'Short' time till the Draft

[Walton'sBeard!]

Funny you should post that TBPup, because i was about to say the same. Love Batum, but I fear he was always be a background player here. Granger would give this team a huge shot in the arm and change how other teams had to approach us. Easy decision for me.

[Allright]

I guess I'm surprised at the lack of respect someone like Danny Granger gets. Here is a kid that is 27 years old, has averaged 23 ppg the last three seasons, is shooting over 38% from 3-pt range during that time, 85% FT, 5.5 rebounds, 2.5 assists, 1.2 assists, 1 block...that is Brandon Roy type numbers or better in almost every category except assists.

TBpup
You would consider a deal centered Lamarcus + Batum for Granger?

[JD45]

I guess I'm surprised at the lack of respect someone like Danny Granger gets. Here is a kid that is 27 years old, has averaged 23 ppg the last three seasons, is shooting over 38% from 3-pt range during that time, 85% FT, 5.5 rebounds, 2.5 assists, 1.2 assists, 1 block...that is Brandon Roy type numbers or better in almost every category except assists.

Would happily give up Batum for him. Would be reluctant to give LMA as well for fear they would have too much of a hole at PF. Batum and Rudy would be fine. Batum and Bayless would not be as good unless another PG came back in the deal.

Granger is BYC, so trade might be a little complicated. I assume Pryzbilla goes as filler. And I also assume they want the Blazers to take TJ Ford. So Miller would have to go as well.

[Walton'sBeard!]

Why is it assumed that aldridge would be traded?

[BballFanAddict]

Why is it assumed that aldridge would be traded?

I would assume Aldridge is being traded because he is the only player other than Roy or Oden that is young and could really help a team. No way we get Granger for Batum and crap.

All of this talk of Granger begs an obvious question: Who has ever heard Granger was on the market? Granger is likely the player Indy wants to build around - he is their best piece - he is their B-Roy. Makes very little sense to me why he'd be on the market.

Anyone?

In addition, maybe I am still dreaming, but that news about one or both NO's PGs being available has my heart racing... Could Paul REALLY be had!?!?

The issue is we do not have a lot of salary to match a Paul / Okafor or Paul / Peja or Paul / Pose type trade. Camby and or Miller would have to be involved by my calculations. If anyone can run the math and come up with legitimate deals for this type of transaction it would much appreciated (I gotta leave for awhile or I would do it); I will attempt it later if no one else has.

[Bob loblaw]

I guess I'm surprised at the lack of respect someone like Danny Granger gets. Here is a kid that is 27 years old, has averaged 23 ppg the last three seasons, is shooting over 38% from 3-pt range during that time, 85% FT, 5.5 rebounds, 2.5 assists, 1.2 assists, 1 block...that is Brandon Roy type numbers or better in almost every category except assists.

But unlike Roy, Granger's numbers are hollow without the wins. Many players put up big numbers on poor teams. Granger is very good, but I'd rather kep Batum if that is the rumored trade.

[The Sebastian Express]

TBpup,

My issue with Granger has nothing to do with his skill but rather his constant health issues, especially his knees. We have two of our major players with big time knee issues - I'd rather not have a third, especially at that cost.

[Billy]

I too would hate to see Batum go. I suppose everyone that comes with his age and skill is assumed to be a future star, but perhaps Portland (and Paul Allen) is finally willing to sell high.

Portland really hasn't had a great track record with young talent that has started here and eventually moved elsewhere. The most successful young players of the past 15 years that was later deal probably were Alvin Williams, Jermaine O'neal, Bonzi Wells, and Zach Randolph. With the exception of Alvin Williams (who wasn't even close to a center piece in the trade for Damon), none of those guys moved for anything approaching their value at it's peak. Obviously guys like Wells and Randolph were addition by subtraction guys, but again, if they had been dealt 2-3 years prior to the date of the actual trade the return likely would have been greater.

Coming back to Batum, he's another "home grown" talent of sorts. Drafted here, tons of potential, and apparently everyone in the league loves him. Perhaps, rather than hanging up the phone on any possible trades involving him, you need to strongly consider moving him at the peak of his value. Obviously there is risk involved. Everyone loves to say that a potential move involving a guy guy would be "Jermaine O'neal all over again," but I tend to believe that to be inaccurate.


Jermaine O'Neal wasn't traded for Danny Granger, or Tony Parker, or Chris Paul, or even a Baron Davis. He was traded for Dale Davis. A 1 time all-star who received the benefit of playing on one of the top teams in a conference lacking quality big men.

It's true, Portland could trade a guy like Batum and he could go on to all-NBA defensive first team honors and lead his team. But if Portland makes the right move, that may not be the worst outcome. If Batum gets dealt and someone like Granger comes back did Portland really lose? 4 years from now if Batum is an all-star as a primary player on his team and Granger is 31 but continues to be one of the better SF's in the game, did Portland lose? If it's to get a Chris Paul type-player, did Portland lose?

It shortens the window yes. Right now if EVERYTHING went perfect Roy and Aldridge would spearhead good sized window as the leading players, with guys like Oden and Batum spearheading a secondary window in which Roy and Aldridge assume a Ray Allen type role as a star role player.

But that may never happen. It's all a risk regardless, but right now the only thing we know is that Roy is an all-star, Aldridge isn't quite, Batum has promise and Oden is a question mark.

I apologize for the long post. Who knows if a guy like Batum is even being talked about. For that matter you could probably sub Aldridge or Oden in this conversation and a lot of the same things hold. Perhaps we're at the point where Portland should swing for the fences.

[JD45]

TBpup,

My issue with Granger has nothing to do with his skill but rather his constant health issues, especially his knees. We have two of our major players with big time knee issues - I'd rather not have a third, especially at that cost.

Which is probably why a guy like Granger would be available.

[cucad8]

Wait, so is the asking price larger contracts along with the all star level player? Or is it that they have a very large contract, and we'd be asked to take that on?

[The Sebastian Express]

TBpup,

My issue with Granger has nothing to do with his skill but rather his constant health issues, especially his knees. We have two of our major players with big time knee issues - I'd rather not have a third, especially at that cost.

Which is probably why a guy like Granger would be available.

True, but I'd still be very hesitant to give up Nicolas for him.

[cucad8]

Questioning fit and "character", gonna throw out Melo again. Wark trades Melo, then comes to work for Portland? Weren't they meeting recently? lol

[cucad8]

Wiz- curious why you would consider Batum for Wallace, but not for Granger.

[EGame]

Well since I don't know who the player is I cannot comment on whether I would do the trade or not with Batum included. However, if the asking price is Batum and Aldridge for whoever, unless it is Bosh or Chris Paul, I probably wouldn't do it for anyone else.

[Butter]

Well since I don't know who the player is I cannot comment on whether I would do the trade or not with Batum included. However, if the asking price is Batum and Aldridge for whoever, unless it is Bosh or Chris Paul, I probably wouldn't do it for anyone else.

I totally agree. No way they move both LMA and Batum for a mid level star like Granger.

[SoHo]

In addition, maybe I am still dreaming, but that news about one or both NO's PGs being available has my heart racing... Could Paul REALLY be had!?!?

The issue is we do not have a lot of salary to match a Paul / Okafor or Paul / Peja or Paul / Pose type trade. Camby and or Miller would have to be involved by my calculations. If anyone can run the math and come up with legitimate deals for this type of transaction it would much appreciated (I gotta leave for awhile or I would do it); I will attempt it later if no one else has.

Doing the math, here is the most reasonable deal I could come up with for us to take back one of NO's big salary obligations. I'm assuming a Paul/Posey deal isn't a real option as the savings for NO don't seem large enough. Anyway,

Paul/Okafor for Pryzbilla/Miller/Webster/Batum/Rudy.

That deal would take place after July 1st when Paul is no longer a BYC contract. For NO they save 4.5 million off the top this year (saves them from the luxury tax), then a total of 10.5 if Pryzbilla is paid by insurance. Then next year they save almost 20 million. In short, there would be significant savings for NO and they could still field a very competitive team with excellent defensive potential. Collison/Thornton/Batum/West/Aldrich(#11)

The more I think about it, I could honestly see NO making a deal along those lines. Their salary is staggering right now for a middling team, and ditching Paul/Okafor would reduce their salary obligations significantly.

EDIT: On second glance, that would leave Portland with no SF, so unless we're confident using our MLE to land a starter at SF, we would need to re-arrange the deal somehow. It would also leave our frontcourt very packed with Oden/Aldridge/Camby/Okafor (and 35 million on the payroll next season...)

[EGame]

Oh also, TBPup what are the progressions of the trade talks. I know I asked this two days ago or so, but I am wondering if trade talks between us and the other team has progressed at all? Are the chances higher that it happens, still the same, or are they near dead/lowered? I know you said it may have stalled a little bit because the asking price for Batum sucks, but what is the latest? I wish I knew who the player was to decide whether the deal is worth it shpping out Batum. As I said for Paul or a Bosh typle player, you easily do it.

[DusterBuster]

I guess I'm surprised at the lack of respect someone like Danny Granger gets. Here is a kid that is 27 years old, has averaged 23 ppg the last three seasons, is shooting over 38% from 3-pt range during that time, 85% FT, 5.5 rebounds, 2.5 assists, 1.2 assists, 1 block...that is Brandon Roy type numbers or better in almost every category except assists.

I've personally always been a huge Granger fan and I would give up Batum to get him, but not without at least a little hesitation. For starters, it depends what else is being given up along with him. Then I worry about his injuries. Is he going to be this generations Josh Howard or Micheal Redd?

I love Batum, but I do worry about his value doing a Rudy Fernandez. After seeing what has happened with the Bulls when they failed to capitalize on their young assets years ago, then seeing the same thine repeat with the Blazers and Rudy, I'm of the opinion that you maximize your assets. If you can get a player like Danny Granger for Batum, I think you gotta pull the trigger on that.

[Walton'sBeard!]

In addition, maybe I am still dreaming, but that news about one or both NO's PGs being available has my heart racing... Could Paul REALLY be had!?!?

The issue is we do not have a lot of salary to match a Paul / Okafor or Paul / Peja or Paul / Pose type trade. Camby and or Miller would have to be involved by my calculations. If anyone can run the math and come up with legitimate deals for this type of transaction it would much appreciated (I gotta leave for awhile or I would do it); I will attempt it later if no one else has.

Doing the math, here is the most reasonable deal I could come up with for us to take back one of NO's big salary obligations. I'm assuming a Paul/Posey deal isn't a real option as the savings for NO don't seem large enough. Anyway,

Paul/Okafor for Pryzbilla/Miller/Webster/Batum/Rudy.

That deal would take place after July 1st when Paul is no longer a BYC contract. For NO they save 4.5 million off the top this year (saves them from the luxury tax), then a total of 10.5 if Pryzbilla is paid by insurance. Then next year they save almost 20 million. In short, there would be significant savings for NO and they could still field a very competitive team with excellent defensive potential. Collison/Thornton/Batum/West/Aldrich(#11)

The more I think about it, I could honestly see NO making a deal along those lines. Their salary is staggering right now for a middling team, and ditching Paul/Okafor would reduce their salary obligations significantly.

For Paul, that isn't reasonable. Take out Pryz and put in Oden. It might also help to find a third team for Miller. Perhaps Miller to Indy and Foster plus a 2nd rounder to NO.

[SoHo]

For Paul, that isn't reasonable. Take out Pryz and put in Oden. It might also help to find a third team for Miller. Perhaps Miller to Indy and Foster plus a 2nd rounder to NO.

You're probably right, putting in Oden would also make the salaries easier. I think the more likely substitution would be Oden for Webster, making the deal:

Paul/Okafor for Oden/Batum/Pryz/Miller/Rudy.

I agree that Miller would be best flipped to another team, and I'm sure there is another team that would be willing to take him and send something useful to NO. Perhaps what TBpup was talking about when he said Pritchard was trying to get a 3rd team involved?