Chris Bosh Sign and Trade Ideas

[Dr Positivity]

If he is S&T'd for nothing (like a conditonal future 2nd round pick), you are guaranteed to get back a $16.6M TPE.

But seriously, if Miami said "no"...what do you think Bosh and his agent would do?

It all depends and it's a lot of speculation. I find your scenario ironic because if Bosh would be such a great guy he wouldn't screw BC over like that, i.e. blackmailing him to walk away from his bird rights if he doesn't cooperate. It would mean he's not cooperating to help both parties get the best possible deal not really what you'd expect of a 'model citizen'. Imo Bosh appreciates the business aspect of the NBA and he wouldn't do such a thing. Nor does he have one destination trumping all others at this point, and I doubt that will change - as long as it's a contending team or the closest thing to it.

But that is exactly what BC (well, not BC...but most fans) are stating BC will do to Bosh. Blackmail him over a 6th year. And BC is supposed to be a nice guy himself.

The sentiment here is..."Bosh, if you want that 6th year, we work something out.....and by the way....a TPE isn't enough.".

That is the sticking point. What "is" enough? Heck, BC could demand 5 first round draft picks from any team that wants Bosh if Bosh wants that 6th year. (I doubt that will happen, but I hope you understand the example).


I really don't know what would happen if Miami said "no". I guess it all depends on where Bosh has his heart set...or if he has a list of "solid" locations.

I think that's where you're error-ing. There's only two situations Miami says 'no'

a) Amare is available for 100 mil straight up, no return going back

b) They prefer Boozer/Lee/Johnson and nothing going back to Bosh/Amare at the cost of a future 1st

I think we can all but rule out b). As for a) it would screw us, but I don't see why Amare or his agent would settle for the 100 contract. I think signing Amare will be identical to signing Bosh. They'll want 130 mil, and to get it will cost our future 1st. Thus for Miami they'll either take one of those packages or get neither player and trust me, they'll take Bosh/Amare, they've been waiting to sign a max PF for the last 2 years

[pass first]

If anything the agents will be on BC's side. They'd push their client to the 6 year max with a team that's not their #1 preferred destination over walking away from his Bird rights.

[panthermark]

People are taking this "his agent will threatenz us!!!" thing too far. All Falk cares about is getting Bosh 130 mil in the city of his choosing. Whether Miami has to give up something for that is up to Riley and Colangelo, it has nothing to do with the agent or the potential of him threatening a team to give up nothing for its player

Frankly I think the idea of agents threatening GMs to be ridiculous anyways. Contract negotiations go on every year where players aren't offered as much as they want. Don't you think if agents could "threaten" teams into giving the highest contract, they'd push their teams into giving higher contracts? Like if Elton Brand's agent two years ago told the Clippers "you'll give Elton 100 mil OR ELSE!!!" Of course that didn't happen. Brand's leverage was leaving them cold, not the agent

This summer if Lebron wants out, NY will sign him for the 100 mil straight up. Will Cleveland get blackballed for not 130 mil S&Ting him to NY? Hell no

Here's what will happen with Miami and Bosh/Amare. Both players will want 130 mil from the team they land on. THAT's the main impact their agents will have. You're not getting one of them unless you give up 130. Miami will know this and will decide between Bosh/Amare at 130 mil + giving up a future 1st, or Boozer or Lee at 80 mil. I am 98% sure they will prefer the Bosh/Amare deal of those two options, they've clearly been pushing for a max guy. So they will agree with the one they choose of those two to sign for 130 mil, and they will give up our 1st and a TPE for him or two 1sts + dumping Jones/Cook or something

You continue to dance around the question(s). Let's just go back.

#1 What if Miami says "no". What will Bosh and his agent do?
#2 Is a full TPE enough?

[pass first]

You continue to dance around the question(s). Let's just go back.

#1 What if Miami says "no". What will Bosh and his agent do?
#2 Is a full TPE enough?

You continue to ask a question that can't be answered without speculating. It seems you only want to hear a doom scenario answer too.

#2. no way (imo)

[panthermark]

I disagree. 6th year of a max contract isn't some kind of god-given right. It's a privilege. If Bosh goes I'm sure he'll want it though and knows there's strings attached. BC and CB will have mutual interests to get a S&T done so I think it'll work out fine. Bosh isn't stupid so he'll understand BC can't just bend over to other teams.

I agree, a 6th year isn't a God given right...but neither is getting anything in return for an unrestricted free agent that is leaving.

[panthermark]

You continue to dance around the question(s). Let's just go back.

#1 What if Miami says "no". What will Bosh and his agent do?
#2 Is a full TPE enough?

You continue to ask a question that can't be answered without speculating. It seems you only want to hear a doom scenario answer too.

#2. no way (imo)

#1 Fair enough...(but all of this is speculation anyway...Bosh could end up staying)

#2 OK...thank you for stating your opinion.

[pass first]

I disagree. 6th year of a max contract isn't some kind of god-given right. It's a privilege. If Bosh goes I'm sure he'll want it though and knows there's strings attached. BC and CB will have mutual interests to get a S&T done so I think it'll work out fine. Bosh isn't stupid so he'll understand BC can't just bend over to other teams.

I agree, a 6th year isn't a God given right...but neither is getting anything in return for an unrestricted free agent that is leaving.

True but the beauty is, both GM and player have the same interest. To get a deal done.

For the record: I think the chance is close to zero that Bosh pulls something like this if let's say, BC comes to him and says he can't work a S&T with the Heat but he can with Houston, for example. I don't believe Bosh will respond by making BC take a TPE than instead or else give up his 6th year.

[pass first]

You continue to dance around the question(s). Let's just go back.

#1 What if Miami says "no". What will Bosh and his agent do?
#2 Is a full TPE enough?

You continue to ask a question that can't be answered without speculating. It seems you only want to hear a doom scenario answer too.

#2. no way (imo)

#1 Fair enough...(but all of this is speculation anyway...Bosh could end up staying)

#2 OK...thank you for stating your opinion.

True, but that's different speculation. And inevitable. Going into detail in negotiations and possible trade scenarios that are being forced on BC, is a different level.

Trade exceptions are just kind of useless imo. Magic never used the Hedo one and it's almost expiring. Btw I don't think the Heat will have any problem parting with the Raps future. Could turn out to be a 'worthless' late first in 2015.

[Qhawe]

Best scenerio is if Lakers lose and we get bynum in a trade

[panthermark]

Trade exceptions are just kind of useless imo. Magic never used the Hedo one and it's almost expiring. Btw I don't think the Heat will have any problem parting with the Raps future. Could turn out to be a 'worthless' late first in 2015.

A lot of the times, trade exceptions are useless because teams are at, or over, the luxury tax limits...and are trying to dump salary....so taking on salary isn't in the plans. Also, a lot of smaller TPE's end up being useless because they have to be used in one on one trades.

A $16.6M TPE would be unheard of...and would be very usefull to a team that would be well under the luxury tax limit..but right at the salary cap limit. For instance...Toronto could actually get into a bidding war FOR Boozer or Joe Johnson. Those players could be S&T'd to Toronto and absorbed using the TPE...without returning matching salary.

Or maybe you absorb...Okafor's contact. Or Biedrins... Or break the TPE up and use it to absorb Peja and get ahold of Collison.

A TPE of that size to a team with room under the luxury tax would be very valuable.

[pass first]

Trade exceptions are just kind of useless imo. Magic never used the Hedo one and it's almost expiring. Btw I don't think the Heat will have any problem parting with the Raps future. Could turn out to be a 'worthless' late first in 2015.

A lot of the times, trade exceptions are useless because teams are at, or over, the luxury tax limits...and are trying to dump salary....so taking on salary isn't in the plans. Also, a lot of smaller TPE's end up being useless because they have to be used in one on one trades.

A $16.6M TPE would be unheard of...and would be very usefull to a team that would be well under the luxury tax limit..but right at the salary cap limit. For instance...Toronto could actually get into a bidding war FOR Boozer or Joe Johnson. Those players could be S&T'd to Toronto and absorbed using the TPE...without returning matching salary.

Or maybe you absorb...Okafor's contact. Or Biedrins... Or break the TPE up and use it to absorb Peja and get ahold of Collison.

A TPE of that size to a team with room under the luxury tax would be very valuable.

Ok I know what you mean. In that case, if I were BC, I'd only do it if I have a solid follow up deal lined up. Still would insist on a first rounder too though, or something, especially if it's the Heat because they own our future pick.

[douggood]

Trade exceptions are just kind of useless imo. Magic never used the Hedo one and it's almost expiring. Btw I don't think the Heat will have any problem parting with the Raps future. Could turn out to be a 'worthless' late first in 2015.

magic never used the tpe because the were in the lux tax territory.
the clippers used the tpe to get camby, okc used the cap space essentially like the tpe to get maynor from utah, memphis picked up brewer on the cheap for the same reason.

[Hypz]

I got a question for you NBA capologist-types. Would a 1-for-1 trade make sense financially and for each team's situation, when it comes to the big 4 agents, essentially a swap? ie. CB4 for Joe Johnson, or Dwade for LeBron? I don't know why, but this idea just popped into my head and it seems realistic to me. Each team can claim it's doing something to 'shake it up' and the future is bright with their new player, the players involved get their pay-day + the trade is pretty simple, no multiple teams or picks etc. involved. Any input?

[panthermark]

I got a question for you NBA capologist-types. Would a 1-for-1 trade make sense financially and for each team's situation, when it comes to the big 4 agents, essentially a swap? ie. CB4 for Joe Johnson, or Dwade for LeBron? I don't know why, but this idea just popped into my head and it seems realistic to me. Each team can claim it's doing something to 'shake it up' and the future is bright with their new player, the players involved get their pay-day + the trade is pretty simple, no multiple teams or picks etc. involved. Any input?

Well, it depends on the trades and if a player will end up BYC (20% raise)...but most of the big names (Bron, Wade, Bosh) will be capped at 105% of salary.

So for the most part...most of the teams could do "double" S&T's. So yeah...Bosh could be traded for Johnson if JJ...I'm assuming JJ gets $15M first year and was OK with coming to Toronto.

[pass first]

I got a question for you NBA capologist-types. Would a 1-for-1 trade make sense financially and for each team's situation, when it comes to the big 4 agents, essentially a swap? ie. CB4 for Joe Johnson, or Dwade for LeBron? I don't know why, but this idea just popped into my head and it seems realistic to me. Each team can claim it's doing something to 'shake it up' and the future is bright with their new player, the players involved get their pay-day + the trade is pretty simple, no multiple teams or picks etc. involved. Any input?

Only makes sense imo if two players perceived value is equal and more importantly, if it fills a team need for both. Which is very unlikely for max FA's imo. They're pretty much always the best player on their team. Most fans won't want to swap their hero for a new one I don't think, if it's not a clear upgrade. With near max players it could be different imo. Joe Johnson for Carlos Boozer I could see that. Not saying it's realistic but they're not real franchise players, so I think the teams aren't as reluctant to trade those guys and like you say, shake it up.

[Walid]

Is there a way we could pry OJ Mayo / Rudy Gay and Marc Gasol for Bosh? Just wondering.

[panthermark]

Is there a way we could pry OJ Mayo / Rudy Gay and Marc Gasol for Bosh? Just wondering.

Nope, why would Bosh agree to go to a depleted, small market team? And what would they do with Zach?

[bulletbill]

Deng (also plays PF and is a good rebounder), future 1st, and rights to Omer Asik (23 y/o 7', 260lb defensive shot blocking gorilla Turkish center)

for Bosh

[dagger]

Deng (also plays PF and is a good rebounder), future 1st, and rights to Omer Asik (23 y/o 7', 260lb defensive shot blocking gorilla Turkish center)

for Bosh

So now we would have two grossly overpaid, under-performing small forwards?

Big contract, redundancy, crappy first, prospect who might never come to the NBA or amount to anything?

For that, Bosh can walk for nothing IMO

[bulletbill]

Deng (also plays PF and is a good rebounder), future 1st, and rights to Omer Asik (23 y/o 7', 260lb defensive shot blocking gorilla Turkish center)

for Bosh

So now we would have two grossly overpaid, under-performing small forwards?

Big contract, redundancy, crappy first, prospect who might never come to the NBA or amount to anything?

For that, Bosh can walk for nothing IMO

I understand you have Hedo, but IMO that shouldn't deter you from acquiring the better player. Somewhat similar, the Pistons signed Gordon knowing they still had RIP (big minute player still, traded soon?). Point is I think you can pump Hedo up and sell him, and then have Deng slide in. If you don't think thats possible, then I understand why you'd be against it. But the assumption is Deng to be the superior player going forward.