Arenas for Vince or dump Arenas for cap space?

[nate33]

The Rockets got Jordan Hill, about whom there were enough questions that he was at least not "untouchable."

The Rockets got the Knicks unprotected 2012 pick plus the right to a pick swap in 2011. Both of those picks look like lotto picks, perhaps high lotto picks. It may prove to be the most lopsided trade in NBA history.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

Egads. I understood your logic on Cousins but signing Boozer to a max deal is pure madness. Most overrated player in the league. Bad defense and a bad attitude.

Boozer's a career 20/12.5/3 ast guy in the playoffs. Very strong rebounder and low post scorer. My logic on Boozer is that he's #5 in Win Score/40 in the NBA and #6 in Efficiency/40.

http://www.nba.com/playerfile/carlos_bo ... stats.html
http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Carlos-Boozer-1734/

I think Boozer's bad defense occurred moreso in the past season because he had to play a lot of C for the Jazz with Okur injured. No way he can defend Gasol, Odom, or Bynum--he's too short and stocky. Regardless of his defense, Boozer's part of why Deron Williams is so highly regarded offensively.

Cousins' attitude is overblown according to the guy who should know him best, John Calipari.


BNDC, my rationale is this: The way to win is to make shots. After that, a team that rebounds well wins. Have to go now, (actually better put some work in!), but here's a link that explains where I'm heading when time permits.
http://www.knickerblogger.net/?p=608

Stats would show that LAL wins because Gasol just cleans up next to Kobe. I think with a team with dominating interior play plus great perimeter shooting you can't help but be a 50-win team if you surround it with defensive role players.

[nate33]

Hey Wizboard mods. Can we change this thread title to "Should we dump Arenas for cap space?"

Anyhoo,

When defending Arenas on the General Board and Trade Board, I occasionally run into an issue that's difficult to gloss over. Arenas posted some fine numbers last season, but we still sucked as a team. And we didn't drop off any further when Arenas was suspended. Even during the 17 game stretch when Arenas posted 25/8/5 and Jamison was healthy, our record was 6-11.

Is it wise to jump to the conclusion that we'll get the Arenas of old (or something close to it) this season? Arenas' numbers were nice last year, but his on/off differential was mediocre (+2.0) and the team couldn't win.

[BanndNDC]

[ The way to win is to make shots. After that, a team that rebounds well wins.

sounds like one Antawn Jamison to me.

Boozer's defense has been crap for years. He is an absolutely horrendous and selfish team defender. His attitude, basically the character traits he showed in the whole cle/utak ordeal, is not something id want around our youngsters (especially someone like blatche). He will never be a winner and is way too me first for a let's start over team.

im assuming you are like the rest of us and thought jamison was overpaid. boozer is very similar as a player to jamison, solid rebounder and offensive game combined with a horrible defensive game. the idea of paying boozer even more (without the upstanding community citizen part) seems quite odd to me.

overpaying for an aging me first player with no defense would have been a terrible way to start the leonsis era. i agree with you on the need and importance of rebounding (and desperately wanted to move up to draft patterson) but boozer was not the way to solve that problem any more than AJ was.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

[ The way to win is to make shots. After that, a team that rebounds well wins.

sounds like one Antawn Jamison to me.

Boozer's defense has been crap for years. He is an absolutely horrendous and selfish team defender. His attitude, basically the character traits he showed in the whole cle/utak ordeal, is not something id want around our youngsters (especially someone like blatche). He will never be a winner and is way too me first for a let's start over team.

im assuming you are like the rest of us and thought jamison was overpaid. boozer is very similar as a player to jamison, solid rebounder and offensive game combined with a horrible defensive game. the idea of paying boozer even more (without the upstanding community citizen part) seems quite odd to me.

overpaying for an aging me first player with no defense would have been a terrible way to start the leonsis era. i agree with you on the need and importance of rebounding (and desperately wanted to move up to draft patterson) but boozer was not the way to solve that problem any more than AJ was.

Antawn Per-36 min, career: 19.4 pts, 7.9 rebs, 1.7 asts, .456 FG%, ..526TS%
Jamison career PER: 18.6
http://www.basketball-reference.com/pla ... san01.html

Carlos Per-36 min, career: 19.0 pts, 11.2 rebs, 2.5 asts, .541 FG%, .577 TS%
Boozer career PER: 20.8
http://www.basketball-reference.com/pla ... eca01.html

Boozer's a tremendous rebounder. Much, much better than Jamison, who's merely better-than average on the boards.

He's a lot more efficient scoring on the low block. Jamison's got more range, but that's the only way he's better than Boozer. Overall, Carlos is a considerably better player. At 29, I'd hardly say Boozer's aging to the point he'll be in decline any of the next 3 years, either.

Boozer's a better player by far than Antawn. He's probably NOT a max player, but I would have gone that route with him and Cousins because I don't think anybody could stop them inside in the playoffs.

[Silvie Lysandra]

Hey Wizboard mods. Can we change this thread title to "Should we dump Arenas for cap space?"

Anyhoo,

When defending Arenas on the General Board and Trade Board, I occasionally run into an issue that's difficult to gloss over. Arenas posted some fine numbers last season, but we still sucked as a team. And we didn't drop off any further when Arenas was suspended. Even during the 17 game stretch when Arenas posted 25/8/5 and Jamison was healthy, our record was 6-11.

Is it wise to jump to the conclusion that we'll get the Arenas of old (or something close to it) this season? Arenas' numbers were nice last year, but his on/off differential was mediocre (+2.0) and the team couldn't win.

Well, the on/off differential is to be expected - even with good numbers, Arenas simply wasn't himself.

Doesn't help as well that Arenas was often playing with worse players (Jamison > Blatche, Stevenson > Young, Butler > Miller)

Imo Jamison and Butler were far greater factors in our lack of success than Arenas.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

Imo Jamison and Butler were far greater factors in our lack of success than Arenas.

+1

Just hope the rumored ACL tear isn't true.

[leswizards]

Doesn't help as well that Arenas was often playing with worse players (Jamison > Blatche, Stevenson > Young, Butler > Miller)

Per your comments, I assume you mean (Jamison < Blatche, Stevenson < Young, Butler < Miller). If that is what you meant, while you won't get in any argument from me in regards to Stevenson and Young, the problem with your arguement is that in regards to on off numbers Butler>Jamison>Arenas>Miller>Blatche.

[leswizards]

If the ACL rumor is true, and the injury was sustained playing pick up basketball or in some other non authorized workout, can the Wizards void his contract?

[Hoopalotta]

If the ACL rumor is true, and the injury was sustained playing pick up basketball or in some other non authorized workout, can the Wizards void his contract?

[LyricalRico]

Somebody said in another thread that Arenas for Vince might be back on. But what if the package coming from Orlando included players other than Carter? Gil for Gortat+Bass+Pietrus? That could make sense for the Magic based on their other signings.

Howard/Orton
Lewis/Anderson
Carter/QRich
Arenas/Redick
Nelson/Duhon

That starting lineup is undersized everywhere except center but they'd be as explosive as it gets.

From the Wiz perspective, I like Gortat and Pietrus but I'd like to get a third team involved to take Bass. Maybe New Jersey? They still need a PF with some experience to share time with Favors. We'd be looking at having solid young players at every position.

Gortat/McGee
Blatche/Yi/Booker
Pietrus/Thornton
Young/Hinrich
Wall/Hinrich

[FreeBalling]

If the ACL rumor is true, and the injury was sustained playing pick up basketball or in some other non authorized workout, can the Wizards void his contract?

Hummmmm............

Lets see, hummm...... He brought three guns to work threatened to shoot an employee and he's not a cop and he still has a job. Hummmmmm.......

[AnotherFinn]

I don't think Orton is going to get playing time this year, he was pretty bad in summer league. They need someone that can actually play 5 in coming season.

[AceDegenerate]

[leswizards]

If the ACL rumor is true, and the injury was sustained playing pick up basketball or in some other non authorized workout, can the Wizards void his contract?

Hummmmm............

Lets see, hummm...... He brought three guns to work threatened to shoot an employee and he's not a cop and he still has a job. Hummmmmm.......

First, this is the first that I have heard that he threatened to shoot an employee. I thought it was Javaris that threatened to shoot Gil, and Gil threatend to blow up his car.

Second, my initial comment was made out of frustration stemming from the fact that GIl has only played in 47 games the past three seasons because he refused to rehab his knee properly, and he didn't have the good sense to know when to stop hazing Javaris and when to mock his behavior and David Stern coupled with the fact that the false rumor led me to believe that Gil might miss a substanial portion of this season.

Third, I believe there actually is precedence for professional athletes having their contracts voided because they were injured in activites that were forbidden by their contract (Ron Gant and Jason Williams I believe, and I believe Jeff Kent might have lied about how he sustained a wrist injury in order to protect his contract).

[Wizardspride]

If the ACL rumor is true, and the injury was sustained playing pick up basketball or in some other non authorized workout, can the Wizards void his contract?

Hummmmm............

Lets see, hummm...... He brought three guns to work threatened to shoot an employee and he's not a cop and he still has a job. Hummmmmm.......

First, this is the first that I have heard that he threatened to shoot an employee.

As far as I know, Gil never threatened to shoot an employee.

[LyricalRico]

^ What would you call Crittenton? He and Gil were employees of the same company.

[Wizardspride]

^ What would you call Crittenton? He and Gil were employees of the same company.

Gotcha.

[LA_All Day]

Crazy to me how soo many Wizards fan's are sleeping on Gilbert Arenas this year...I expect Gilbert to play with a chip on his shoulder all season and have a huge year, wether that be in D.C, or on any other team for that matter..Especially if he goes back to what I think is his natural position, the 2. Surprised not too many people on this board feel the same way.

[Benjammin]

Crazy to me how soo many Wizards fan's are sleeping on Gilbert Arenas this year...I expect Gilbert to play with a chip on his shoulder all season and have a huge year, wether that be in D.C, or on any other team for that matter..Especially if he goes back to what I think is his natural position, the 2. Surprised not too many people on this board feel the same way.

Actually, a lot do.