Acquiring a center...

[parson]

... is something I obsess over each year. To me, the 1 and 5 positions are the most important on the team -- AND the hardest to fill. Centers, particularly, are so valuable that sometimes you never get the chance to get one.

With Cousins slotted for the 3-6 picks and NJ sitting at 3, we have such a chance. The Nets don't need a center, but they'd love a mobile PF to complement Lopez. Right now, they're looking at either taking a chance on drafting Favors and hoping he develops or drafting Cousins and being very-big-but-slow with a twin towers lineup.

I posted a trade for Smoove for the 3rd over at the NJ site (viewtopic.php?f=23&t=1012305) and there were some who liked the trade. I didn't expect them to love the deal because I know how team forums are. If someone offered Dwight Howard to us for Bibby, we'd have someone here complain. I wanted to gauge their interest. I think there was plenty, even among those who said they wouldn't do the deal. To me, that means we might be close.

My question is:
How far are we willing to go for the 3rd pick overall? Or are you guys even interested in a real center? Are Horford and Smoove down low enough for you?

[Harry10]

Cousins' standing reach is only 1 inch taller than Horford's. Cousins is not going to stop Dwight. their are only 4 guys in the NBA who might give Dwight a hard time, and they are KG, Duncan, Bynum, and Odon (maybe)

Horford did fine against all the centers in the NBA. the biggest problem in the magic series was not the Hawks defense, it was Joe going iso.

[parson]

Cousins' standing reach is only 1 inch taller than Horford's.

That would make his reach only 3.5 inches less than Dwight Howard's and 3 inches less than Oden's. And Cousins is thicker than either.

I'm not arguing that Cousins will ever be better than Smoove, just that he'd make our team make sense. He's the type of body that can - at least - defend Howard without a doubleteam and he'd allow Horford to move to PF.

[azuresou1]

I don't know what Harry is talking about, Kendrick Perkins is demolishing Dwight, Shaq always does well against him, and Yao singlehandedly shuts down Dwight. I also want to see how Smoove/Al do defensively in a real defensive system.

If we're going to trade for a draft pick, how about moving Joe? Think Philly would bite on Joe for Brand + #2?

[parson]

No, I think Philly has eyes for Turner.

And why would we trade for ANOTHER PF?

[azuresou1]

Because I have a mancrush on Evan Turner and I think he's going to be a cross between Brandon Roy and the current iteration of Kobe i.e. better than Joe in a year or two.

Doing the trade would mean that we don't need to pay Joe's next contract - figuring he gets something like $16m next year with small raises each year, we'll probably be paying out $13.5m extra over 3 years for Turner/Brand vs. Joe, and in the 4th year when Brand is gone we'll be paying Turner the first year of his extension, which is capped and cheaper than Joe's contract by probably $7-8m.

Given that I think Evan Turner can replace Joe with minimal dropoff the first year and then will at the very least match his production by his third year, essentially we're paying Brand ~$4m a year to play backup PF, which is IMO in line with what an above-average backup PF should be making. This is not to mention that Brand still has post moves, and right now we actually have terrible PF depth since Al is stuck at C. He also would only have 3 years left on the deal, compared to the 5 years Joe is almost certain to ask for.

EDIT* In any case, I don't think Philly takes the deal.

[parson]

I hear you about Turner but I don't see Brand. Do you mean you'd do a 3-way, sending Brand somewhere else?

Plus, I think PHI would prefer Turner on a rookie contract over Joe and his millions.

[azuresou1]

My trade proposal got railed hard over at the 76ers board. That said, I would absolutely still do the deal even if it was a heads-up deal.

I mean, we had terrible depth at every position other than PG/SG. This is especially true at the 4/5. Joe Smith was garbage, Zaza was inconsistent, Jason Collins was lulz, and I actually thought RandMo did well in the minutes he got, other than the habit of fouling every single play. Brand isn't worth his $16-18m a year, but he's still worth the MLE, and if we got Turner as well to replace Joe, that's what Brand's contract would essentially be.

But yeah, I didn't really think it through, because there's really no incentive for Philly to take this deal.

[BAMABIRD]

Rasheed does a great job on Superman also. Watching the Boston & Orlando series makes me realize just how much our strategies against the Magic sucked..

[JoshB914]

I still think Smoove/Horford are a fine combo in the post. If we want to go get a 7-footer I'd want it to be of the situational variety a la Pryzbilla. A "true center" isn't a requirement in the NBA anymore, let's see how these guys do with a new coach and defensive system.

[geeman]

Why do people always want to trade Smooth of Al with the thought that he plays the 4 better. lets just get a good center in here and give Al more min that the 4. Al is mor effective a center because this quickness over other center. I would state he would be less effective over starting PF's

[evildallas]

You can't S&T Joe for a pick because he's not under contract when the draft happens. As far as C goes, I'd rather hold what we got than try to get Cousins. Furthermore, I'd really prefer to hire Clifford Ray at whatever the cost to develop someone into a Perkins type. We could try our luck with Kevin Seraphin or Daniel Orton, who is actually projected as a Kendrick Perkins type (might take trading up or acquiring a higher pick via a trade outright). I've also got my eye on Dexter Pittman falling to us in the 2nd round. Other possibilities with the right coaching are Garrett Siler or even Brian Zoubek; he's big, works hard, sets screens, rebounds the ball, and fights for position. That's how Perkins and Shaq deal with Dwight, they make him work just for position and that takes it out of the big boy.

Trading up to #3 for a guy slightly larger than Al with a personality closer to Josh seems like a recipe for disaster.

[SportsFan215]

I've mentioned this before, but Kaman for Josh Smith/Bibby. The Clips will use some cap space to take on Bibby.

[jagstang76]

We don't need to trade Smith. We just need a good backup C. Zaza has been good for his cost, but he's not really the type of C needed to stop Dwight. We need someone that size with good length who, more than anything else, is willing to get it 200% every time they hit the floor. Al is that type of player, but he needs help from a bigger body. I just want to see Sund get a better option than Zaza as our backup C.

[parson]

Cousins' standing reach is only 1 inch taller than Horford's.

Not true. Horford's was 8'11" at the pre-draft measuring while Cousins' is 9'5". That's higher than Howard or Oden and only 3" from the all-time best measured standing reach.

See for yourself http://www.draftexpress.com/nba-pre-dra ... s=0&sort=6

Matter-of-fact, that measurement may make Mr. Cousins untouchable in a trade.

[jmr07019]

Boston fan here. Whoever said KG can stop Dwight was wrong. It's Perkins and Sheed and then Davis with the main responsibility on Dwight. Also I agree with the idea that your team needs a center. You won't win it all in this league starting such a small frontcourt. Just look at the Lakers - Suns series.

Anyways, would Perkins interest you guys? He'd be ideal next to one of your mobile power fowards. Say we don't win it all and end up with the #19 pick. Would Perk and 19 free one of Smith / Horford ? FWIW I was wondering about sending that player to Memphis for Rudy Gay, but just wanted ATL's response to their portion of the trade?

[parson]

I didn't say he could stop him, I said Cousins has the type of body (Perkins has it, too) to "defend Howard without a doubleteam".

[evildallas]

Boston fan here. Whoever said KG can stop Dwight was wrong. It's Perkins and Sheed and then Davis with the main responsibility on Dwight. Also I agree with the idea that your team needs a center. You won't win it all in this league starting such a small frontcourt. Just look at the Lakers - Suns series.

Anyways, would Perkins interest you guys? He'd be ideal next to one of your mobile power fowards. Say we don't win it all and end up with the #19 pick. Would Perk and 19 free one of Smith / Horford ? FWIW I was wondering about sending that player to Memphis for Rudy Gay, but just wanted ATL's response to their portion of the trade?

Wow, trading with Boston hadn't crossed my mind, but that's interesting. Upon looking, I see that Kendrick Perkins is in the last year of his contract next season. I would definitely consider a deal if he was under contract longer, but with him hitting free agency next summer it would take more analysis and a feel for what type of contract he's looking for. Would hate to give up Josh Smith or Al Horford for a 1 year rental because we can't reach terms and the #19 pick.

[azuresou1]

What about the trade I brought up earlier in the season? S&T Joe for Kendrick Perkins and Ray Allen?

[jmr07019]

I believe the general thinking is Perkins will sign a long term deal for around 6 to 9 mil a season.

Ray and Perk for Johnson is very interesting. We lose A LOT and dont have that many ways (the MLE and a late first) to fill remaining holes (Starting center, back up wing) on the roster. Depends on the type of deal Joe signed I guess. I heard he already turned down 16 a year from you guys but the way this post season has played out he has to lower his asking price a little bit. If you guys threw in Pachulia to lessen the blow of losing Perkins then talks could seriously heat up.