Plz explain how defense wont be a problem next year?

rocketsballin · Post #1 » by **rocketsballin** » Sun May 23, 2010 6:59 am

very few of us think defense will keep us from being true contenders next season. i dont see how a starting lineup w/ brooks, martin, scola and 25mpg of yao for at least 2 months, is a legit contender. of corse w/ yao back our defense will be top 15, but even if he can, how long will it take for yao to come back to form? someone plz explain this to me?

was meanin to make a thread of ths awhile ago but too lazy, i'll explain wat i think this team needs to be a contender later

Guy986 · Post #2 » by **Guy986** » Sun May 23, 2010 7:33 am

It will be a problem, particularly the backcourt. Brooks is a below average defender due to his size. Kevin Martin is going to be a nightmare for us defending the elite SGs of the league.

LarsV8 · Post #3 » by **LarsV8** » Sun May 23, 2010 7:42 am

How exactly is Martin going to be any worse than Tmac? Yao gets back and all is well imo,

Joseph17 · Post #4 » by **Joseph17** » Sun May 23, 2010 8:32 am

It will be a problem, but I don't think Martin wouldn't have to guard elite SGs in most situations. That's what Battier and Ariza are for. This is what happens when you put Martin against an elite SG:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rWw1tNtCrik

tisbee · Post #5 » by **tisbee** » Sun May 23, 2010 8:35 am

Because when Yao sweats he secretes dragon particles that when absorbed thru a Rockets jersey transforms bad defenders into good ones.

The other answer is because Adelman won't let it. He had to try the outscoring the opponent thing this season,didn't work and he didn't particulary like having to do so.

This coming season players are going to be on a short leash if they don't play defense.
Lowry can defend if Brooks can't,Shane can come in for Ariza,Hill/Hayes for Scola.
And Martin esp better not get too complacent. Taylor showed he will defend(might not be able to make lay-ups or jumpers w/any regularity,can't have everything),Bud knows he has to play better D to get minutes and Lowry can slide over to the 2.
Haven't seen too much comment on it,but over the last few games Adelman was going
small in 4Q-and Martin wasn't on court,instead it was Brooks,Lowry,Bud,Ariza and Hill or Jeffries.

I've come to the conclusion Coach Adelman loves the in-between game part of coaching far more than the games themselves. He's happiest on the practice court,teaching. Oh he wants to win,really wants to win,but the enjoyment comes from teaching. It's why European and young players get so many minutes. They're coming from environments where practice is important.(Which may be why former Adelman players have short tenures under Adelman in Houston. They may have felt they knew all there was and tuned out of practices. Martin better pay attention or he too may have a short stay.)

Joseph17 · Post #6 » by **Joseph17** » Sun May 23, 2010 8:39 am

^Martin has a great work ethic and I'm sure Adelman know what he was getting when the Rockets traded for him. He coached him in Sacramento and he is really familiar with his game.

Guy986 · Post #7 » by **Guy986** » Sun May 23, 2010 1:20 pm

LarsV8 wrote:How exactly is Martin going to be any worse than Tmac? Yao gets back and all is well imo,

Martin's defense from what i've seen is waaaaaaay worse than Tmac. I'm ofcousrse talking about a healthy tmac... not the gimpy one we saw the last 2 years.

Tmac has the ideal size for a SG/SF in the NBA.
He's 6'9 230lbs.
Martin is 6'7 180lbs.

Guy986 · Post #8 » by **Guy986** » Sun May 23, 2010 1:22 pm

joeyyowee wrote:It will be a problem, but I don't think Martin wouldn't have to guard elite SGs in most situations. That's what Battier and Ariza are for. This is what happens when you put Martin against an elite SG:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rWw1tNtCrik

Ok so you don't put Martin on good offensive SGs. But most SFs in the NBA are alteast a good 30 pounds heavier than Martin. I have a hard time coming up with SFs he can defend in this league.

tisbee · Post #9 » by **tisbee** » Sun May 23, 2010 5:11 pm

joeyyowee,
I'm not questioning martin's skills as an elite scorer or that he puts in the work to do so.
(I have my own doubts as to how he'll work out w/the Rockets,but that's a differ matter.)

Adelman had Martin as a rookie and didn't play him much.
*EDIT add. Oops,my mistake,Adelman actually gave Martin over 20 minutes/game as a rookie.*
Adelman had Bonzi,Jackson and Artest for at least as long,and in a couple of cases much longer.
Under Adelman Bonzi lasted til trade deadline before being traded for Jackson. Who lasted til the end of that season when he was traded for Artest. Who made it thru a whole season simply because McGrady pulled the plug on his season-Ron was being heavily shopped up to that point.
Having familiarity w/Adelman and his "system" may get a player on the Rocket roster,but staying there requires more than that. In Martin's case,he's going to have to change 6 yrs of play and focus much more on defense. If Martin can become at least a barely adequate defender,he'll own this town. If not,he's gone.

OT somewhat,but doesn't it look like Adelman and Morey are trying to recreate the Kings?
Yao as Vlade,Bosh as Webber,Martin as Peja and Brooks as Bibby.

rocketsballin · Post #10 » by **rocketsballin** » Sun May 23, 2010 5:59 pm

first of all, tmac is no worse at defense then martin, injured or not, especially if he's not hurt. when healthy he can play (or used to) elite defense, when not he can use his long arms that averaged 1.5blks/stls first year in orlando. hopefully whoever said tmac is worse was referring to an injured tmac, hope to god not when he's healthy!

brooks isnt a terrible defender, i remember last years playoffs he chased rudy around picks and screens and did it well, he was right behind him. off the ball i guess since he's fast he wont have much difficulities, but man to man he will.

Moreyball · Post #11 » by **Moreyball** » Sun May 23, 2010 7:16 pm

Guy986 wrote:It will be a problem, particularly the backcourt. Brooks is a below average defender due to his size. Kevin Martin is going to be a nightmare for us defending the elite SGs of the league.

But we have Battier and Ariza to defend those SG's.

The Franchise_ · Post #12 » by **The Franchise_** » Sun May 23, 2010 7:29 pm

Martin wasn't a good defender, but our defense was just as crappy before he came. Our main problem was we had nobody protecting the paint. Chuck is a good defender, but he isn't scaring anyone over 6'0 feet, and Luis is just an average defender, so he needs that support backing him up. Every team in the league looked forward to playing us because of that. When we get Yao back and draft a backup C with actual size most of our defensive concerns will be covered.

Baller 24 · Post #13 » by **Baller 24** » Mon May 24, 2010 3:54 am

You just need a solid anchor, and that'll do.

Ribalding · Post #14 » by **Ribalding** » Mon May 24, 2010 4:13 am

Guy986 wrote:Tmac has the ideal size for a SG/SF in the NBA.
He's 6'9 230lbs.
Martin is 6'7 180lbs.

Brian Cushing was brought into the Texans for more than one reason. See? You don't quite understand the reach of DorkElvis. He got the Texans to draft Cushing. Not for the Texans. Pushaw. Tut tut.

That'd be too simple. "NFL Linebacker" is only a smidge more complex than "WalMart Greeter". Everybody knows that. So Morey convinced the woebegone Texans to draft Cushing for the Rockets.

Duh.

Cushing is the Rox strength and conditioning trainer. ("Assistant", to stay clear of any congressional investigators.)

You didn't get the memo? Kevin Martin will be 278 by September 1st.

Everybody knows that.

bballmaniac27 · Post #15 » by **bballmaniac27** » Mon May 24, 2010 5:09 am

LarsV8 wrote:How exactly is Martin going to be any worse than Tmac? Yao gets back and all is well imo,

TMac wasn't that bad for us defensively. When he tried on defense he was pretty decent.

Ribalding · Post #16 » by **Ribalding** » Mon May 24, 2010 5:09 am

bballmaniac27 wrote:
LarsV8 wrote:How exactly is Martin going to be any worse than Tmac? Yao gets back and all is well imo,

TMac wasn't that bad for us defensively. When he tried on defense he was pretty decent.

**emphasis added**

hairybyrd · Post #17 » by **hairybyrd** » Mon May 24, 2010 11:12 pm

Rick Adelman coaches offense better than defense. Even if this team had better defensive players Adelman would still emphasize offense. I think defensive "problems" start with the coach. Then again, it's not necessarily a problem. The Suns made it to the Conference Finals by playing a lot of zone defense...If the Rockets were committed to defense then Tom Thibideau would be the coach.

Rockets still have Battier as a defensive anchor. Ariza and Lowry are solid. Jeffries is passable. JHill has real potential on the defensive end.

There's a lot of defensive-minded players in the draft, esp. at the 4/5...Hassan Whiteside, Larry Sanders, Ekpe Udoh, Cole Aldrich, Ed Davis...I like Aminu on this team as a defensive understudy to Battier but they would have to move into the top-10.

ubernathan · Post #18 » by **ubernathan** » Tue May 25, 2010 4:42 am

Yao is an elite defensive big man, and putting him back in the middle will change everything up. In 2008-2009 season, Yao was 5th in defensive win shares, 9th in defensive rating. Having a shotblocking threat like Yao in the middle will cover for Brooks and Martings defensive weaknesses.

spolgar · Post #19 » by **spolgar** » Tue May 25, 2010 7:54 pm

I think we hold pat from yesteryears in terms of ability to defend the perimeter. Having Battier, Ariza on the passing lanes, Scola, Hayes and Yao in the block is pretty formidable defensively. Brooks and Lowry can stay in front of anyone, and Lowry has enough reach to challenge most shots. Brooks is still tall enough to move his hands in front of the shooter's eyes effectively, which is also something Battier does as well. Defensively, the only weak rotation is when both Brooks and Martin are on the court and you are playing against a tall, strong point with a strong athletic two and someone at the 3/4 who can dribble penetrate. Teams like the Lakers and the Jazz will have their way with us at those positions, but in the post we are still very strong defensively.

However, most folks don't have a star post up heavy point guard, a good penetraing shooting guard and a small foward that can punish you in spurts. Most of the time it's two out of the three, with one of the wing players being the team's designated defensive specialist . Whoever we play, we can double off of someone else in the half court and still cover most of the defensive deficiencies most of the time.

I don't think it's not the end of the world. Surely Skip's not that much better a defender than Brooks+Lowry, and Artest is no better than Battier. Plus we upgraded offense, and in the end it's about us scoring more than the other team, so I think it's just gonna balance out.