Player of the Year Discussion (Not Voting) Thread 2009-10

[JordansBulls]

Wade averaged 33.2 ppg / 5.6 rpg / 6.8 apg on 56% FG against the Celtics defense in the playoffs

Lebron averaged 26.8 ppg / 9.3 rpg / 7.2 apg on 45% FG against the Celtics defense in the playoffs

Kobe averaged 28.6 ppg / 8.0 rpg / 3.9 apg on 41% FG against the Celtics defense in the playoffs

[Minge]

-snipped-
This year, though, yeah, it absolutely has to be held against him. Game 5 wasn't the only poor game in that series. He was below par in at least two others, and you can make a case that Game 6 wasn't all that great either if you don't take the stats at face value. Glancing back over the linescores, other than two scoring explosions and the 19 rebounds in Game 6, I just think, "mediocre." For him, of course. After the Cavs stole back homecourt, he proceed to shoot under 40% in all three games, while averaging more than six turnovers per game, while averaging about eight points under his average, as his team goes down in flames. But he had a triple double in Game 6. Hooray!

May 04, 2010: Energetic Celtics Outhustle Cavs, Spoil LeBron's MVP Ceremony Night
May 07, 2010: James and the Cavs Need Less Talk, More Action
May 12, 2010: LeBron Comes Up Empty as Celtics Obliterate Cavaliers in Cleveland
May 16, 2010: Don't Believe the Historical Revisionism About the Cavaliers

Article: "Celtics Advance to the Eastern Conference Finals, Cavs Begin Long and Challenging Offseason" (May 14, 2010)

"I'm a big boxing fan. I like reading and watching body language. Right now looking at the Cavs, they look like a boxer whose will has been taken away."--ESPN's Mark Jackson describing the listless Cavaliers near the end of Boston's 94-85 series clinching win over Cleveland

"This smells to me of quitting. You've given up."--Jackson expressing disgust as the Cavaliers do not even try to commit a foul as time runs out on their season

A proud and disciplined former champion--the Boston Celtics--just dismantled the number one overall seed in the NBA playoffs, the Cleveland Cavaliers. As ESPN's Jeff Van Gundy noted right after Boston's 94-85 game six victory, while the result itself is more surprising than shocking it is certainly shocking how indifferent the Cavs seemed and how poorly the Cavs played at home in this series after being nearly invincible at Quicken Loans Arena for the past two seasons. Kevin Garnett led the Celtics with 22 points and 12 rebounds; after spending the greater part of this season dragging his surgically repaired right leg up and down the court, Garnett proved to be a real X factor in this series: Boston Coach Doc Rivers stated from the outset that his offensive game plan involved posting up Garnett to get him at least 20 field goal attempts per game and the Cavaliers never found an answer for Garnett's turnaround jumpers nor did they exploit the fact that he still lacks lateral mobility defensively. Rajon Rondo had another excellent performance, finishing with 21 points, 12 assists, three rebounds and five steals. Paul Pierce (13 points on 4-13 field goal shooting) and Ray Allen (eight points on 2-8 field goal shooting) did not contribute much but bench players Rasheed Wallace (13 points on 4-8 field goal shooting, including two three pointers) and Tony Allen (10 points, three steals) picked up the slack. The Celtics led most of the way, built a double digit cushion in the second half and held off a half-hearted Cavalier rally that consisted of nothing more than back to back three pointers by LeBron James to pull the Cavs to within 78-74 with 9:34 remaining in the fourth quarter; time and score suggested that the Cavs had an opportunity to win the game but anyone who watched this game with understanding--particularly if you had also watched Tuesday's debacle--knew that the Cavs were through. It was Cleveland's "Rope a Dope" moment and the Cavs were the "dope"; during that famous boxing match, right before Muhammad Ali knocked out the champion George Foreman he asked Foreman "Is that all you got?" and Foreman later recalled that he thought to himself, "Yeah, that's about it." The important difference between Foreman and the Cavs--other than the fact that Foreman actually won a championship--is that Foreman wore himself out by trying so hard to knock out Ali, while the Cavs played hard sporadically for a few moments versus the Celtics before apparently deciding that this playing hard business is too tough, after which they packed it in and prepared for summer vacation.

LeBron James authored the most confounding, least impressive and ultimately meaningless triple double that I have ever seen:

*James scored a game-high 27 points--but he shot just 8-21 from the field.

*James grabbed a playoff career-high 19 rebounds--but, as Jackson repeatedly noted, instead of pushing the ball full bore up the court after most of his 16 defensive rebounds James was content to either walk the ball up the court or else give the ball up without even being pressured by Boston defenders.

*James dished off 10 assists--but he was a one man fastbreak for the Celtics, committing nine turnovers, most of which would be classified as "unforced errors" in tennis terminology.

Scottie Pippen scored just four points in game one of the 1998 Eastern Conference Finals and yet teammates and opponents alike declared that he dominated that contest; in contrast, James stacked up all kinds of numbers in game six versus Boston but he neither seemed to dominate the game nor did he have much control over the outcome: it was like he was putting up statistics in a vacuum while the Celtics were focusing on what they had to do to actually win the game. With every Cavalier not named Mo Williams (22 points on 8-18 field goal shooting) struggling to make a shot, the team desperately needed James to drive to the hoop with abandon, but he only did so sporadically. Jamal Mashburn made a very interesting point at halftime that he reiterated after the game: a major difference between LeBron James and Kobe Bryant is that Kobe Bryant attacks double teams quickly and efficiently and he is able to make one dribble and two dribble pullup jumpers, while James too often hesitates in the face of double teams and seems to need to take multiple dribbles before making a play; also, although James has improved his jump shot he still does not have the one dribble and two dribble pullup jumpers in his repertoire. During some earlier NBA TV and TNT telecasts, Chris Webber has also noted that casual fans may not understand just how deadly a weapon those one dribble and two dribble pullup jumpers are for Bryant; Webber asserts that those are the shots--in combination with Bryant's other weapons, of course--that make Bryant so difficult to guard.

After the game, James said, "The fact that it's over right now is definitely a surprise to me. A friend of mine told me, 'I guess you've got to go through a lot of nightmares before you realize your dream.' That's what's going on for me individually right now." Read that last sentence again: "That's what's going on for me individually right now." James did not mention what his team is going through or the agony that the long-suffering Cleveland fans are experiencing. No, this whole experience really is just about LeBron--at least, from LeBron's perspective.

Now begins the long summer of discontent for Cavalier fans. The Boston faithful--spurred on by ESPN.com columnist Bill Simmons--taunted James by chanting "New York Knicks!" when James shot free throws but James has only himself to blame for that; James could have muted all of the noise about free agency by either re-signing with the Cavs--much like Kobe Bryant quietly re-signed with the Lakers months ago--or else insisting that he would say nothing about this subject because his sole focus is on winning a championship in 2010. Yes, I know that James eventually refused to take questions about free agency, but he waited to take that stand until the story had developed a huge life of its own. This became a distraction for his team and may have ultimately resulted in the front office making hasty moves for presumed short term benefits instead of constructing the roster for the long haul; the Cavs have been bending over backwards for James for years while he has refused to commit to staying with the team. James' comments and general demeanor in his postgame press conference hardly offered any comfort to Cleveland fans, nor did it seem promising that the quickest move that James made all night was ripping off his Cleveland jersey after the game and tossing it to a locker room attendant as if he were throwing out garbage. Until recently I thought that James was far too smart to leave a 60-plus win team with a defensive-minded coach in order to start over with a lesser team--but until recently I also could not have imagined that James would sleepwalk through an embarrassing 32 point home defeat in a pivotal game five.

I have no idea what James plans to do come July 1 and right now I am much more interested in watching/analyzing the four remaining playoff teams than in speculating about who the ringless "King" will play for next season.

Meanwhile, the revisionist historians are already out in full force, so here are some preemptive strikes regarding the mythology that is already being created about LeBron James and this playoff series:

1) I don't want to hear anything about the alleged impact that LeBron James' alleged elbow injury had on this series. Everyone who watched ESPN's pregame show saw James standing at half court repeatedly shooting half court shots with his right arm, using both an underhand and an overhand delivery. In other words, his elbow is not impairing his strength or range of motion--which is what I have been saying all along. Will I change my tune if, as some have speculated (with no apparent concrete evidence, since the MRI of James' elbow revealed no structural damage), James has offseason elbow surgery? No, I will not; if James' elbow is hurt that seriously then why the hell would he shoot half court circus shots before playing in an elimination game? This elbow injury is either fake drama--the unnecessary left handed free throw versus Chicago, the rubbing of the joint when the cameras are focused on him, the black sleeve being worn and then being taken off--or pure foolishness, which is the only way to describe shooting half court shots with a serious injury (if that turns out to be what James did). My firm belief--until proven otherwise--is that James has exactly what the MRI revealed: a bruise. James is hurt but he is not injured to the extent that he cannot function (in contrast to Kobe Bryant, who has a broken finger on his shooting hand and a troublesome right knee that kept swelling up after every game toward the end of the regular season).

2) I don't want to hear about Cleveland's supposedly deficient supporting cast. I have heard some people say that the Cavs had the best player in this series but that the Celtics had players 2-4. Well, I've got news for you: the Celtics had the best player in this series and his name is Rajon Rondo. Rondo dominated the action at both ends of the court throughout this series. Furthermore, although his numbers were not overwhelming, you could make the case that Kevin Garnett was the second best player in this series; he certainly provided more consistent effort and production than LeBron James did, even though James put up gaudier statistics. The sad reality for Cleveland fans--and the Cleveland franchise--is that James not only was not the best player during this series but he could not even find it within himself to play hard all of the time. James' shooting was erratic and he (mis)handled the ball like his name is Edward Scissorhands. The Cavs have an All-Star point guard, an All-Star power forward, a future Hall of Fame center who made the 2009 All-NBA Third Team, a two-time All-Star center coming off of the bench, a Sixth Man of the Year candidate who made the All-Defensive Second Team, a reserve guard who ranked third in the NBA in three point field goal percentage in 2010 and several other reserve players who could start for many of the league's playoff teams.

All-time greats Kareem Abdul-Jabbar and Michael Jordan played for sub-.500 teams when they legitimately had no help. Are we really supposed to believe--after back to back seasons of 66 and 61 wins--that LeBron James is so much better than Abdul-Jabbar and Jordan that he actually carried a worthless roster to the best record in the NBA while notching two wins this season over the reigning NBA champions?

Is Cleveland's roster perfect? Of course not--but no roster in the league is perfect. The Celtics are aging and injury prone; the Magic lack frontcourt size other than Howard and Gortat; the Lakers have the least productive starting point guard among the playoff teams plus a bench that is so unreliable Coach Phil Jackson said that watching them play makes him want to throw up.

Most people picked Cleveland to beat Boston precisely because the Cavs have a better team than the Celtics.

3) I don't want to hear that Mike Brown does not know how to make in game adjustments. I already addressed this subject at length, so here is the Cliffs Notes version: great coaches do most of their work in practice, preparing their players for what most likely will happen in the upcoming games; so-called in game adjustments are, in many cases, simply the application of a previously determined plan when a given situation (foul trouble, different matchup scenarios, etc.) happens. A good coach does not have to come up with some totally new plan in the middle of a game. The real problem that Brown faced during this postseason--an issue that I mentioned in March but that the Cavs initially seemed to overcome--is that injuries and midseason transactions prevented him from establishing a set player rotation and letting that rotation develop good chemistry. Every player on the Celtics knows his role and has a good idea how much playing time he will get, but Coach Brown never had the time to reach that comfort zone with this team. Coach Brown has been criticized for essentially benching J.J. Hickson after Hickson was a starter for most of the year--but if Brown started Hickson over Shaquille O'Neal or Antawn Jamison and the Cavs failed to win the championship then what would Brown say to owner Dan Gilbert and General Manager Danny Ferry? Gilbert did not spend millions of dollars on former All-Stars to have them riding the pine. This is not just a matter of money or office politics, though; O'Neal provides low post scoring that Hickson does not, while Jamison is the "stretch four" that everyone thought the Cavs needed to deal with Garnett and with Orlando's Rashard Lewis. Hickson thrills fans with his energy level and his dunks but he also makes a lot of mistakes defensively.

James' looming free agency placed great burdens on Gilbert, Ferry and Brown, each of whom clearly felt the need to appease James in the short term even at the possible expense of the team's long term future. Ferry broke up a team that made it to the 2007 NBA Finals and then he broke up a team that advanced to the 2009 Eastern Conference Finals. While Ferry's moves improved the roster on paper, it would have been interesting to see how either of those squads might have performed if they had been given the opportunity to play together for one more full season but Gilbert and Ferry clearly believed that if they did not constantly turn over the roster then James might take his ball and go home (or, leave home, to be precise). The ironic thing is that the 2009 team was built to face Boston (Ben Wallace matched up well with Garnett) but lost to Orlando, while the 2010 team was built to face Orlando (O'Neal was brought in specifically to deal with Dwight Howard, while Anthony Parker, Jamario Moon and Antawn Jamison were supposed to help Cleveland match up with Orlando's perimeter players) but lost to Boston. ESPN's Jeff Van Gundy rightly said during the game six telecast that the Cavaliers have done everything possible to encourage James to stay. Furthermore, there is every reason to believe that if James does stay then Gilbert will continue to spend cash like there is no tomorrow and that Gilbert will replace Coach Brown if that is what James wants.

Despite the constant roster turnover, the Cavs have consistently been an elite defensive team during Coach Brown's tenure--and he has had to come up with some creative schemes to "hide" some players who are not great individual defenders, a problem that reached crisis proportions in this series when Garnett and Rondo went at Antawn Jamison and Mo Williams respectively. Given enough time, Coach Brown could have perhaps come up with a scheme of defensive rotations to provide help versus Garnett and Rondo without giving up dunks and layups but O'Neal and Jamison hardly played together during the regular season and that lack of chemistry burned the Cavs defensively on several occasions.

My only criticism of Brown this season is that he "rested" healthy players near the end of the regular season as opposed to using those final few games to set up his playoff rotation.

4) I certainly don't want to hear about how LeBron James is supposedly going to save the New York Knicks (or any other franchise). When the NBA MVP twice exits the playoffs without a championship--or even a Finals appearance--despite playing for a deep, talented and defensive-minded team that posted the best record in the NBA in back to back seasons, I become skeptical that he is suddenly going to take 2010 Draft Lottery teams--or even lower level playoff teams--to the 2011 Finals. It has suddenly become a popular notion that James may bolt to Chicago; if James cannot get to the Finals with Shaquille O'Neal, Zydrunas Ilgauskas, Antawn Jamison, Anderson Varejao and J.J. Hickson as his bigs then why should I believe that he is going to reach the Finals with Joakim Noah, Brad Miller and Taj Gibson? Add Chris Bosh to that mix and I still do not see the Bulls winning the East. Don't even get me started with the Knicks, who would likely have to get rid of their best current player--David Lee--in order to sign James. Mike D'Antoni's system would undoubtedly enable James to set all kinds of individual statistical records but if James cannot win a title with "San Antonio East" in Cleveland then he certainly is not going to win a title with "Seven Seconds or Less East" in New York.

[JordansBulls]

No offense "Minge" but I don't believe you should be able to post these long articles if you are not part of the voting.

[bballcool34]

I'm not part of the voting panel, but I'm going to post the stats Kobe/Lebron had for finals(if that's alright with JordanBulls...). Sometimes stats are definitely overvalued and obviously the stats won't capture Kobe's defense on Rondo--which was very good for the most part--and Lebron's seemingly lackluster, lackadaisical play at times, but most people will probably into this year with their minds made up more so than other years, so the stats seem like a good thing to look at:

Kobe vs. Celtics (Finals)

Code: Select all

G   MPG   FG%   3PT%   FT%   RPG   APG   SPG   BPG   TO   PPG
7  41.1  0.405  0.319  0.883  8.0  3 .9  2.1  0.7  3.9  28.6

Lebron vs. Celtics (2nd Round)

Code: Select all

G   MPG   FG%   3PT%   FT%   RPG   APG   SPG   BPG   TO   PPG
6  42.5  0.447  0.269  0.743  9.3  7.2  2.2  1.3  4.5  26.8

Their efficiency was closer than FG% alone indicates, so TS% would be a better measure. Still, just looking at the stats, they're pretty close. I don't think the difference was large at all---Kobe did play better defense---but he also had the perfect cast to do so in terms of matching up with the Celtics. The size of the Lakers really bothered Rondo/Pierce and even to a lesser degree bench players like Davis.

I don't know--I think Kobe gets a sort of pass for the series because the Lakers won--but IMO he played a very poor game 7 despite the rebounding--he was missing free throws in the first half, missing a lot of shots, and a 5 point swing the other way if the Celtics could knock down some of those late threes earlier, and we're looking at a fresh round of "Kobe couldn't beat the Celtics"...

I know the "what if" game is pointless--but I'm just not sure if a 4 point win--that was due more to HCA, LA's other players than any great showing from Kobe--should be enough to lift him to the number 1 spot over Lebron, who was way better in the regular season (and the difference here really is huge) and not that much worse against the Celtics....

Kobe still had a very good playoffs, and I can understand putting him ahead of Lebron because of leadership/intangibles which led to LA winning...but I don't think it's enough.

I don't see Wade as the number 1 though---he didn't have the regular season to lift him over Lebron and his playoffs, despite his excellent play, wasn't enough.

Lebron was the best balance between regular season/playoffs IMO. I can see Kobe as #1 as well for winning the championship, playing great team basketball while doing so, and as a whole (if you look at everything, the title) being the best player in the playoffs. He looked like a leader out there.

But Wade? His one playoff series was 5 games, he was down 3-0 at one point, was able to will his team to one win (and the phrase "willed a team" is used too often--but in Wade's case it was true) when he got hot from behind the arc, but I don't see how that's enough to put him ahead of Lebron or Kobe. One series, which the Heat lost in 5 games, shouldn't be enough to lift him from the number 2/3 spot during the regular season to number one IMO---especially when he wasn't the defining player at any time during the year as the other two were...

[shawngoat23]

No offense "Minge" but I don't believe you should be able to post these long articles if you are not part of the voting.

I'm fine with his articles, but to be honest, I haven't had the time to read them (studying for boards).

[ronnymac2]

I don't know what I'm going to do with Lebron James. I really don't. That game 5 was dissappointing. I'm not a Cavs fan or anything, but I like LBJ and root for the guy. He's possibly the best player I have ever seen since I became a basketball fan. He never dissappoints me as a viewer. I don't remember him ever doing that. He always lives up to the hype and always comes through.

Game 5 was different. It wasn't the production part. It wasn't the leadership; the other Cavs are men and imo, they need to act like adults and not look lost like little kids when their leader struggles. I was just dissappointed in Lebron's performance as an individual. Throughout that game, I kept thinking "c'mon, he's just waiting for the time...he's going to drive hard to the hoop and just attack." Yet he kept shooting jumpers. Bad jumpers. He wasn't attacking. His assists didn't feel like Lebron-like assists. They felt like Starbury-like assists when he just passes to pass. In the end, as I thought about the Cavs losing the game, I had a feeling of "Why didn't Lebron doing anything about it?" That's never a feeling I like to have about a player. That's not a feeling I ever have about James.

I see games 2 and 4 as just sub-par games in terms of production. I don't know why anybody is complaining about game 6 when the dude was trying to do everyting he could to bring his team back in the fourth quarter. His team sucked so much ass in that quarter. They did ****. I remember Mo Williams missed a wide open jumper from the foul line. Wide open. Cleveland actually almost came back in that game. They were in striking distance. LBJ just didn't get the required help like he got in game 1. Game 1 I thought was a great moment for Cleveland because LBJ struggled throughout and his teammates picked him up and then he finished strong. I think that's great because a superstar always needs teammates to carry him for stretches. Game 6, he didn't have that. Yeah, he turned the ball over, but I thought he played well individually. Which helps his case by lessening the blow of game 5.

But I have to think about how I weigh that game 5. I think James is still first in my top 5, but I need to think on it some more.

[semi-sentient]

Is it any surprise that LeBron's teammates didn't show up in game 6 after the game 5 that he had?

I understand his teammates are grown men and all, but a leader is supposed to have his guys fired up and playing with some attitude. He did that during the regular season and that's a large part of why I thought they were going to win it all. It's the same thing that Kobe did in 2008-09 when he had his guys ready from start to finish, never letting up and never giving the opponent a realistic chance of beating us. When we needed a big game, we got it. I never once felt that from LeBron once the post-season started. For whatever reason, he was a different person.

Again, what happened when the rest of the Lakers were standing around doing nothing in game 5 at the Garden? Their leader did what he was supposed to do and lit a fire under their asses by calling them out and asking for some help. I'm beginning to wonder if LeBron even understands that he needs to do that from time to time because he has yet to show that kind of emotion after a tough loss.

Serious question: Did anyone feel like LeBron really cared whether or not the Cavs beat the Celtics?

[JordansBulls]

Serious question: Did anyone feel like LeBron really cared whether or not the Cavs beat the Celtics?

I'm sure he didn't want to lose to them for a 2nd time, and definitely didn't want to lose with the best record in the league again.

[lorak]

1. LeBron
2. Wade
3. Durant
4. Pau Gasol
5. Kobe

[ItsMillerTime]

Im probably going

1. Dwade - 2nd best player in the RS, had a great series against the Cs, not his fault his teammates are D-league talent
2. LBJ- By far the best RS player, but struggled against the great Boston defense
3. Kobe- Really dominant all year. But I feel the two above him played at a higher level all season, but Kobe had the better teammates
4. Nash- Best PG this season, had a very strong PS and another assist filled RS
5. Durant- Break out season, unbelievable scorer.

HM- Dirk, Howard, Pau, D-Will

[semi-sentient]

Serious question: Did anyone feel like LeBron really cared whether or not the Cavs beat the Celtics?

I'm sure he didn't want to lose to them for a 2nd time, and definitely didn't want to lose with the best record in the league again.

No one wants to lose. I'm sure he didn't want to either, but he certainly didn't act like it bothered him that the Celtics bounced (or were about to bounce) him. He didn't hold himself or his teammates accountable at any point during that series and he was entirely too lackadaisical considering the stakes.

Remember how pissed off he was when he lost to the Magic? Dude stormed off the court and was livid in the post-game interviews. I never had an issue with him not shaking hands with the Magic either. Why would he? That kind of passion for winning is what's missing in a lot of superstars today and I certainly don't blame him for being completely pissed after leaving it all out on the floor.

I saw nothing like that from LeBron this post-season. What I saw was a guy that had his mind elsewhere, perhaps on where he'd be playing next season instead of focusing on the task at hand.

[semi-sentient]

1. LeBron
2. Wade
3. Durant
4. Pau Gasol
5. Kobe

Really dude?

Durant completely flamed out in the playoffs and you're giving him a pass?

Gasol over Kobe? Come on now.

Give some justification if you're going to vote like that. I'd love to hear the reasoning.

[Gongxi]

And it's one game out of like 90+.

Like a regular-game in February deserves equal billing with a pivotal, series -- and season -- changing Game 5, right?

I get what you're saying. But I also don't understand how anybody can try to say all games are created equal with a straight face.

All games aren't the same. Some games are more important than any 20 regular-season games put together. This was one of them. As such, it wasn't just one game out of 90-some. Not even close. It dealt a death blow to what had been a championship-or-bust season.

Like I said, I'm not sure it's enough to knock LeBron out of first considering he was seemingly so far ahead of the pack. When I try to put somebody in front of him, it doesn't seem very satisfying.

At the same time, I'm not sure if I've ever seen anything like that performance. The sheer indifference of it still blows me away.

I never said all games were the same. But how much extra are we gonna count it? Double? Triple? Are we going to count good games that were important in the playoffs that much too? He had plenty of those, too, so I think in the end there's not much difference. I mean, Game 4 against the Bulls: The Cavs are up 2-1 and if they lose it's a tie series going back to Cleveland- in the first round no less. LeBron puts up 37/12/11 on 65% shooting. Are we gonna count that as more than just some game in February?

What about other players bad games in the playoffs? Are we going to count those extra, too, even if their teammates showed up- or even carried them- to a win? Or are we just going to look at this one game, count it as more important, and leave everything else as is? Cause it seems like this is a referendum on one game and whether it makes LeBron a better or worse player over the entire course of the season, and that seems ridiculous to me.

[Doctor MJ]

Is it any surprise that LeBron's teammates didn't show up in game 6 after the game 5 that he had?

I understand his teammates are grown men and all, but a leader is supposed to have his guys fired up and playing with some attitude. He did that during the regular season and that's a large part of why I thought they were going to win it all. It's the same thing that Kobe did in 2008-09 when he had his guys ready from start to finish, never letting up and never giving the opponent a realistic chance of beating us. When we needed a big game, we got it. I never once felt that from LeBron once the post-season started. For whatever reason, he was a different person.

Again, what happened when the rest of the Lakers were standing around doing nothing in game 5 at the Garden? Their leader did what he was supposed to do and lit a fire under their asses by calling them out and asking for some help. I'm beginning to wonder if LeBron even understands that he needs to do that from time to time because he has yet to show that kind of emotion after a tough loss.

Serious question: Did anyone feel like LeBron really cared whether or not the Cavs beat the Celtics?

I think you're assuming way too much intangible determinism. LeBron played his heart out and then some the previous year and his teammates never stepped it up, and the Lakers going from losing a close game on the road to winning close games at home is not really all that extraordinary.

The "he didn't care" argument seems alien to me. Put yourself in his place - think of all the criticism he's getting now, think of how much of his life he's dedicating to this game - not caring is not anything like a normal human response.

As far as where I think LeBron's head was in Game 5, I think the psychological factor was that LeBron had the epiphany that the Celtics had a gear the Cavs didn't, that in all likelihood the Cavs were going to get upset again and he'd be blamed for it, and he slipped out of the now. He wasn't playing with indifference, he was thinking about all the things that the things that would come at him afterward - he played without focus and with self-pity.

The irony is that if LeBron had known up front how good Boston was - that they'd almost sweep Orlando and push the Lakers to the absolute brink - I doubt he'd have had any mental hiccup. In LeBron's mind, he was losing to a team that was lucky to be in the 2nd round, and for someone for whom every year from this point on will be championship or bust, it gave him vertigo.

[shawngoat23]

Official ballot:

1. LeBron James
2. Kobe Bryant
3. Dwyane Wade
4. Dwight Howard
5. Kevin Durant

I've already explained #1 and #2 earlier. Durant and Howard were top 3 (neck-and-neck) for me before playoffs started, but both had somewhat disappointing postseasons (individually speaking), so I'll drop them a little. I decided to go with Howard over Durant because of superior team success and his impact defensively.

Wade gets a nod at #3. He was a stud during the regular season and there were times during his abbreviated postseason where he made me think, "Damn, this is the best player in the league, if only he had teammates". Granted, other players (i.e. LeBron and Kobe) impress me as well and have those moments as well, but I'm very comfortable having Wade in the top 3, on the strength of a very strong regular season and arguably the most impressive individual postseason performance.

[KING JAMES1978]

3. Lebron James - Won League MVP, 1st in WS Per 48 minutes in the season 1st in Win Shares in the season 1st in PER in the season. 1st Team All NBA, 1st Team All Defense, Finished 2nd in PER in the playoffs. However in the critical Game 5 he laid an egg in this one. So he drops down a spot.

Do you rememeber or you are young game 5 1989 Pistons-Bulls?Because I watched that game and Jordan received a lot of critism like LBJ.But after the elimination in game 6 he was still the best in the game because he was in a higher level from the other players that season.
LBJ the same.A bad game but still by far the best player in the game for the other 90+ games.
Stop because you seems like a double-tongued.
Use Home-court adavanatge as an extra blame to LeBron is ridiculous.HCA?GTFO.Who gives a damn for the HCA?If your teammates like Jamison and Mo sucks in the most games who gives a damn for the HCA?Suppoting cast if it's good protect great players in their bad nights.Kobe had 10-29 in game 3 but his team won.Kobe had 6-24 in game 7 but his team won.Kobe sucks in the first round against Thunder but his team won.Jordan had 5-19 in game 6 vs Sonics but his team won.LeBron had 8-21 with 19 rebounds/10 assist(ok and 9 turnovers) game 6 vs Celtics but his team lose.
Look his season and you can understand easily that he was in a GOAT level.

[JordansBulls]

3. Lebron James - Won League MVP, 1st in WS Per 48 minutes in the season 1st in Win Shares in the season 1st in PER in the season. 1st Team All NBA, 1st Team All Defense, Finished 2nd in PER in the playoffs. However in the critical Game 5 he laid an egg in this one. So he drops down a spot.

Do you rememeber or you are young game 5 1989 Pistons-Bulls?Because I watched that game and Jordan received a lot of critism like LBJ.But after the elimination in game 6 he was still the best in the game because he was in a higher level from the other players that season.
LBJ the same.A bad game but still by far the best player in the game for the other 90+ games.
Stop because you seems like a double-tongued.
Use Home-court adavanatge as an extra blame to LeBron is ridiculous.HCA?GTFO.Who gives a damn for the HCA.If your teammates like Jamison and Mo sucks in the most games who gives a damn for the HCA.Suppoting cast if it's good protect great players in their bad nights.Kobe had 10-29 in game 3 but his team won.Kobe had 6-24 in game 7 but his team won.Kobe sucks in the first round against Thunder but his team won.Jordan had 5-19 in game 6 vs Sonics but his team won.LeBron had 8-21 with 19 rebounds/10 assist(ok and 9 turnovers) game 6 vs Celtics but his team lose.
Look his season and you can understand easily that he was in a GOAT level.

Lebron lost with the Best Record in the League and on the only 60+ win team in the playoffs.



http://espn.go.com/nba/playoffs/2010/ma ... -cavaliers

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/playoffs/clebos

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/playoffs/se ... MGAuWmxMEF


Cavs won 61 games and were the only 60+ win team on the season. Celtics won 50 games this season.

Anyway, Lebron has the same record as T-mac in a sense with HCA. Tmac 0-2 in series with HCA against teams that won 50+ games and Lebron is 0-2 in series with HCA against teams that won 50+ games.


When the Bulls lost Game 5 they lost on the road to the team was in the Finals the year before and who had the Best Record that season at 63-19 while we were 47-35. Jordan had beaten two teams that playoffs alone who had won 50+ games, while when Lebron faced a 50 win team even with HCA he lost.

[NO-KG-AI]

LeBron
Wade
Kobe
Howard
Durant

[KING JAMES1978]

^^^
Again HCA??????Again...I don't give a damn about the best record.The same if team had 53 wins the same if team had 65.If your teammates don't protect or they can't protect your bad nights who gives a damn about HCA?You give a damn because you discover that Jordan won when his team had the home court advantage.
Personally I don't give a damn.And LeBron can easily challenge MJ in some years as the GOAT and you know that and that's why you try to find every stupid reason like HCA to dipsute LBJ.But guess what....He is still young and he has already 2 MVPs.
Continue to dispute him...Everyone knows what you do.
This year you choose Wade as the best in the game because you believe that he isn't a threat to MJ at the future.This is the true with you..Everything it's all about MJ.Win shares/HCA.Talking for Basketball?ZERO.

[Hobo4President]

I have to wonder why Lebron gets a pass for postseason short-comings. Has any other team failed to make the Finals with the best record, 2 years in a row? Not to sound harsh, but if players get credit when they lead their team despite the odds(Hakeem), then there should also be some penalty for under-achieving too.

I ask this because when we look at other players throughout the project, there hasn't been the same mentality.

- 07' Dirk: MVP, All-NBA 1st, fantastic RS leading Mavs to 67 wins, but lost to the GSW in the 1st round. He ranked 3rd that year, Had no 1st place votes, and 10 votes in the 4th & 5th spots.

- 06' Wade: 2nd All-NBA team during the year, 6th in MVP voting, but a great PS put him at #1 with 16 votes. Meanwhile, Dirk who was 3rd in MVP, and lost the FInals in 6, only got 2 1st place votes.

- 95' DRob: MVP, tremendous RS, but loses out to Hakeem because of the Rockets PS run. Ends up in 3rd.

Even in the 83' discussion that just started, I'm sure Moncrief's PS success, and Bird getting swept will play a major role in voting.

You do realize Lebron was the player who got them there? Without Lebron, they might not have made the playoffs. But w/e, I'm not surprised, you do have a Skip Bayless avatar. Even if Lebron played out of his mind (like he did against the Magic last year, but he still gets blamed for some reason), the Cavs would have probably still lost because of his supporting cast not being able to step up.