MIA - NOH - WAS

[shrink]

MIA GIVES: James Jones + Cook (exp) + MIA 1st (#18) + $3 mil cash
MIA GETS: $8,465,297 additional 2010 Cap Space

NOH GIVES: Songalia (exp)
NOH GETS: James Jones (partially guaranteed)

WAS GIVES: TPE's
WAS GETS: MIA 1st (#18) + Songalia (exp) + Cook (exp) + $3 mil cash


WHY FOR MIA? This allows enough cap space for MIA to get two top free agents and keeps Beasley. James Jones three year, partially-guaranteed deal may be hard to get a team to accept, but using NOH to turn it into an expiring makes the package more palatable. This deal creates cap space:

4,650,000 James Jones ($1,856,000, $1,984,000, $2,112,000)
2,169,857 Daequan Cook
1,645,440 #16 (+ standard 20% raise)
8,465,297

Trading Jones rather than cutting him with the partially-guaranteed deal (which would reduce the cap space savings) helps MIA by knocking off $4.1 mil of future payments in 2011 and 2012.

WHY FOR NOH? NOH can waive Jones before his deadline, and remove 2010-11 lux taxes. After Songalia opts in (which can be done any time), the Hornets will be about $7 mil over the lux, when they add their pick and meet roster minimums. Even with a new owner in Chouest, they will probably try to head under the lux, and retain their lux share (additional $3-4 mil). This gets them halfway there, and doesn't cost them a valuable player.

$4,818,000 Songalia
$1,856,000 Jones (waived)
$2,962,000

NOH SAVINGS:
2010-11 $5,924,000 ($2,962,000 salary + $2,962,000 lux)
2011-12 -$1,984,000
2012-13 -$2,112,000
TOTAL $1,828,000 Savings

WHY FOR WAS? WAS uses their TPEs to buy a mid-first, with only one-year of expirings to deal with. They can use their TPE from the OPec trade to MIN which will expire soon on Cook, and part of their Haywood TPE for Songalia. I think its unlikely WAS will use all of its raw cap space on some elite free agent, so this deal allows them to add a decent 1st rounder to help their rebuild. This trade is primarily about the pick, but they liked Songalia when he was there before (he can return because he was traded before the 2009-10 season began) and with $3 mil in cash, the two players will probably provide close to $4 mil of production anyway.

[lukekarts]

I like it.

[Wade2k6]

Miami takes it.

[ecuhus1981]

I think NOH deserves the cash since they're doing the buying out, but I like the deal. MIA somehow makes out a bit too well, though.

[loserX]

Seems pretty sensible all around to me, as long as it fits in with what Chouest wants to do (which we don't really know yet). Nicely done.

[yungal07]

Seems very expensive for the Wizards. I don't know what the exact figure would be, but from it sounds like, it would be at close to ~5 mil+ for the #18 pick. That's too steep IMO.

[Hoops23]

that figure is incorrect. Miami will not get additional $8m of cap space with this trade.

James Jones buy out is $1.9m. Heat can trade the 1st pick for future pick if they want additional cap space.

James Jones & cook for additional $4m of cap space is not worth giving away the pick and cash. Besides, I still want to have Cook becuase he's salary is not a big burden and still has room for improvement for being young.

Miami is not desperate to do this trade because there still other options to dump James Jones.

[nate33]

Seems very expensive for the Wizards. I don't know what the exact figure would be, but from it sounds like, it would be at close to ~5 mil+ for the #18 pick. That's too steep IMO.

The Wizards take on Songaila's $5.1M plus Cook's $2.2M for a total of $7.3M. But they get $3M cash so the net outlay is $4.3M. I think that's about right for the #18 pick - particularly when you factor that they're getting a reasonably competent veteran big man as well. (And Songaila could probably be moved or bought out for some savings.)

I'd do it from Washington's perspective.

Hoops23 brings up a good point though. The bottom line is that James Jones' cap hit for 2010/11 isn't that big. He only costs them $1.8M, and they'd have to factor at least $500K for a minimum salary vet cap hold if they unloaded him. So basically, dumping Jones only saves them $1.3M in cap room. It's just not going to be a very high priority for them.

[Flash is the Future]

We'd have that cap hold either way if we're cutting him (and certainly, if it came to that, we would). As a Heat fan, I think we do it. It's not like we've ever cared too much about 1sts, anyway. Plus, by trading a 1.2M 1st, James Jones (1.856M), and Daequan Cook (2.1M), and replacing them with 2 minimum cap holds (1M, as Jones would have a cap hold when we cut him), we're effectively freeing 4.15M, which is significant enough for us to do this trade. If someone wanted to sweeten the pot for Miami, I'm sure we wouldn't mind getting another 2nd in this year's draft, where we'd be able to get another player on a cheap, minimum salary. The assumption is that we'd be able to include Beasley alone in a S&T for just about any player, so if we keep him, we don't care about his salary, and if we deal him, we don't care about his salary. If it were safe to assume the same of James Jones/Daequan Cook, we'd keep them too, but I don't think it is. Since picks, say, 24-30 tend to go for 3M, 4M for the 18th pick seems fairly reasonable.

[yungal07]

Seems very expensive for the Wizards. I don't know what the exact figure would be, but from it sounds like, it would be at close to ~5 mil+ for the #18 pick. That's too steep IMO.

The Wizards take on Songaila's $5.1M plus Cook's $2.2M for a total of $7.3M. But they get $3M cash so the net outlay is $4.3M. I think that's about right for the #18 pick - particularly when you factor that they're getting a reasonably competent veteran big man as well. (And Songaila could probably be moved or bought out for some savings.)

Yea but you're leaving out the salary you'd have to pay for that #18 pick. That would bring it to over 5 mil. That's still pretty steep IMO.

[Flash is the Future]

Seems very expensive for the Wizards. I don't know what the exact figure would be, but from it sounds like, it would be at close to ~5 mil+ for the #18 pick. That's too steep IMO.

The Wizards take on Songaila's $5.1M plus Cook's $2.2M for a total of $7.3M. But they get $3M cash so the net outlay is $4.3M. I think that's about right for the #18 pick - particularly when you factor that they're getting a reasonably competent veteran big man as well. (And Songaila could probably be moved or bought out for some savings.)

I'd do it from Washington's perspective.

Hoops23 brings up a good point though. The bottom line is that James Jones' cap hit for 2010/11 isn't that big. He only costs them $1.8M, and they'd have to factor at least $500K for a minimum salary vet cap hold if they unloaded him. So basically, dumping Jones only saves them $1.3M in cap room. It's just not going to be a very high priority for them.

Does Songaila have a Trade Kicker or something? I see him listed as 4.818M. 4.818+Cook's 2.169857 is a total of 6.987857M, minus $3M cash for a total of $3,987,857 for the 18th pick, which seems about right considering you get Songaila+Cook too. Cook could also be good for you. He just lost his confidence for some reason, but he did win the 2009 NBA Three-point Shootout at the ASG.

[nate33]

Seems very expensive for the Wizards. I don't know what the exact figure would be, but from it sounds like, it would be at close to ~5 mil+ for the #18 pick. That's too steep IMO.

The Wizards take on Songaila's $5.1M plus Cook's $2.2M for a total of $7.3M. But they get $3M cash so the net outlay is $4.3M. I think that's about right for the #18 pick - particularly when you factor that they're getting a reasonably competent veteran big man as well. (And Songaila could probably be moved or bought out for some savings.)

Yea but you're leaving out the salary you'd have to pay for that #18 pick. That would bring it to over 5 mil. That's still pretty steep IMO.

Well, if you want to look at it that way, then you should prorate that $4.3M over the length of the #18 pick's contract. Basically, the Wizards are being given a free #18 pick, except that they have to pay the player double what he would otherwise cost. That's still a good deal. And it's even better when you figure that the Wizards don't really have much else to do with their cap room this summer. By next year, all those costs will be history and the Wizards will still have the benefit of a #18 pick locked in for 3 more years at an ultra-cheap salary.

[Hoops23]

you can trade the #18 pick for a future pick, thereby avoiding giving it away.

Miami already have enough cap room to add a big name free agent, say Bosh or Amare. Thats why additional $4m ($1.8m to JJ & 2.2m for Cook) is not necessary unless Pat Riley is looking to add another max player. Right now, if the cap is at $56m, as was previously reported, Miami still has arround $8m left after they max a free agent this summer, enough to resign Haslem and O'Neal.

Then why throw away the pick and Cook just to dump JJ?

If Miami will dump JJ $1.8m salary in a trade, I doubt this is the kind of deal they will do.

[nate33]

Does Songaila have a Trade Kicker or something? I see him listed as 4.818M. 4.818+Cook's 2.169857 is a total of 6.987857M, minus $3M cash for a total of $3,987,857 for the 18th pick, which seems about right considering you get Songaila+Cook too. Cook could also be good for you. He just lost his confidence for some reason, but he did win the 2009 NBA Three-point Shootout at the ASG.

My bad. I was going by memory on Songaila.

Like I said before, I like this for Washington, but only if they can pull off the Jones for Songaila part. I don't want Jones' phantom salary on the books for 3 more years because I'd like for the Wizards to make a splash in free agency in Summer 2011.

[Flash is the Future]

you can trade the #18 pick for a future pick, thereby avoiding giving it away.

Miami already have enough cap room to add a big name free agent, say Bosh or Amare. Thats why additional $4m ($1.8m to JJ & 2.2m for Cook) is not necessary unless Pat Riley is looking to add another max player. Right now, if the cap is at $56m, as was previously reported, Miami still has arround $8m left after they max a free agent this summer, enough to resign Haslem and O'Neal.

Then why throw away the pick and Cook just to dump JJ?

If Miami will dump JJ $1.8m salary in a trade, I doubt this is the kind of deal they will do.

O'Neal is so gone, and good riddance. We're throwing the pick away to dump Cook AND JJ. We no longer have room for young players making more than the minimum, other than Beasley, really.

[Hoops23]

O'Neal is so gone, and good riddance. We're throwing the pick away to dump Cook AND JJ. We no longer have room for young players making more than the minimum, other than Beasley, really.

I may agree with you about O'Neal but not on dumping JJ and Cook for the pick and cash.

Knowing Riley, he's not going to do that trade, dumping JJ & Cook in expense of the pick and cash for cap space. Again, Heat already has enough cap space. My guess is, Riley will package JJ with Beasley and/or the pick in a trade for a player that could be a 3rd option behind wade and the max player Heat signed this summer. Trading the pick is not definitely for a salary dump. Never seen Riley package a 1st pick in dumping contracts.

[shrink]

Interesting discussion.

First, for MIA, they were the last people I thought would complain about this deal. First, going into free agency with the cap space to sign two major free agents is incredible bargaining power. Whether its used to convince free agents to come, or used to trade elsewhere, its certainly very valuable -- more valuable than hanging onto what they have. Moreover, the deal removes $4.1 mil of payroll in 2011-2013. Yes, MIA can waive Jones, but they are taking $6 mil out of their payroll for the next three seasons, and getting zero production for it. Cap space - right now - is what MIA should maximize, because now is the time that it could have historic implications. The opportunity to tell a free agent like LeBron, "If you come to play with Wade, we could also afford Bosh for a terrific Big Three" is hard to pass on for the minor additions mentioned; it could mean the difference between having three elite players or zero elite players.

NOH hasn't spoken up, but I should mention the deal is a little worse for them. The deal is complicated enough financially, but I believe that Jones carries a 15% trade kicker. I assume that does not increase the amount of the guarantee. Also, NOH needs to add a cheaper player to fill their roster. However, I believe they'd still make that trade, because I think that one of the Hornet's goals will be to get under the lux and get back that lux share, and this gets them a long way towards that goal without giving up any assets that would bother Chris Paul.

Finally, I'd like to address the price of a pick. Right now, we know one thing - the historic minimum price for a late 1st. No pick has ever been sold for less than $3 mil, and that $3 is an articial construction of the CBA. Without the rule, would a team pay $4 mil? $6 mil? Who knows. Second, I think we can agree that the #18 pick in this draft is worth more than a late pick in a normal draft.

If WAS had a complaint, I think it would be that the price here is in raw cap space, and they may think they can do something better with it, whether its in free agency or in trade elsewhere. That I can't answer, but I still think this is a good deal. I expect WAS to get enough production out of Songalia and Cook to be worth the financial costs, and Cook is young so he's a bit of a prospect for a rebuild. In that regard, I agree with the poster that said the MIA pick comes free, at least from a financial standpoint. WAS may lose some opportunity costs by waiting as well. Right now, they are in a good position because they have TPE's and can make this deal before the new season begins. If they want to wait, MIA can't trade Jones and needs to use next year's 1st, which costs them additional 2010 cap space, and worse, a whole lot of other teams (like my wolves) suddenly can compete with them by offering their 2010 cap space.

[VintaGe36]

Trading the pick is not definitely for a salary dump. Never seen Riley package a 1st pick in dumping contracts.

Not really fair, since you've also never seen Riley in a situation where his greatest asset and most important thing right now is his cap space and how much he can get.