Joe Johnson VS. Michael Redd 5 years ago

[Capital Edge]

I remember me and my friend had a big argument who was better and he took Johnson and I thought he was high. But this was when Redd was on fire and averaging 20 or 25 points, Johnson also was averaging the same but redd just seemed to be a bigger impact but now we realize its b/c he is a ball hog. My o my how times have changed! Ok, Redd has gotten injured but I saw him declining before that ACL tear last year and Johnson could get more than his last contract worth $75 million.

[RiotPunch]

What exactly is the question here? Michael has never been the ball-handling, great-defending, clutch-shooting, athletic specimen that JJ has been throughout his career. Redd 5 years ago was a good volume scorer, he was much more efficient than he has been in recent years. Back then he could actually hit a freethrow as well.

Redd is going to be a corpse somewhere next year, and JJ will likely be Wade's Pippen in Miami making serious dough.

[Capital Edge]

What exactly is the question here?

Who do you think was better at that time

[Newz]

I think Redd from 5 years ago and Joe Johnson now is pretty close. I would probably give a slight edge to JJ though.

I think if you take those two players, neither one of them are the best player on a championship team, but both of them could be decent 2nd/3rd guys.

Atlanta did have 53 wins this year, but Redd in his prime never played with a core even remotely close to as talented as Horford/Smith/Williams/Bibby/Zaza/Crawford. I think Redd could have won ~50 games with that team. I don't think JJ has ever carried a team even close to as untalented as Skinner/Smith/Mason/Ford to the playoffs before either.

I think it's close, but I doubt that will be a very popular opinion around here.

[RiotPunch]

Okay, well I guess it is pretty difficult to overlook Redd's recent self... but I guess if you compare 2004-05 Michael to 2004-05 Joe, I go Michael at that point in time. However, JJ was only 22-23 at that time playing for the Suns-- Michael was 25ish yearls old and was relied upon more heavily to score the ball. Johnson trailed Redd by a bit in point that season, but had far more assists and defensive stats.

I don't know, I guess BACK THEN I would have had my homer-goggles on and went with Redd. Looks foolish now doesn't it?

[Chapter29]

There was a pretty long thread on this very topic at the time. I sat somewhere in the middle with it depending on what type of player you needed.

In hindsight JJ is and was a far better player.

[jeremyd236]

5 years ago Michael Redd WAS better than JJ. But it was only very slightly.

I think what we have is 2 players with very similar skill sets (at the time), however Redd has since not improved (and regressed), and Johnson went the other way - he took his game to a different level.

But what's up now doesn't mean anything to the topic. 5 years ago, I still think Redd was a better player.

[skones]

I proposed a sign and trade involving Redd and JJ. It was not popular at that time.

[AussieBuck]

When you have two similar players I don't know how you could take the slightly more efficient scorer over the better defender and wayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy better playmaker.

[Frank Nova]

I think its funny there is even a comparison here.. Michael Redd has only ever been praised for his scoring ability. Yeah at 1 point in time he was a 22pt per night guy, which was good. Hes probably around a 20pt career average (i dont feel like checking).. with all that said.. is there anyone here that can give me something else Mike Redd ever did even above average as a pro??

Mike Redd 5 years ago would only help a Bucks team right now as he would still be the 3rd best player on the team and he is better suited for that way more so than being "the man". JJ is a sure fire number 1 option that does everything on a basketball court well above average at minimum, while scoring just like Redd but more efficiently.

Im failing to make the comparison because I find it so outlandish. Its JJ by a landslide and only Bucks fans could dare to justify this. I myself being a diehard Bucks fan is even wondering how this is even being talked about... you want to compare Redd 5 years ago to someone, your talking the likes of Kevin Martin and Monta Ellis, Joe Johnson is far superior to even be in this discussion IMO.

and yes Redd 5 years ago is not better than Bogut or Jennings because both Bogut and Jennings bring way more to this team as a whole than Mike Redd EVER did. write that down.

[Newz]

When you have two similar players I don't know how you could take the slightly more efficient scorer over the better defender and wayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy better playmaker.

I would say Redd is a lot more efficient scorer, to be honest.

Johnson's highest career TS% is 55.8%, otherwise he has typically been in the 53% area.

Redd:

05-06: 57.4%
06-07: 58.6%
07-08: 55.9%
08-09: 56.6%

It's not really close, especially considering Redd scored more PPG than Johnson in those years too... Aside from 08-09 where Johnson scored .2 more per game.

[WRau1]

I think its funny there is even a comparison here.. Michael Redd has only ever been praised for his scoring ability. Yeah at 1 point in time he was a 22pt per night guy, which was good. Hes probably around a 20pt career average (i dont feel like checking).. with all that said.. is there anyone here that can give me something else Mike Redd ever did even above average as a pro??

Mike Redd 5 years ago would only help a Bucks team right now as he would still be the 3rd best player on the team and he is better suited for that way more so than being "the man". JJ is a sure fire number 1 option that does everything on a basketball court well above average at minimum, while scoring just like Redd but more efficiently.

Im failing to make the comparison because I find it so outlandish. Its JJ by a landslide and only Bucks fans could dare to justify this. I myself being a diehard Bucks fan is even wondering how this is even being talked about... you want to compare Redd 5 years ago to someone, your talking the likes of Kevin Martin and Monta Ellis, Joe Johnson is far superior to even be in this discussion IMO.

and yes Redd 5 years ago is not better than Bogut or Jennings because both Bogut and Jennings bring way more to this team as a whole than Mike Redd EVER did. write that down.

Don't let the facts get in the way of your blind hate.

[jeremyd236]

I think its funny there is even a comparison here.. Michael Redd has only ever been praised for his scoring ability. Yeah at 1 point in time he was a 22pt per night guy, which was good. Hes probably around a 20pt career average (i dont feel like checking).. with all that said.. is there anyone here that can give me something else Mike Redd ever did even above average as a pro??

Mike Redd 5 years ago would only help a Bucks team right now as he would still be the 3rd best player on the team and he is better suited for that way more so than being "the man". JJ is a sure fire number 1 option that does everything on a basketball court well above average at minimum, while scoring just like Redd but more efficiently.

Im failing to make the comparison because I find it so outlandish. Its JJ by a landslide and only Bucks fans could dare to justify this. I myself being a diehard Bucks fan is even wondering how this is even being talked about... you want to compare Redd 5 years ago to someone, your talking the likes of Kevin Martin and Monta Ellis, Joe Johnson is far superior to even be in this discussion IMO.

and yes Redd 5 years ago is not better than Bogut or Jennings because both Bogut and Jennings bring way more to this team as a whole than Mike Redd EVER did. write that down.

The argument was Redd 5 years ago AND JJ 5 years ago. You're comparing Redd 5 years ago to current JJ??? Maybe that's why you're so confused.

I knew it'd be difficult to have a successful thread given peoples' general inability to think 5 years ago and not now.

[Chapter29]

5 years ago Michael Redd WAS better than JJ. But it was only very slightly.

I think what we have is 2 players with very similar skill sets (at the time), however Redd has since not improved (and regressed), and Johnson went the other way - he took his game to a different level.

But what's up now doesn't mean anything to the topic. 5 years ago, I still think Redd was a better player.

Sadly you were wrong. JJ is and was a better rebounder, passer, defender and teammate. Redd was only a better shooter, not even necessarily a better scorer. Just because Redd's scoring stats were better does not make him a better player.

I thought at the time they were very comparable talents, with JJ being the better overall player and Redd being the better pure shooter/scorer. That was only partially correct.

[WRau1]

Sadly you were wrong. JJ is and was a better rebounder, passer, defender and teammate. Redd was only a better shooter, not even necessarily a better scorer. Just because Redd's scoring stats were better does not make him a better player.

I thought at the time they were very comparable talents, with JJ being the better overall player and Redd being the better pure shooter/scorer. That was only partially correct.

JJ has always been a great passer but he is not the better rebounder. They are pretty much equal w/ career 4.1 and 4.2. Comparing JJ and Redds defense is like saying you'd rather bare foot step in puke than poop.

[PedroGrande]

Sadly you were wrong. JJ is and was a better rebounder, passer, defender and teammate. Redd was only a better shooter, not even necessarily a better scorer. Just because Redd's scoring stats were better does not make him a better player.

I thought at the time they were very comparable talents, with JJ being the better overall player and Redd being the better pure shooter/scorer. That was only partially correct.

JJ has always been a great passer but he is not the better rebounder. They are pretty much equal w/ career 4.1 and 4.2. Comparing JJ and Redds defense is like saying you'd rather bare foot step in puke than poop.

When they switched JJ to BJ in the playoffs he had some difficulties... So it cant be that bad...

[BobbyLight]

The thing that people probably forget about Redd is that before all of his injury issues he was an elite scorer. Meaning one of the best in the league. He had one of the most complete offensive games in the league and as Newz mentioned, he dragged a team of garbage with him to the playoffs at one point.

My point is that I would take an elite scorer over a jack of all trades guy. JJ is a very good player and an all star, but both he and Redd would've been much better complimentary players in their primes (I guess JJ is still in his). I know that JJ "did more" but the level at which Redd produced points was very, very good for a few seasons.

[WRau1]

When they switched JJ to BJ in the playoffs he had some difficulties... So it cant be that bad...

Jennings only difficulties was his inability to hit a jumper with any consistency. And I think you point that out because the only thing you remember from that matchup was when Johnson flailed his arms at Jennings as Jennings was going by him and Johnson knocked the ball away.

[Newz]

I guess I don't see JJ as a great teammate either.

Do the Hawks really play great team basketball with him as the star player? They play just like the Bucks did under Redd... Only the other non-Redd/JJ guys are super talented instead of being total scrubs.

[WRau1]

^^Agree. The Hawks played better with Johnson on the floor because Johnson was the only one who could create for himself.