Biggest story in the finals is the refereeing MERGE

[return2glory]

^^^^
It's a fukin shame what's going on. 10 FT's for us the the entire game. That's 45- 23 edge for the Lakers in the last to games at the line.

Kobe got away with two easy travels that led to baskets. He moved his pivot foot on both plays, the last one of a shot over Shelden. This a basic play in the game of basketball. Once you have stopped your dribble, you can't move your pivot foot. The refs aren't missing this type of plays, they are ignoring them.

Celtics miss, Shelden has inside position on Gasol, both go up, Gasol pushes Shelden in the back while Shelden is up in the air, this was right under the basket it the ref there, he choices to ignore the play. Another offense rebound, this time it's KG vs Odom, 18 feet from the basket. Both players go up, KG gets the rebound, his arm went straight up in the air, Odom makes contact with KG and KG is called for a foul. **** bull.

Like I said before in a thread, **** David Stern and his refs. The Celtics lost because they didn't play well and they weren't aggressive, but the refs once again made it extra hard by calling a one sided game.

[azuresou1]

Links to the supposed travels? Not saying I don't believe you, but I don't remember seeing it.

As for Shelden/Gasol, I'm halfway to thinking it was a flop. I do remember seeing that play and being unsure if it was a shove, but on the other end of the very next play, Pau sets a screen and Shelden looks like he got hit with a rocket launcher and goes flying back.

I don't know if you can blame refs for this game. If anything, this is probably the best reffed game the entire series so far.

[return2glory]

Links to the supposed travels? Not saying I don't believe you, but I don't remember seeing it.

As for Shelden/Gasol, I'm halfway to thinking it was a flop. I do remember seeing that play and being unsure if it was a shove, but on the other end of the very next play, Pau sets a screen and Shelden looks like he got hit with a rocket launcher and goes flying back.

I don't know if you can blame refs for this game. If anything, this is probably the best reffed game the entire series so far.

Links. The game is the link. The last one happened vs Shelden in the 4th, with about 7 minutes to play.

[azuresou1]

Sorry, where is the link location?

[mr_sunshine]

As for Shelden/Gasol, I'm halfway to thinking it was a flop.

Oh okay. Gasol didn't put two hands in the back and push him. And even if it was slightly a flop, Gasol flops 5+ times a game and they call it every time. If Shelden did the same thing to him he'd be 5 rows into the crowd crying in some poor fan's lap.

Re: Good officiating in this game? Lol. How do the Lakers get a 4-on-5 open 3 on a play where Artest elbows Rondo in the face and requires him to get stitches? I could list a bunch more, but cmon. The Lakers kicked our ass tonight, but Pierce was driving like a maniac and they refused to put him on the line. Meanwhile, breathe on Kobe and the whistle is quick.

[azuresou1]

I'm trying to find a site that has the game loaded so I could point you to the exact play where Pau sets a screen and Shelden tumbles into the cameras - it was such a terrible acting job that I actually wondered who he was trying to sell that flop to.

That elbow was incidental contact, akin to Pierce punching the ref in the face. The total FT disparity was 9 FTAs, which is really not that big, especially when the Lakers were clearly more aggressive in the paint tonight with Perkins out early. In fact, the only call I remember seeing where I thought Boston got shafted was Sheed's block on Gasol that was called a foul.

[mr_sunshine]

I'm trying to find a site that has the game loaded so I could point you to the exact play where Pau sets a screen and Shelden tumbles into the cameras - it was such a terrible acting job that I actually wondered who he was trying to sell that flop to.

That elbow was incidental contact, akin to Pierce punching the ref in the face. The total FT disparity was 9 FTAs, which is really not that big, especially when the Lakers were clearly more aggressive in the paint tonight with Perkins out early. In fact, the only call I remember seeing where I thought Boston got shafted was Sheed's block on Gasol that was called a foul.

Fair enough. It was not a ridiculous disparity, just kind of odd for Pierce to not see the FT line once in spite of driving a lot. Ditto for KG. It really wouldn't have made a difference in the outcome, just nice to see consistency on what is/isn't a foul on both ends.

Gl in game 7.

[MyInsatiableOne]

Before anyone makes the obvious point that we played poorly tonight, I acknowledge that we played poorly tonight. But it doesn't help your cause when the Lakers are allowed to manhandle you on every possession and rebound and there are no whistles in sight, but on the other end they are getting the usual flops and touch calls every time they go near the lane.

Honestly, I've lost all respect for the NBA during these Finals. Win or lose game seven, doesn't matter. I don't believe what I'm seeing is legitimate anymore. I feel there are other forces at work besides athletes competing. Call it a conspiracy, call it the NBA wanting a game seven, call it incompetence, call it whatever you want. I feel as though what I'm watching isn't real. I try to convince myself it's not happening, I try to convince myself it's just a hard game to call, I try and I try, but I just can't shake it.

Something just isn't right.

I agree, I've been thinking this for YEARS and it's only gotten worse these playoffs...I love the C's so much, been a fan since I was literally born, but I'm nearing the end of my rope...even if the C's win, I just don't know...

[theman]

Can someone correct me on something. Has there been a Celtics opponent who has been knocked unconscious or needed bandaging as a result of a non-call?

[MyInsatiableOne]

^again, nope

[lrs3]

this is what happens when you into the game expecting to get screwed...you get outplayed in EVERY PHASE OF THE GAME and resort back to the same excuse. The game was evenly called with a few missed calls on each team which should be expected.

Some of you are so biased towards boston it's disgusting, any pro-laker comment by one of your own fans is taken as if they are not a true boston fan to give la praise.

[MyInsatiableOne]

^gee, Celtics fans...biased...on their own board...who'da thunk?

GTFO

[lrs3]

to rip on someone for being realistic is pretty pathetic imo

[MyInsatiableOne]

I don't disagree, but to rip on C's fans for being homers ON THEIR OWN BOARD is pretty stupid, IMO...

[jsimon]

These are the splits in each game for free throws:

The first column is the C's FTA followed by personal fouls,
the second column Laker's FTA and fouls.

36-28, 31-26
26-29, 41-29
24-27, 24-20
23-21, 22-23
13-23, 26-22
10-21, 19-17

132-149, 163-137
116-163

In bold is the FT disparity all series long (adjusted for intentional fouls in games 2, 3, 4, and 5). They have shot nearly 50% more FT than us in 6 games.

Now these numbers do not take into account the flow of the game, when the call was made, how important it was to the score and momentum at the time, who the call was made against, and thus who had to sit or not sit for long stretches, etc...

I also included an adjustment of 16 free throws for the C's on fouls committed by the Lakers at the end of their three losses when they were intentional fouling, and our game 3 loss (two of our losses were blowouts and thus no end of game fouls).

If you watch a replay of the play Perkins was injured on it is the perfect microcosm of the entire series. Kobe shoves him in the back positioning for the rebound, no call... Bynum clobbers him over the back, no call... Only when Perkins crumbles to the ground injured does the whistle blow. Meanwhile Kobe and Gasol get calls on every bump, flop, or drive to the lane, Artest and Fisher are allowed to manhandle Pierce and Allen, and we go to the line 15 times (not counting intentional fouls) in two games.

And please don't give me the crap about the Lakers were more aggressive and driving to the hoop more. Pierce, Rondo and Allen were all driving to the hoop and getting clobbered with no calls. KG and Williams were both hammered underneath with no calls. Wallace and Davis get called for clean blocks, while Odom twice hammered Pierce on shots in the lane with *crickets*...

Laker fans feel free to call it whining all you want. And I agree we played like crap and deserved to lose both games 1 and 6. But if your team was systematically taken out of their game, and in foul trouble for all but two games in this series, and was out shot at the FT line by nearly 50%, you wouldn't be happy.

116 - 163.
15 FTA in games 5 and 6 combined for C's against a supposedly physical defense while going to the hoop just as often as the Lakers.

Like I said earlier, I just don't believe what I am seeing anymore. Just like after the Supreme Court elected a president 10 years ago, and has lost all credibility since, the NBA has been losing credibility with me for years, and it's all come to a head in these Finals. There is no way officiating can be this erratic, this inconsistent, and this one sided by accident.

[MyInsatiableOne]

The other thing that drives me **** nuts, and not just in these Finals but in any NBA game, are the late whistles where they wait to see who gets possession/whether the shot goes in/etc

Just in last night's game there was a shot Gasol threw up while falling that had about 2-3 seconds of everyone watching it roll on the rim...when it rolled off, whistle. Another play, a shot when up and bounced off the rim, guys jockeyed for position, no call...as soon as it landed in Perk's hands (no one around him, either)...whistle.

It's either a **** foul/out of bounds/etc or it's not...it doesn't depend on the team that benefits...except, in today's NBA, it does...

[jsimon]

And by the way... getting outplayed and getting screwed by the refs, these are not two mutually exclusive things. It is possible to both get outplayed AND get screwed by the refs in any given game simultaneously. Both things can be true.

So for the people that are always so quick to say "Quit squawking, you didn't lose because of the refs, you lost because of X, Y, and Z..." I say it's possible to lose because of X, Y, Z, AND the refs all at the same time. You can't just separate the two issues from each other like they have nothing to do with one another in terms of the final outcome of the game.

And for the record, I was just as loud and critical of the refs after game 2. This is not just sour grapes. This has been a series long problem for the Celtics, and it has only really affected the Lakers in one game. Even if we win game 7, none of these criticisms go away.

[John from Hemet]

Kudo's to your team they are playing thier hearts out and we are at the all in game 7

For those whining about officiating calls......you are not getting screwed on foul calls as there have been bad calls both ways.

There are several instances of bad calls/no calls that could be pointed out on the other side....but to do that would be whining.....its just playoff basketball.

Hint: The team that wins the 50 50 plays and rebounds wins.....that fact is undeniable....

[mr_sunshine]

And by the way... getting outplayed and getting screwed by the refs, these are not two mutually exclusive things. It is possible to both get outplayed AND get screwed by the refs in any given game simultaneously. Both things can be true.

So for the people that are always so quick to say "Quit squawking, you didn't lose because of the refs, you lost because of X, Y, and Z..." I say it's possible to lose because of X, Y, Z, AND the refs all at the same time. You can't just separate the two issues from each other like they have nothing to do with one another in terms of the final outcome of the game.

And for the record, I was just as loud and critical of the refs after game 2. This is not just sour grapes. This has been a series long problem for the Celtics, and it has only really affected the Lakers in one game. Even if we win game 7, none of these criticisms go away.

Exactly. Every game we've won, except game 2, has been the ones where they make less calls. If they call a foul every time we bump Kobe or Gasoft, but only extremely obvious ones on the Lakers we have no chance. Pierce and KG shot ZERO FTs last night and were both attacking the rim a lot. It's **** absurd, but Lakers fans will be in here, "LOL WE KICKED UR ASSES STFU IDIOTS!" but when they lose while shooting 20+ more FTs than us, "OMG REFS GAVE U GUYS THE GAME." Sickening.

[jsimon]

Pierce and KG shot ZERO FTs last night and were both attacking the rim a lot. It's **** absurd, but Lakers fans will be in here, "LOL WE KICKED UR ASSES STFU IDIOTS!" but when they lose while shooting 20+ more FTs than us, "OMG REFS GAVE U GUYS THE GAME." Sickening.

This is so gawd dam*n true. The whining after game 2 was the loudest of any of the games this series. The Lakers had a 39-18 free throw advantage in that game before intentional fouls came into play, but because Kobe picked up a few cheapies, both Laker fans and Phil Jackson, and the Laker players, AND the media where screeching their heads off. As a matter of fact, there hasn't been a peep about the officiating from the media except when Kobe got in foul trouble and when Doc sent flop tapes to the league. But in the Celtic's case it was whining, and in the Lakers case when Kobe was in foul trouble the refs where calling the game too tight.

The hypocrisy of Lakers fans, coaches, players and the media has been staggering this series.

Again for the record (adjusting for intentional fouls):

FTA: 116 Celtics
FTA: 163 Lakers