Where do you guys have Kobe in the all-time list now?

[TonyMontana]

How about you guys ask me if I'm a Heat fan??

I will tell you no..Born and raised in Long Beach....Lakers till the day I die...

But whatever....it is what it is...

Dude I saw you on the Heat board saying this here......

Fisher is better than Chalmers and Arroyo...Period

It will be a upgrade over them to. Plus we need that Veteran presence on this young team to keep ego's in check..

Yeah you're really a Laker fan huh ? How about excepting the title of bandwagon fan ?

So who bandwagon are you exactly riding on ?

And you can't deny it because here's the topic I spotted you in.....
viewtopic.php?f=20&t=1030043&start=1155#p24276667

Oh yeah I also know Iceburg Slim is playing in two jerseys also........I mean I don't get what that bull sh|t is all about, seriously that's second grade crap.

It's kind of sad that you are tracking my post around other mod's to prove a point...Why I can't like 2,3,4 teams if I want? It's just basketball my dude..Seriously...But do you and I'ma do me. Still got love for ya and I appreciate your passion 4 the game.

Your a FAKE ARSE BUSTA.

[dub81]

.[/quote]

Your a FAKE ARSE BUSTA.[/quote]

Stop talking that tough guy talk my man. You know you would not say that in my face so why say it? Hiding behind a computer and talking tough is not cool. Kind of sad.

[TonyMontana]

Stop talking that tough guy talk my man. You know you would not say that in my face so why say it? Hiding behind a computer and talking tough is not cool. Kind of sad.

LMAO ................. Oh no BUSTA I promise you I WOULD And I wouldnt have a problem doing it either.

[dub81]

Stop talking that tough guy talk my man. You know you would not say that in my face so why say it? Hiding behind a computer and talking tough is not cool. Kind of sad.

LMAO ................. Oh no BUSTA I promise you I WOULD And I wouldnt have a problem doing it either.

I see you in cali, let's meet somewhere and have a drink. Talk about the Lakers! Love meeting NBA fans.

cw2147@hotmail.com

[Wavy Q]

this derailed quickly

[TonyMontana]

Stop talking that tough guy talk my man. You know you would not say that in my face so why say it? Hiding behind a computer and talking tough is not cool. Kind of sad.

LMAO ................. Oh no BUSTA I promise you I WOULD And I wouldnt have a problem doing it either.

I see you in cali, let's meet somewhere and have a drink. Talk about the Lakers! Love meeting NBA fans.

cw2147@hotmail.com

Are you asking me out Busta??

Oh wait snappppps ............. Your calling me out.

I'll hit you up tomorrow.............. I PROMISE YOU.

[dub81]

Looking forward to it! Not talking about it no more. Time to be about it Tony.

[Anklebreaker702]

I know you aren't talking to me, but I gotta respond to what you just said.

Bird was every bit as good at Jordan on the offensive end....he wasn't as stylish but he was every bit as productive and effective. Plus, now factor in that Bird was a better shooter and Bird was also better passer. Not to mention, Bird would usually actually outplay Michael, even during the season where Jordan won the MVP.....Bird still managed to outplay him throughout that season. I could bring up the stats and all that if you would like, but I'm too lazy to do that right now.

I know you guys are Laker fans, but c'mon respect Bird guys.

You haven't been around long enough to know that I am actually a Bird fan. I agree that Bird was 1 helluva scorer but not better than Michael. I also agree that Bird usually out played him. I wasn't downing Bird, I was just uplifting Magic. Bird is my boy as well & that's coming from a true Laker fan

[houston911]

at george mikan being better than kobe

at any civil rights era player being better than kobe

hush

[TonyMontana]

Looking forward to it! Not talking about it no more. Time to be about it Tony.

LMFAO Okay

[NoDunksAllowed]

You haven't been around long enough to know that I am actually a Bird fan. I agree that Bird was 1 helluva scorer but not better than Michael. I also agree that Bird usually out played him. I wasn't downing Bird, I was just uplifting Magic. Bird is my boy as well & that's coming from a true Laker fan

Bird was the much better passer than Michael was, literally zero people had the court-vision Bird did, literally zero. Maybe some did like Magic, Nash, and some others, but Bird was most definitely the best passing forward ever, at least for now. Maybe Lebron can catch up to him, but I doubt he will because he ruined everything by joining Miami.

That being said, Bird's versatility on the offensive end and scoring end also sets him apart from MJ a bit. Jordan was more explosive, but Bird was almost every bit as productive as he was. I'm arguing that Bird was just as good if not better than Jordan was on offense, not just scoring....In my opinion, I don't think there is anything wrong with saying Jordan was a better offensive player than Bird was. I just think it's close and I personally believe Bird takes the cake, but by a little. Jordan is clearly greater than Bird, but I wouldn't argue using their offense though.

[dub81]

You haven't been around long enough to know that I am actually a Bird fan. I agree that Bird was 1 helluva scorer but not better than Michael. I also agree that Bird usually out played him. I wasn't downing Bird, I was just uplifting Magic. Bird is my boy as well & that's coming from a true Laker fan

Bird was the much better passer than Michael was, literally zero people had the court-vision Bird did, literally zero. Maybe some did like Magic, Nash, and some others, but Bird was most definitely the best passing forward ever, at least for now. Maybe Lebron can catch up to him, but I doubt he will because he ruined everything by joining Miami.

That being said, Bird's versatility on the offensive end and scoring end also sets him apart from MJ a bit. Jordan was more explosive, but Bird was almost every bit as productive as he was. I'm arguing that Bird was just as good if not better than Jordan was on offense, not just scoring....In my opinion, I don't think there is anything wrong with saying Jordan was a better offensive player than Bird was. I just think it's close and I personally believe Bird takes the cake, but by a little. Jordan is clearly greater than Bird, but I wouldn't argue using their offense though.

agree...But what Jordan got on Bird is on the defensive end. Jordan was just as good on defense than offense. Only time I really seen Jordan get worked was when A.I crossed him over and Jordan was already on the decline when it happened. What I liked about Jordan was that he took pride on defense. He would not let nobody score on him and if they did he would come right back at you.

[LAKERFAN24]

GOAT

[HoopsPro]

Jordan was more explosive, but Bird was almost every bit as productive as he was. I'm arguing that Bird was just as good if not better than Jordan was on offense, not just scoring...

I'm willing to bet that even Larry Bird would disagree with the above comments.

[HoopsPro]

Regarding Kobe's place among all time greats ---

I'll answer the question by choosing who I'd want to start a franchise with if I were a GM, and if time periods didn't exist.

1) Michael Jordan

2) Kareem Abdul Jabbar

3) Wilt Chamberlain

4) Magic Johnson

5) Larry Bird

6) Shaq

7) Hakeem Olajuwon

8) Tim Duncan

9) Bill Russell

10) Oscar Robertson

Honorable mention....

Kobe, Jerry West, Rick Berry, Julius Irving, John Havlicek, Elgin Baylor, Scottie Pippen, Isiah Thomas.

[dub81]

Regarding Kobe's place among all time greats ---

I'll answer the question by choosing who I'd want to start a franchise with if I were a GM, and if time periods didn't exist.

1) Michael Jordan

2) Kareem Abdul Jabbar

3) Wilt Chamberlain

4) Magic Johnson

5) Larry Bird

6) Shaq

7) Hakeem Olajuwon

8) Tim Duncan

9) Bill Russell

10) Oscar Robertson

Honorable mention....

Kobe, Jerry West, Rick Berry, Julius Irving, John Havlicek, Elgin Baylor, Scottie Pippen, Isiah Thomas.

See your list is mostly bigs...pretty good list..I would pick the mail man over the Dream though..Malone just went thru some good MJ teams...I would also put the glove over rick berry and Scottie Pippen.

[tkb]

In my opinion he's 7th. My list is as follows:

1. Michael Jordan
2. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
3. Wilt Chamberlain
4. Magic Johnson
5. Larry Bird
6. Bill Russell
7. Kobe Bryant
8. Tim Duncan
9. Shaquille O'Neal
10. Hakeem Olajuwon

[dub81]

In my opinion he's 7th. My list is as follows:

1. Michael Jordan
2. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
3. Wilt Chamberlain
4. Magic Johnson
5. Larry Bird
6. Bill Russell
7. Kobe Bryant
8. Tim Duncan
9. Shaquille O'Neal
10. Hakeem Olajuwon

Like the list....I just can't take Kobe over a dominant big man..Other than Jordan no SG ever won rings without somebody down low abusing folks...A.I had a great year in 00 when he took that awful team to the finals..

[chefy]

In my opinion he's 7th. My list is as follows:

1. Michael Jordan
2. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
3. Wilt Chamberlain
4. Magic Johnson
5. Larry Bird
6. Bill Russell
7. Kobe Bryant
8. Tim Duncan
9. Shaquille O'Neal
10. Hakeem Olajuwon

yea I'll probably go with this list too

[spree2kawhi]

In my opinion he's 7th. My list is as follows:

1. Michael Jordan
2. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
3. Wilt Chamberlain
4. Magic Johnson
5. Larry Bird
6. Bill Russell
7. Kobe Bryant
8. Tim Duncan
9. Shaquille O'Neal
10. Hakeem Olajuwon

Like the list....I just can't take Kobe over a dominant big man..Other than Jordan no SG ever won rings without somebody down low abusing folks...A.I had a great year in 00 when he took that awful team to the finals..

defensively this is absolutely not true. people always underrate jordan's supporting cast. hell, give me rodman for any team I would create on any freaking day. I would be cautious putting kobe over Wilt and Kareem because I'm always having a hard time gauging their impact in a modern basketball environment, but I'd certainly take Kobe over Magic and Bird. no doubt.