We need a real PF

[DirtyDez]

Here you go Fo-Real..... check this out.

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=25mh596

How do we give up 14m and bring back 6m when all teams are over the cap? Not quite sure the trade checker has got this one right.

We're not over the cap so it doesn't apply to us. Orlando/Philly are but their salaries matchup... Either that or Frank hacked the system.

[KJ7]

Here you go Fo-Real..... check this out.

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=25mh596

How do we give up 14m and bring back 6m when all teams are over the cap? Not quite sure the trade checker has got this one right.

We're not over the cap so it doesn't apply to us. Orlando/Philly are but their salaries matchup... Either that or Frank hacked the system.

http://hoopshype.com/salaries/phoenix.htm

With Frye and JChill's contract we def are over the cap. Unless they just haven't been added in the BSPN website as well.

Strangely enough their trade checker acknowledges we are over the cap LOL.

[DirtyDez]

I mean the result of that trade puts us under the cap...

[SideSwipe]

Wilcox/ Summers and #2 for a TPE

Here is something doable, not earth-shattering, but maybe easier to swallow than several other ideas out there. A DET fan posted a Wilcox/ Summers and #2 for a TPE. I think at one point we had gone after Wilcox and I've always thought that he could be great in PHX. He is a power player, and a decent post scorer who might blow-up when given the chance. He is in a contract year and expiring. Summers is yet another tweener 3/4 who can shoot the 3 decently well, and is pretty athletic but overall a little clueless. The #2 as we learned in this years draft could be invaluable as well. Thoughts?

He has always had a great FG%, but never a great PG to play with. He could be a monster and he is on a good contraft, and the commitment is only 1 year.

[Frank Lee]

has Etan Thomas signed anywhere?

[SideSwipe]

Haven't heard of him signing. He is really more of a 5 than a 4 though. More defensive utility than post scorer. Not sure how his health has been either.

Any thoughts on Wilcox Frank. Low cost/ decent chance of good performance.

[lespaul89]

Haven't heard of him signing. He is really more of a 5 than a 4 though. More defensive utility than post scorer. Not sure how his health has been either.

Any thoughts on Wilcox Frank. Low cost/ decent chance of good performance.

Wilcox is an Amare-lite in the head. He isn't a winning basketball player.

[SideSwipe]

I'm not talking about him as our franchise guy Les, I'm talking about using $3million (yes he only makes $3 million) of our TPE to use him as a stop gap. He has great FG% and is a better rebounder per 36 than Amare, and has a game taylor-made to go along with Nash. Also he is an expiring. It almost seems like a no-brainer for me. He will score, and rebound better than Warrick. He hits it in the post, plays with power, and is a strong inside presence. A banger who can finish. It would be nice to have an option that would be Amare-light is they are pushing out against our shooters.

Jason Richardson wasn't a winning type of player before he got here. Dudley either. It takes the right situation, and for a 1 year rental where we give up no assets, other than maybe the rights to Dwayne Collins, it would seem a decent deal to make.

Nash/ Dragic/ Reynolds
Richardson/ Childress
Turk/ Hill/ Duds
Wilcox/ Warrick/ Lawal/ Clark
Lopez/ Frye

[ma_falaa_50]

I think the suns need to have some patience with the roster. Although im worried about hedo being our PF but Frank raised a good point, I think the suns will be doing a lot of zone.

[SideSwipe]

I don't worry about them on defense as much...odd I know. The idea is probably to run Robin in the pickl and Roll with Nash and then give Robin 4 three point shooters in the post if the defense doubles down. on him. He is a 7-footer, so he shouldn't have trouble getting vision out to the three point line. It would be nice to have an offensive banger and finisher to go to as a backup. Lawal is not ready, Warrick is not really polished enough. The risk seems so low (of course it is not my $3 mil) and if DET is willing to give him up for TPE space, then I am having a hard-time looking the other way.

[lespaul89]

I'm not talking about him as our franchise guy Les, I'm talking about using $3million (yes he only makes $3 million) of our TPE to use him as a stop gap. He has great FG% and is a better rebounder per 36 than Amare, and has a game taylor-made to go along with Nash. Also he is an expiring. It almost seems like a no-brainer for me. He will score, and rebound better than Warrick. He hits it in the post, plays with power, and is a strong inside presence. A banger who can finish. It would be nice to have an option that would be Amare-light is they are pushing out against our shooters.

Jason Richardson wasn't a winning type of player before he got here. Dudley either. It takes the right situation, and for a 1 year rental where we give up no assets, other than maybe the rights to Dwayne Collins, it would seem a decent deal to make.

Nash/ Dragic/ Reynolds
Richardson/ Childress
Turk/ Hill/ Duds
Wilcox/ Warrick/ Lawal/ Clark
Lopez/ Frye

I would rather give Lawl minutes than Wilcox. And what I mean by winning type of player is having a winning mentality. Just because Richardson and Dudley weren't on winning teams, doesn't mean they didn't have a winning mentality. Chris Wilcox has a bad attitude and it has kept him from meeting the expectations of a top ten pick.

Again, one of our biggest strengths last year was chemistry. I don't think it would be smart to risk that by signing a "stop gap" that probably isn't even as good as Warrick.

And I wouldn't call him a banger. Maybe always banged up, but not a banger. He is the type of player that sits out with really tiny injuries. And he is a joke of an inside presence on the defense of end. Easier to score on than AMare.

[SideSwipe]

He is only $3million, less cost than Warrick. Les, if you had seen Summer League you would know Lawal, while looking good, is not ready to be consistent unless he does significantly more upgrading to his game over the summer.

Richardson would never have been said to have a winning attitude prior to coming here, great talent yes, but not a winning attitude. When you are the #1 or #2 option but have never taken your team anywhere is prior years, then that would certainly be in question. What you are referring to is competitiveness, and that is where the "winning attitude" comes from. Wilcox has never one before, and may not be super-competitive, but he can bang down low on the offensive end, and I don't think his defense is workse than Amare's from a man on man perpective.

[Wormwood74]

Wilcox suffers from being every bit as bad a defender as Warrick, while posting offensive numbers that are lowly sinking to the abyss. He's a better rebounder, but his basketball IQ is abysmal. Not what we need, especially when we rely on a zone defense.

[SideSwipe]

Does anyone know of Youtube coverage of Lawal in Summer League. From everything I have seen he looks talented from an energy standpoint, but very rough from an offensive standpoint, but I'd like to see more highlights if anyone else knows of any out there. I am looking for more than just the regular NBA highlights, if anyone knows if that exists.

[Frank Lee]

Well.... I dont think Wilcox is the answer...either

But first, What is the question ?

1. Do we try to acquire a Starting PF ?
2. Are we looking for a PF/C ?
3. Do we want a Veteran on a 1 - 2 yr deal ?
4. If a promising youngster is available, do we take him ?
5. Do we stand pat till Dec. ?
6. Are we trading JRich (may be the biggest Q and should be tied to #1)

I think this could be a very good opportunity to acquire a youngster and see if Nash and Gentry can polish another turd (ie Frye). I would hope, due to the size of the West, we'd look for a pf/c that would fit in with the second unit, and hopefully add to this core we are building. Frye can always start at PF. If it becomes an apparent weakness, we deal in Dec.

Youngsters :

#1 in my book is Anthony Tolliver... may be a bit undersized for C, but he has the skill set that just reeks of Phnx.

Patrick O'Bryant is another underachieving Big. Plus he's Irish

Is Robert Smith done ? He was quietly producing before injury took him out... and then became disappearing ink.

Randolph Morris has been lost in his own shuffle since dealing to get out of Kentucky.

Primoz Brezac ? another Slovenian ? I'd look hard at him if Dragic gives the thumbz upsk.

Did Utah re-ink Fesenko ? I Fethinko they should.

Josh Boone ? Plays twice as hard because he's half as good.

I dont watch enough NBA to really have a feel for some of these guys... and some dont get much burn anyway. But, I'd say there is a 68.6% probability that DeanWormer has a dossier on over half of them.



To blab on....

I think we have an opportune situation to acquire a good, solid veteran as well. We can almost guarantee 15-20 minutes of playing time, within a system designed to accommodate a couple sets of old legs anyway. Nash, Gentry, Phnx, playing time.... all good reasons to come to the Valley. It aint South Beach, but you wont be spectator here. (F Queen James and his court)

I am sensing our PF acquisition delay is caused by having a couple of options... and possible JRich deals... yes I said deals to consider.


In Lon I trust.

[Wormwood74]

Frank,

Thanks for the vote of confidence. Here's my take on the PF situation:

The things we need out of a PF/C are (in my estimation of order of importance)

1. Defense, both on the pick and roll and in the post
tie: Defensive rebounding
3. Mid-range game (we can't have guys clogging the lane when Nash/Hedo are running the pick and roll, plus the mid-range game is part of the P&R as well if the opponent double the ball handler off the pick)
4. Finisher at the rim on the P&R
5. FT shooting. You have to be able to keep your starting PF in at the end of the game
6. Passing. Black holes are killers on a team like the Suns.

The folks you mentioned Frank aren't what we need: we need a starting quality PF. I like the idea of Frye playing back up C and back up PF, he's a change of pace at either position.

Our only movable assets are JRich, Dudley (looks like the odd man out with Hedo, Childress, Hill all fighting for SF minutes), Clark (definitely out of the rotation right now), and the 6.5 million we have left in TPE.

JRich let's us aim for max contract guys

Dudley and Clark let us look at trading for rookie scale players

The TPE lets us look at MLE type players

The most ideal player in all of this would be Marcus Camby, but he's off the table.

Troy Murphy would be a good choice, for his ecellent defensive rebounding, shooting range, good bball IQ, and his bulk in the post.

Lamar Odom would be an excellent fit as well, although he can be a little over-matched by very tall post players.

Kris Humphries is the super low cost alternative here. He's a ball hog, but he rebounds very well, has some decent offensive skills, but is a mediocre defender at best. Still, he's likely our best bet if we look to sign a vet min guy.

Marcin Gortat would be a good choice if we wanted to move Frye to the starting 4 position, and have Gortat and Lopez tag team for 48 minutes per game. He might be available for the TPE.

DeAndre Jordan would be interesting in the same capacity as Gortat.

KT would be a vet min addition worth looking at, but certainly not as a starter. Back up C, perhaps, so Frye can slide to starting 4?

Serge Ibaka for Dudley and rights to Collison (the 60th pick)? You'd have to give it serious consideration. He has a very nice mid-range game, and is developing into a very solid rebounder and defender.

[SideSwipe]

Worm,
I definitely don't see Dudley being moved yet. I like your list of targets, and they are all ones I have explored with the exception of Humphries and Jordan. Humphries is probably obtainable, but I don't think Jordan is with just clark and a TPE available in exchange.

Gortat would be a great candidate to plug in, as I think he could actually play the 4 pretty effectively for us. I would start Gortat and keep Frye where he is. Also, I believe we only ended up with a $5.7 million TPE left over from our Amare, which would make his contract unobtainable via TPE

Odom is unrealistic due to his affiliation with the LAKERS.

Troy Murphy might be interesting, but due to his contract it would have to be for J-Rish, and I don't see a package from Indy that they are willing to give up that would make trading J-Rich acceptable.

I am interested to see what other players might be out there for just TPE, or maybe Clark for the right piece.

[lespaul89]

He is only $3million, less cost than Warrick. Les, if you had seen Summer League you would know Lawal, while looking good, is not ready to be consistent unless he does significantly more upgrading to his game over the summer.

Richardson would never have been said to have a winning attitude prior to coming here, great talent yes, but not a winning attitude. When you are the #1 or #2 option but have never taken your team anywhere is prior years, then that would certainly be in question. What you are referring to is competitiveness, and that is where the "winning attitude" comes from. Wilcox has never one before, and may not be super-competitive, but he can bang down low on the offensive end, and I don't think his defense is workse than Amare's from a man on man perpective.

I disagree. He showed he had a winning attitude when he killed the Mavs in 06-07. I think we are going to have to agree to disagree. I would rather take a wait and see approach, then sign Chris Wilcox.

[Wormwood74]

One name I left out was AK47. He makes sense at a couple of levels:

* Prefers playing PF
* Moves the ball well
* Terrific defender, although he can be overwhelmed in some post up situations
* When playing PF earlier in his career he posted defensive rebounding rates that were at least average for a PF (although still not good), but better than Warrick or Frye's.
* So-so hands, but he is a good finisher
* Has OK range as a shooter
* Would be absolutely phenomenal in a zone defense with his penchant for well timed weak side blocks.

[blackjays1]

Why would Dudley be out of the rotation? Childress and Warrick are more than capable of playing the 2 and 4 respectively, especially since they're backups. The only player we could move is Richardson, then have Hedo play the 2. Unless they move Hill, which ain't happening, thats the only move they could pull.

Anyways, i'd say the rotation is set for the season. Whoever we sign as a free agent, KT, Oberto, those guys would only be 13th man at best to start. So the rotation we have now is what we're going into the season with. Hedo and Warrick will play the 4 and we'll see how that works out.