"No More Euros"- A Clarification

[Italia Raps Fan]

Ginobili's a Euro?

I'm sorry but this stuff is funny. Most of Argentina's basketball program is European. You realize the people from Spain, Germany and Italy left at the end of World War II on into the '60s and moved there?

Argentina's national team FYI:

Walter Hermann - German family
Manu Ginobili - Italian family
Luis Scola - Spanish family
Carlos Delfino - Italian family
Pablo Prigioni - Italian family
Ruben Wolkowski - Polish family
Fabricio Oberto - Italian family
Pepe Sanchez - Spanish family
Alejandro Montecchia - Italian family
Paolo Quinteros - Spanish family
Marcelo Nicola - Italian family
Hugo Sconochini - Italian family
Lucas Victorino - Spanish family
Antonio Porta - Italian family
Nicolas Gianella - Italian family


etc., etc., etc. The only Argentine guy I can even think of is Gutierrez. Delfino I believe is half Italian and half Native American. The rest of all their players I can think of from this decade are 100% European, directly from Spain, Italy, or Germany. Argentina's team is made up of grandchildren and children of people from Italy, Spain, Germany, Poland and they all played basketball in Europe. Why do you think Argentina's team plays an exact European style of basketball?

It's because the basketball system itself came mainly from Europeans that moved there after World War II. In fact, about Ginobili, he is an Italian citizen since birth. Think about it man, this is not hard. Does the name Ginobili not sound Italian?

[Ripp]

Most European basketball fans have just come to believe that the majority of NBA fans in North America are racists against whites and xenophobes against Europeans. We have believed this for a long time now. Basically, according to most North American NBA fans, everyone in Europe is "slow, non-athletic, weak, soft, non-competitive, can't dunk, can't play defense, is afraid of physical contact, and is stiff". What we have been educated to know from the North American side is what a "Euro" is. Fortunately, in Europe, we did not stoop to the same low level and start calling the other side "Africans" and well, you get the idea.

We have been told this over and over for years by North American NBA fans that we are simply "physically inferior to American blacks".

I hate to break it to anyone here that thinks otherwise, but in Europe we already came to the acceptance that most North American NBA fans are racist and xenophobic years ago. Any changes the forum tries to make to stop that blatant racism and xenophobia is very welcome from me, but the damage is done already. North American NBA fans have a very strong reputation internationally as being racist against Asians and whites and as being xenophobic against Europeans and Chinese.

We aren't the guys who did the Chinaman picture in the 2008 Olympics...look, you can't make this thing about racism. The NBA is by and large run and owned by white Americans, and the fan base is by and large white Americans. And they are the ones making decisions here, and saying they don't want Euros.
In any case, it isn't as if all European players are terrible. The ones who can rebound and play defense are usually very good. You have up and coming guys like Gallinari who look like they'll be very good players. Just because we don't like Bargs doesn't mean we hate Euros...we just don't like the garbage ones. Give me a Gallo, but I'll run away from a Bargs.

[Italia Raps Fan]

Most European basketball fans have just come to believe that the majority of NBA fans in North America are racists against whites and xenophobes against Europeans. We have believed this for a long time now. Basically, according to most North American NBA fans, everyone in Europe is "slow, non-athletic, weak, soft, non-competitive, can't dunk, can't play defense, is afraid of physical contact, and is stiff". What we have been educated to know from the North American side is what a "Euro" is. Fortunately, in Europe, we did not stoop to the same low level and start calling the other side "Africans" and well, you get the idea.

We have been told this over and over for years by North American NBA fans that we are simply "physically inferior to American blacks".

I hate to break it to anyone here that thinks otherwise, but in Europe we already came to the acceptance that most North American NBA fans are racist and xenophobic years ago. Any changes the forum tries to make to stop that blatant racism and xenophobia is very welcome from me, but the damage is done already. North American NBA fans have a very strong reputation internationally as being racist against Asians and whites and as being xenophobic against Europeans and Chinese.

We aren't the guys who did the Chinaman picture in the 2008 Olympics...look, you can't make this thing about racism. The NBA is by and large run and owned by white Americans, and the fan base is by and large white Americans. And they are the ones making decisions here, and saying they don't want Euros.
In any case, it isn't as if all European players are terrible. The ones who can rebound and play defense are usually very good. You have up and coming guys like Gallinari who look like they'll be very good players. Just because we don't like Bargs doesn't mean we hate Euros...we just don't like the garbage ones. Give me a Gallo, but I'll run away from a Bargs.

NBA fans from North America call European players "Euros". And "Euro" we are told means soft, slow, can't jump, can't play defense", etc.

That is racist. In Europe we don't call black American players "Africans" and we don't say that if they come to Europe and suck it's because "Africans can't shoot, are lazy, are slow" or whatever racist comment you could think of. Like I said, NBA fans are generally regarded as being racists pretty much in every country in the world outside of the US and Canada.

And don't think that many people in the US don't believe the NBA is racist either. I saw on ESPN once where they talked about it and they said that the NBA was racist against white Americans because they promote and market that the NBA is the black man's sport and that white kids can only play college ball. Whites from the US should stick to hockey, baseball, and American football.

The ESPN commentators even said that the fact these European white players can easily play in the NBA and American white players by majority can't nearly as much or well, that it was proof of this racism. They all agreed the NBA was racist against whites and that it was considered that only blacks can play in it and that is racist.

They also mentioned how the "white man can't jump" was considered funny and was made by a black NBA fan. Then they pointed out how if someone made a film "black men can't shoot" that there would be a mass outrage and outcry. They also said that most white people in the US view the NBA as racist against whites.

There is absolutely no explanation for a 17% minority (blacks) making up 97% of the NBA players other than racism. In any other field, or job the company would have been shut down and there would be laws against that. There is not one other company that would not be called racist with those demographics. The NBA is clearly a racist organization and the fact that most of its fans are also racist is no surprise. It IS racism. As I said, we accepted in Europe a long time ago that we would always be bad mouthed in the NBA unless we were black.

It's no coincidence that France's players are never characterized as "Euros". What a strange coincidence that they are black.

[0_0]

Most European basketball fans have just come to believe that the majority of NBA fans in North America are racists against whites and xenophobes against Europeans. We have believed this for a long time now. Basically, according to most North American NBA fans, everyone in Europe is "slow, non-athletic, weak, soft, non-competitive, can't dunk, can't play defense, is afraid of physical contact, and is stiff". What we have been educated to know from the North American side is what a "Euro" is. Fortunately, in Europe, we did not stoop to the same low level and start calling the other side "Africans" and well, you get the idea.

We have been told this over and over for years by North American NBA fans that we are simply "physically inferior to American blacks".

I hate to break it to anyone here that thinks otherwise, but in Europe we already came to the acceptance that most North American NBA fans are racist and xenophobic years ago. Any changes the forum tries to make to stop that blatant racism and xenophobia is very welcome from me, but the damage is done already. North American NBA fans have a very strong reputation internationally as being racist against Asians and whites and as being xenophobic against Europeans and Chinese.

We aren't the guys who did the Chinaman picture in the 2008 Olympics...look, you can't make this thing about racism. The NBA is by and large run and owned by white Americans, and the fan base is by and large white Americans. And they are the ones making decisions here, and saying they don't want Euros.
In any case, it isn't as if all European players are terrible. The ones who can rebound and play defense are usually very good. You have up and coming guys like Gallinari who look like they'll be very good players. Just because we don't like Bargs doesn't mean we hate Euros...we just don't like the garbage ones. Give me a Gallo, but I'll run away from a Bargs.

Then why bother posting "no more Euros" while then explain you just don't like bad players. Wouldn't it be easier to skip the middle man and just blame bad players for our problems, not Euros.

[Ripp]

NBA fans from North America call European players "Euros". And "Euro" we are told means soft, slow, can't jump, can't play defense", etc.

That is racist.

The NBA fans you mention are primarily white dudes whose ancestors came from Europe sometime over the past 400 years. A good bulk of them are guys who came in the 1900s, some of whom still have relatives in Europe. So they are racist for saying those things about European players, guys who are from the exact same racial group as themselves? This explains a lot of the problems with white America eh.....deep self-hatred and racism against itself.
Or in reality, they don't give a damn about race and care more about winning, and realize that having too many Euros on your roster decreases the chances of winning?

In Europe we don't call black American players "Africans" and we don't say that if they come to Europe and suck it's because "Africans can't shoot, are lazy, are slow" or whatever racist comment you could think of.

Man, this is pretty false...we've all heard about your soccer hooliganism, and how they boo black soccer players, make monkey noises at them, and throw trash at them. Anyway, how is this example relevant? European sports are not run by Africans. American sports are run by white guys. So basketball is a case of a white owner/GM saying he doesn't want a white player on his team.

Like I said, NBA fans are generally regarded as being racists pretty much in every country in the world outside of the US and Canada.

Citation? You can't just state this...you have to provide a reference from a reputable source. Truth be told, from what I've seen and heard of soccer in Europe, Europe sounds like a lot more racist place than the US. At least we aren't beating down our Turkish, Indian, Pakistani, North African minorities here, as you guys do in Europe...
Not to talk of what you guys still do to the Roma. Please do not get on any high horse, we all read the newspapers too here in the US. Europe trying to call the US or anyone else racist is the pot calling the kettle black..

[CBC_Raptor]

Racism is alive and well in every country in this world. The worst is when you pretend or assume it doesn't exist because you live in a "multicultural" society. This world still has a long way to go.

[Alfred]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jwpO-nnFY9g[/youtube]

[Ripp]

And don't think that many people in the US don't believe the NBA is racist either. I saw on ESPN once where they talked about it and they said that the NBA was racist against white Americans because they promote and market that the NBA is the black man's sport and that white kids can only play college ball. Whites from the US should stick to hockey, baseball, and American football.

The ESPN commentators even said that the fact these European white players can easily play in the NBA and American white players by majority can't nearly as much or well, that it was proof of this racism. They all agreed the NBA was racist against whites and that it was considered that only blacks can play in it and that is racist.

Can you provide a reference for some of these things you state? Like, which ESPN commentator? What was the name of the show, etc? You should be able to google and provide a reference...because right now I'm not really buying what you are selling.

They also mentioned how the "white man can't jump" was considered funny and was made by a black NBA fan. Then they pointed out how if someone made a film "black men can't shoot" that there would be a mass outrage and outcry. They also said that most white people in the US view the NBA as racist against whites.

So you are saying that ESPN commentators believe that the NBA, and organization primarily owned an run by white guys, is racist against white people? Can you explain to me why this makes any sense?

There is absolutely no explanation for a 17% minority (blacks) making up 97% of the NBA players other than racism.

Lol....there is also no explanation for Chinese female gymnasts to dominate the Olympics. Aside from racism.

Look, the simple reality is that there are certain athletic traits that show up more frequently in players of West African descent. It would be wonderful for profits if this were not the case...I suspect the NBA would be a lot more popular if these traits showed up more frequently in white people. There isn't some massive conspiracy by the shadowy NBA against white or Euro players. Owners and GMs just want to make money. And by and large, the best way to do this is to win lots of basketball games. The logical implications of this are obvious...I'll leave you to fill in the rest of the details.

[Italia Raps Fan]

I won't post again here. I have no interest in arguing with this guy who is clearly a racist. I will just say that I will greatly appreciate it if the forum mods ban this "Euros" stuff because it is very racist and should not be tolerated.

But I have no interest in arguing with people like this Ripp guy that are blatantly racist.

[Alfred]

Thinking that there is a conspiracy within the NBA to keep down white people is the most insane thing I have ever heard in my life. It's so completely ridiculous, I don't know how you could possibly think it.

[Alfred]

I won't post again here. I have no interest in arguing with this guy who is clearly a racist. I will just say that I will greatly appreciate it if the forum mods ban this "Euros" stuff because it is very racist and should not be tolerated.

But I have no interest in arguing with people like this Ripp guy that are blatantly racist.

No, I am the moderator, and absolutely NOTHING Ripp has said has been racist.

You are wrong, and he is right. Period.

[Italia Raps Fan]

I won't post again here. I have no interest in arguing with this guy who is clearly a racist. I will just say that I will greatly appreciate it if the forum mods ban this "Euros" stuff because it is very racist and should not be tolerated.

But I have no interest in arguing with people like this Ripp guy that are blatantly racist.

No, I am the moderator, and absolutely NOTHING Ripp has said has been racist.

You are wrong, and he is right. Period.

I don't want to get banned. I will never post on the Raps forum again. I know what racism is, and THAT IS racist. I will not post here again, because now I know you will be out to ban me.

[Alfred]

I won't post again here. I have no interest in arguing with this guy who is clearly a racist. I will just say that I will greatly appreciate it if the forum mods ban this "Euros" stuff because it is very racist and should not be tolerated.

But I have no interest in arguing with people like this Ripp guy that are blatantly racist.

No, I am the moderator, and absolutely NOTHING Ripp has said has been racist.

You are wrong, and he is right. Period.

I don't want to get banned. I will never post on the Raps forum again. I know what racism is, and THAT IS racist. I will not post here again, because now I know you will be out to ban me.

You actually do not know what racism is. If you don't want to post here again, stop saying that you are not going to post here again, and simply not post here again.

[Alfred]

I guess I'm racist against very poorly thought out arguments.

[Skeebs]

How can you say statements like 'no more euros' isnt racist, lol.

[pass first]

Citation? You can't just state this...you have to provide a reference from a reputable source. Truth be told, from what I've seen and heard of soccer in Europe, Europe sounds like a lot more racist place than the US. At least we aren't beating down our Turkish, Indian, Pakistani, North African minorities here, as you guys do in Europe...

Citation? You can't just state this...you have to provide a reference from a reputable source.

[Tha Cynic]

There is absolutely no explanation for a 17% minority (blacks) making up 97% of the NBA players other than racism. In any other field, or job the company would have been shut down and there would be laws against that. There is not one other company that would not be called racist with those demographics. The NBA is clearly a racist organization and the fact that most of its fans are also racist is no surprise. It IS racism. As I said, we accepted in Europe a long time ago that we would always be bad mouthed in the NBA unless we were black.

This has got to be one of the stupidest things ever posted. So, now the NBA is holding back white players, and that's why there are so many black players in the league? Really? There is no other explanation as to why there are so many black players in the league? There are a lot of factors that go into it, like the traits of certain races, the economic situation the players grew up in and the culture they grew around. Slavery might have ended, but it still has a deep impact on future generations when it comes to one race's place on the social ladder. Black people didn't just suddenly turn rich after slavery ended. They can't afford to play games like hockey. Look around the league and check the background of each player and how they grew up. There's a general theme. They didn't grow up in rich homes like other players did. Have you seen the way the NBA is promoted? They've basically outlawed rap music and rap culture, which has been connected to basketball for years. If anything, the NBA is trying to make the game as white as it can possibly make it because their target audience is mainly white people.

I don't even understand why racism is being brought into this. The same people who hate Calderon, Bargnani and Turkoglu, would love to have guys like Ginobilli, Bogut, Fernandez, Marc Gasol and others. Clearly it's not a white, or even European thing. It's just easy to look at this team and see that the key European players are the major problems, so no one wants another European player drafted. If the Raptors ever drafted a player like Ginobilli do you think the posters on this board would want the guy traded because he's white or of European descent? No! People can say they don't want any more Euros on this team, but in the end, that's not really true. They just don't want the soft players the Raptors target, whether they be blue, green, or yellow.

If the Raptors had the San Antonio Spurs' scouting staff everyone would love for them to bring in international players because they understand the type of players they should be targeting. There's a reason why it seems like every other European player not on the Raptors is either an elite player or someone who's a tough SOB. Those teams understand what makes a good basketball team and which players would succeed in the North American game; the Raptors don't.

[Avenger]

What we have been educated to know from the North American side is what a "Euro" is. Fortunately, in Europe, we did not stoop to the same low level and start calling the other side "Africans" and well, you get the idea.

Oh no, you guys would never do that. You guys are content with throwing bananas or peanuts at African players and calling them monkeys.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tvU59WFp4ck
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W-iRLmaZ ... re=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gQv4aIXa ... re=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=36OPNTJG ... re=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=49MY_V_S ... re=related

[Tha Cynic]

What we have been educated to know from the North American side is what a "Euro" is. Fortunately, in Europe, we did not stoop to the same low level and start calling the other side "Africans" and well, you get the idea.

Oh no, you guys would never do that. You guys are content with throwing bananas or peanuts at African players and calling them monkeys.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tvU59WFp4ck
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W-iRLmaZ ... re=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gQv4aIXa ... re=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=36OPNTJG ... re=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=49MY_V_S ... re=related

I never understood the monkey chant. Do those idiots not realize that they evolved from monkeys too?

[Ripp]

I've spent some time thinking, trying to see things from Italia Raps Fan's perspective. I think the fundamental issue is that maybe he thinks that the NBA and Euroleague ball are both "basketball", and thus being good in one should mean being good in the other. If you held that point of view, then yes, it would seem odd that there are so few good white/European players in the NBA.

But the ruleset differences between the two games result in dramatically different traits required, in particular making elite athleticism a must-have.

So to some extent Italia Raps Fan is correct....the NBA ruleset places a premium on elite athleticism, thus making it a bit more challenging for European players to thrive.

But to be quite frank, if the NBA changed its ruleset to be more like college basketball or the Euroleague, I'd probably stop watching it as much. Athletic freaks in the NBA...Lebron, Wade, Monta Ellis, and Amare are part of what make watching the NBA fun.