Trade Ideas

[chrice]

LeBron won't go to Portland.

Why? Because of all that big market garbage? Blazers are an upcoming team, and they have the Coach, a smart front office, and a team that could be a dynasty for years to come if Lebron joined. As a player concerned primarily with winning, I can't see a better spot for Lebron. Roy / Lebron / Aldridge / Bayless / Batum / Camby

[TheOUTLAW]

I'm not sure that Portland is upcoming any longer. They are still young and have some room for internal improvement, but I think they are about as good as they can be unless they get some really good play out of Oden. I'm actually not sure they will ever be a great team before they inevitably get broken up because of their contracts

[heathmalc]

People are suggesting trades that involve either LeBron leaving, or another super-star coming here. Both scenarios equal disaster for the Cavaliers, with the possible exception of a Bosh trade, which I believe is very unlikely.

A good number of you guys/gals know me from other forums, or from reading my articles in the paper (the few of you that actually know me).

One thing that people have to realize is that if you add more than one new starter to any team, your chances of winning a championship are drastically cut. The exception is if there is a very strong leader in that line-up, and another leader or two that can not only back-up the main leader, but are able to adjust there game accordingly and create immediate chemistry. One example of this is the 2008 Celtics. So, in-General, you need to have chemistry...that is built through a year or two of playing together.

That being said, one trade that I see being able to help our team and the opposing team, is Arenas, McGee for Varejao, Williams.

Why for Cavs: Arenas is a proven scorer; one of the league's best when healthy. Olthough he is often overlooked as a defender, Arenas is a good defender when he is motivated...unlike Mo, who is bad regardless of motivation. Varejao, although a very good player (and first team defense), is more of a luxury for the Cavaliers, than a necessity. His +/- was one of the highest in the league.. but when looking at the +/- for specific rotations with him in it (as opposed to him being replaced by JJ), the difference was only 1.38 points, and since JJ is going into his 3rd season, it is expected that he will either improve or become a bust/career bench player. Either way, Varejao is not needed more than a good young center (McGee). The Cavs would be able to start Arenas with Jamison/LeBron and either a MLE SG, or Parker/West, and McGee/(Shaq or Z), and Kaun. Powe would come off the bench with JJ,Moon,Green, and Gibson plus either West or Parker.

Why for Wizards: Washington has stated publicly that they intend to either trade agent zero, or buy him out if no suitor is found in the trade market. A trade that brings in Mo and Varejao for Arenas/McGee is a win-win situation for the Wizards. Although they like McGee, and would prefer to keep him, they are more than happy to add him into the package for Varejao/Mo and the right to dump Arenas on another team (Cavs would be the ONLY team that would entertain a trade that didn't include Wall). Varejao can play the 4 or 5, he is a NBA defensive 1st teamer, and he is young. Mo Williams is similar to Arenas...but smaller, less of a defender, but stays healthier, is cheaper, and has a shorter contract. He also isn't a vocal voice in the locker room, but is a good team-mate... and would be relatively easy to trade in 2 years when Wall was reaching his stride (Wall will likely take over starting pg before that... but Mo represents a good option until his expiring year...and MUCH cheaper than Arenas). In addition, the Wizards would add 3 million in savings/cap room for this year's free-agent crop.

Note to fans of both teams: Arenas & LeBron are pretty good friends... despite the team rivalry that existed for a few seasons. LeBron has been seen with Arenas on many occasions together at clubs, and it is rumored that Arenas may have an appearance in LeBron's up-coming movie.

[RJM]

Cavs Trade

Mo Williams
Antawn Jamison
Daniel Gibson

Grizzlies Trade

Zach Randolph
Mike Conley
1st Rounder

Trade ID #5529330

Would you do it?

[RRT]

^ROFL WHAT?

[Pula_86]

I'm not sure that Portland is upcoming any longer. They are still young and have some room for internal improvement, but I think they are about as good as they can be unless they get some really good play out of Oden. I'm actually not sure they will ever be a great team before they inevitably get broken up because of their contracts

You cannot be serious? Aldridge and Roy have only been in the league a few years now. Martell Webster is working his way back from injury. Nicolas Batum is still raw, but improving. Greg Oden showed he can be a difference maker. The only question is will he be more Sam Bowie or Big Z in terms of injuries for the rest of his career.

People forget that Portland has a couple of international players stashed oversees that can come over and contribute. Given that almost every player on the Blazers missed significant time with injury, no one can say that this team has maxed out their potential. The Blazers and the Thunder are still the two best up and coming franchises.

[gflem]

If it comes down to a S&T, it looks like the Clippers may have the most enticing combination of picks and young players of any team that has been mentioned. With Blake Griffin, Eric Gordon, and DeAndre Jordan along with 2 firsts next year. I believe they have Minnesota's pick top ten protected in 2011, unprotected in 2012 which could be very high, along with their pick this year which is 8th as well.
Would 3 firsts and a combination of two of the above mentioned (Griffin, Gordon)along with Chris Kaman and his contract be acceptable if Lebron were to try to force his way there? I know the Clips mgmt sucks but there is the intrigue of playing of in LA, AND the opportunity to one-up Kobe in the process. I wonder if Lebron would find that at all interesting.
To me, if he would want to play there the above package is the about the best I could hope for.

[heathmalc]

I still believe/expect the Cavaliers to trade Anderson Varejao. I know that a LOT of you think I am crazy for suggesting it, but it makes some sense to me. Andy + West = 11 million Throw-in a Wally S&T for 5 million, or a S&T of Hickson (He can be extended this summer) and the Cavs have 15 million to trade. West's contract isn't guaranteed, so the team we trade with could cut him for 500K as long as they did it before August. Throw in a couple future picks, and the Cavs could be in play for some very quality players; perennial all-star type players.

Hickson has HIGH upside, and his value is at it's peak. Varejao made 1st team all-defense, and is signed for a reasonable contract, that also isn't fully guaranteed... so if he flames out, he is still valuable in a later trade.

At any rate, I just do not think the Cavs will keep Varejao... I think he is one of the main pieces in one of our trades (or our only one, if that is all we have), that the Cavs will make by mid-July.

[TheOUTLAW]

Why are you still trying to trade Wally?

[heathmalc]

Why are you still trying to trade Wally?

Because he hasn't retired and we still have his bird-rights... which means we can S&T him for 18million+
That is a big trading chip! The liklihood of him being signed to even half that is unlikely, but the fact that he is an option for a sign&trade, is something any fan who is dreaming-up scenarios for the Cavs has to consider.

Dan Gilbert and the front office is expected to be very aggressive this summer. This seems like a new revalation to a lot of fans, but in-fact, it isn't. In March Dan Gilbert was interviewed by the ABJ and was asked what the Cavs could do to try and persuade LeBron from going to potentially greener pastures. Gilbert's response was a preview of what I believe the plan was all along: "What makes everyone think that the Cavaliers franchise is going to sit by idly during free agency? Cap space is not the only method of finding a player."

That isn't verbatim, as I am going from memory, but it is pretty close. The point here is that I believe the Cavaliers planned all along to go after the top free-agents, and to be as aggressive as possible in it's search for better players.

A look at what the Cavaliers will have available:

Shaq: We do have his bird-rights. A S&T is not out of the question, and that contract is worth as much as 25 million per year.
Wally: We have his bird-rights. 18+ million S&T possibility.
West: 4.5 million, unguaranteed contract (if declined before August, he only gets 500K)
Moon: $3,000,000 expiring contract
Parker: $2,855,769 expiring contract
Telfair: $2.7 Million expiring contract
Powe: $915,852 expiring contract
Green: $762,195 expiring contract (non guaranteed), with restriction rights

That is over 57.6 million in contracts that can be traded that are possible money savers to the right team.

In addition to the above, Jamison becomes an 15 million dollar expiring after next season. Daniel Gibson may as well be in the same boat as Jamison, because the last year on his contract (4.7) is not guaranteed... so he is basically an expiring after next season... if a team chooses to decline his contract.

After the players mentioned already, you have JJ Hickson, who's value is at it's peak right now. His contract can be re-done now, and he could be used in a S&T. Then, you have Anderson Varejao, who's contract appears longer than it is, because it isn't fully guaranteed either. Add in the fact that he is a 1st team all-defensive player, and can play either the 4 or 5, and can defend all 5 positions on switches, and he becomes a nice commodity to have in any potential trade talks. Mo Williams doesn't have a bad contract, but it isn't good either. Yet, he could possibly be used in a trade with the right team... say Golden State, or the Clippers, or Washington.

Jawad is a restricted free agent this summer, so he is not really in-play. Technically, he can be S&T for $854,389 (and up...if a team actually wanted him). So, due to his situation, it is expected he will not be retained - the Cavs will release him, making him unrestricted, and freeing up his cap-hold (854K).

So....... When you ask why I am still trying to trade Wally, my answer is that I'm not.... yet, I am leaving all possibilities open, so that I may have a better idea of what the Cavaliers may do this summer... with, or w/o LeBron.

[RRT]

didn't realize wally's bird rights were still valid, good to hear.

[tidho]

Arenas, McGee for Varejao, Williams.

Looking objectively I can see merit. Still, all the risk is on the Cavalier's end. Arenas really hasn't played in years now, and McGee was logging 16mpg on a bad team.
With Arena's uncertainty and hideous contract he's a negative in this trade. I'm not sure Blatche rather than McGee would even get this done.

[mysticbb]

This is just going in a circle and it's dumb to begin with. From now on, any discussion about this goes into the trade thread.

First of all: What a joke!

One last thing, I do still find it amusing when people say that the Cavs have nothing that'll lure Bosh except LeBron but other folks think that they can get LeBron without giving up anything. That "it's better than nothing argument is idiotic especially when it really just adds up to nothing.

Second: With the situation around Turkoglu I actually can see the Cavs being able to get Bosh, if they are willing to take on Turkoglu.

Jamison, West, Moon, Hickson, 1st round pick for Bosh and Turkoglu.

The Raptors basically saving $12m by getting rid of Turkoglu while getting Hickson and the 1st pick for Bosh.

[Triumph36]

This is just going in a circle and it's dumb to begin with. From now on, any discussion about this goes into the trade thread.

First of all: What a joke!

One last thing, I do still find it amusing when people say that the Cavs have nothing that'll lure Bosh except LeBron but other folks think that they can get LeBron without giving up anything. That "it's better than nothing argument is idiotic especially when it really just adds up to nothing.

Second: With the situation around Turkoglu I actually can see the Cavs being able to get Bosh, if they are willing to take on Turkoglu.

Jamison, West, Moon, Hickson, 1st round pick for Bosh and Turkoglu.

The Raptors basically saving $12m by getting rid of Turkoglu while getting Hickson and the 1st pick for Bosh.

Sign me up. Though I'd prefer to use Telfair's expiring instead of Moon if possible.

[Baseline Runner]

If we can be Bosh that'd be a great trade but why would Turkoglu like Cleveland if he didn't like Toronto?

[mysticbb]

If we can be Bosh that'd be a great trade but why would Turkoglu like Cleveland if he didn't like Toronto?

Well, I can imagine Turkoglu works even next to James. It would even give the Cavs the possibility to run a Bosh-Turkoglu-James frontcourt. But the overall premise would be the ability to get Bosh. What the Cavs want to do with Turkoglu later, depends on how much Gilbert wants to pay, I guess. But that is a significant move which would make sure that James stays.

@Triumph36

Moon is really needed anymore, if the Cavs add Turkoglu. And Moon also gives the Raptors more incentives to do the deal. West could even be back in Cleveland, because I think the Raptors somehow will use the option to waive him and reduce the costs to $0.5m.

[Bubstubbler]

no trading of lebron. if he wants to stay, cool, let's get to work at fixing this thing. if he doesn't, then **** him

What you're really saying is, "if he doesn't, then **** the Cavs, **** Cleveland, and **** the other fans."

Screwing over your own team by self-righteously refusing any compensation just makes you an watch the namecalling.

There is no 'coolness' or 'toughness' or anything at all respectable in holding the position that, "if LeBron leaves, i refuse to accept any compensation and would rather completely f*** over my entire organization, city, and fanbase, because I believe it's reasonable to cut off my nose to spite my face."

The most bizarre thing here is how the people taking that irrational, emotion-based response are actually proud of their opinion, like it's a good thing, as opposed to something embarrassingly dumb.

It's actually a bit of a litmus test: if the "let's cut off our nose to spite our face" position makes sense to you, don't ever go into business, because you'll suck at it. The real world isn't for children and their temper tantrums.

[Gordon Bombay]

What you're really saying is, "if he doesn't, then **** the Cavs, **** Cleveland, and **** the other fans."

Screwing over your own team by self-righteously refusing any compensation just makes you an immature idiot.

There is no 'coolness' or 'toughness' or anything at all respectable in holding the position that, "if LeBron leaves, i refuse to accept any compensation and would rather completely f*** over my entire organization, city, and fanbase, because I believe it's reasonable to cut off my nose to spite my face."

The most bizarre thing here is how the people taking that irrational, emotion-based response are actually proud of their opinion, like it's a good thing, as opposed to something embarrassingly dumb.

It's actually a bit of a litmus test: if the "let's cut off our nose to spite our face" position makes sense to you, don't ever go into business, because you'll suck at it. The real world isn't for children and their temper tantrums.

get the **** out of here with this condescending jibberish. in your opinion, what trade should we accept that would ease the pain of trading lebron? keep in mind that we would be willingly trading about 150 million off our franchise value. the only ones i would even remotely consider are the ones that rids us of jamison and mo for expirngs as well. if those trades are out there, then maybe, but if not, lebron can go sign with someone else...he has that right, he is a free agent

[rjgraca]

^ Bubstubbler, after only 84 posts to make such an ill-advised post about taking lop sided trades is only your feelings hurt and not reality to post non-sense like that.

Doing side way salary cap moves to provide Christmas in July to some team isn't the logical answer either.

I didn't notice other teams (in the history of the NBA) trading a top 3 talent in a fire sale, like the ones being proposed here for Lebron, which would be screwing the CAVs talent wise and salary cap wise. If Lebron want's to be a hypocrite about loyalty...no need to screw the CAVs salary cap to get a severe talent drop and no real significant future talent in return.

[gflem]

I think Bub was thinking more along the lines of somebody saying that either Lebron re-signs or screw him. Meaning no trades period. If that is what he was rsponding to, I get some of what he was saying. I think Gordon was saying what has been discussed so far isnt to his liking at all, and that he would rather see Lebron walk that accept any of these proposals.
So if I am correct in what both these guys are saying, they arent really that for off in that the best case is for Lebron to re-sign obviously, but they differ on one saying get something, the other saying that something isnt good enough, it better be a kings ransom (pun intended) or we are better off blowing this thing up and doing a total rebuild. Which I happen to agree with.
We are all Cavs fans here, and we cant let this get to the point where we are at each others throats. I think we are all a little pissed about this situation, but honestly, this has all been brought about by Lebron himself, it doesnt take anything to re-sign for the max, and if he really wanted to do that the situation here is about the best he can get. Lebron seems to love the attention, and I'm sure the emotions were pretty high after getting upset in the playoffs but this whole situation is on Lebron.
And guys, sorry if I put any words into your mouths, or if I misread your initial posts, just trying to make some sense of why you seemed to be going after each other.