haven't seen him play much. If he comes near the above description, that's more than Stevenson, who was more fearlessness and effort than ability, and Stevenson was not a good offensive player, so if Ross isn't either, no great loss, especially if he's used correctly (that is, not starting and/or playing 25-30 minutes). Perhaps Ross is an upgrade, "irregardless" of salary.

[chrbal]

Not a Wizards fan.

I thought the Wash/Dall trade was horrible, until I saw all the other deals this team did.

Unloading Jamison AND getting a 1st round pick was a very good deal. Even with Zydrunas on a mini-vacation until he goes back to Cleveland.

Drew Gooden for Al Thorton was nothing short of brilliant. Al has some issues, but you hate to say it...but I honestly believe a lot of it comes from playing about 2 1/2 years for the Clippers organization. Trading Marcus Camby for two expirings, when Marcus is an expiring, just because you can. Thank god I'm not a Clippers fan.

The throwaway trade of Dominic McGuire made too much sense not to happen.

The only way this deadline could of gone better, is if Mike Miller was traded for a prospect and some filler. But that would be asking too much.

A lot depends on the draft and such, but Washington has actually put itself in a good posistion for the 1st time in a while.

[Hoopalotta]

Now, I'm sure Ed Wood is going to administer a swift chop to my larynx for saying so, but I'm intrigued by the prospect of going into 2011 with Thornton as the starting small forward.

*runs for cover*

I had not realized the volume of ill advised shots that he's capable of putting up or the number of games he had started or the minutes he had played.

Now, the kicker for me is that the guy makes $2.8 million and we can just walk away the year after that. I mean, sure, he's not efficient, but what are we doing next year anyway? He's by all accounts a nice enough guy and it sounds like Flip likes him (Al was fine in the interview). He'll be motivated in a contract year, that's for sure.

But $2.8 million for the starting small forward? That's fantastic for our purposes, especially if Gil is bought out.

We gotta put 90 points on the board and giving up 96 is fine, so why not with Al?

We well might not be drafting a scorer with our pick at all (Favors/Aminu/Davis/Aldrich), so Al putting up 18 points on 16 shots is relatively helpful for a gutter-ball club with Singleton and Ross somewhere in the rotation.

I like it a heck of a lot better than overpaying to keep Mike Miller, considering where we is.

And no, we wouldn't resign him. Unless, maybe.....

*Suddenly struck dead by lightning*

[Ruzious]

No question - with Al, we can certainly put up the lineup with the top combo of physical abiltiy, low BBIQ, and low salary - perfect for a rebuilding team.

[DaRealHibachi]

Just wanna give a shoutout to Singleton, Thorton and Howard... They were beastin tonight...