Arenas for Vince or dump Arenas for cap space?

[LyricalRico]

Some people advocating an Arenas trade seem to see the impossibility of tanking just as you do, and look instead to using cap space to acquire additional picks through BOYD trades or to make space for FA acquisitions.

[Silvie Lysandra]

Well, the thing is that we will have max cap space in 2011 with only Nick Young to resign (and his price range won't be anything beyond 4m/yr with a new CBA looming, unless he sticks at SF), and we will have a lot more cap space in 2012 with Hinrich expiring, though we'll have to resign Blatche and Javale at this point. If we need to get rid of Arenas to resign them (and we shouldn't, even if there's a hard cap, unless they set said cap at the current cap level as opposed to the current tax threshold or close to it), then we have at least a year to go for it.

How does this relate to BOYD deals? Mostly that as we have plenty of space to work with as long as we don't hand out any bad contracts other than the ones we'd be presumably taking back. The problem is, of course is that will there be a market? This year was special in that everyone was gunning for free agency, and nobody still got anything higher than a 17th from a BOYD. Maybe in 2012 with Dwight and Paul up for grabs, but still, I'm not sure what teams are willing to give up,

As for FA, we can sign Melo next year if we can dump Hinrich, and Hinrich is the kind of player you can easily get to a contender for an expiring. Or, if the plan is to make our own Washington Superteam, we can *then* use a rejuvenated Arenas and a improving McGee in a package that gets us Melo, cap space, and prospects to send for Melo, allowing us to have a chance at a Howard/Blatche/Anthony frontcourt with John Wall running the show - one can dream I guess.

My point is that you don't need to dump Arenas to run BOYD or FA strategies unless the new CBA is too restrictive.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

Chaos, combining your great ideas and research, with something DCZards pointed out, the answer is simply keep Gil and try to acquire Carmelo.

Carmelo at SF with this bunch, a couple seasons from now, should be a real contender.

[Silvie Lysandra]

I don't see us signing Melo unless we can win a lot (46+) of games this year, with Gil looking like a near-superstar and Wall looking on his way.

But then, those things are redundant, aren't they?

Especially since I'm expecting a top 15 defensive team at worst (we were #18 with Jamison, Butler, and Boykins playing big minutes for 50 games).

[Wizardspride]

I think pretty much the entire local media - other than Mike Wise - has been very skeptical about Arenas playing with Wall - not that there are any geniuses among them.

The "entire local media"? Like who, those jerks on the Sports Reporters. Haven't heard much skepticism, otherwise.

Doc Walker thinks Gil is nuts (I'm paraphrasing) and needs professional help.

Then again, he and Coach Thompson also think that Butler was some kind of saint or something.

[kirubel94]

IDK if u guys are gonna buy to thin but TMAC says on his twitter, that gilbert willl be back better than ever
"@TheReal_TMAC Thanks for the update T-Mac. What's up with you? Best of luck choosing a team! How did Gilbert look btw? Thanks!

"@BBallWiz330 agent zero will be back better than ever!"

[AceDegenerate]

IDK if u guys are gonna buy to thin but TMAC says on his twitter, that gilbert willl be back better than ever
"@TheReal_TMAC Thanks for the update T-Mac. What's up with you? Best of luck choosing a team! How did Gilbert look btw? Thanks!

"@BBallWiz330 agent zero will be back better than ever!"

Agent Zero has plenty friends around the league, something to consider for those hoping to acquire other Star talents to compete with Miami Thrice.

[DCZards]

With Jamison and Butler gone, Gilbert can go back to doing what he does best: be a 30ppg scorer. No one will complain, and all he needs to do is allow Wall to set him up with easy dimes. The fact that Arenas can handle the ball to take the pressure off is a huge plus, as is the fact that they will be one of the fastest backcourts in the NBA - yet with two 6-4 players. Keep Arenas and let's try to win some damn games.

That's what I'm talking about!

[DCZards]

The player who can drop 60 Arenas is better than the player who got to the HOF but probably doesn't deserve to be there, Dumars. (Dennis Johnson, R.I.P., better player than Joe D and not in the hall. That is a travesty).

It ain't dumars vs. dj, ccj. both of them should be in the HOF, I'd argue.

[Ruzious]

I think pretty much the entire local media - other than Mike Wise - has been very skeptical about Arenas playing with Wall - not that there are any geniuses among them.

The "entire local media"? Like who, those jerks on the Sports Reporters. Haven't heard much skepticism, otherwise.

Pretty much everyone who I've heard talk about Arenas on the Fan and WTEM have been negative about Arenas. Doc's said the same thing. The only one we've heard be positive about him was Wise. When the media talks positively about the Wizards, it's almost always because they're talking about Wall and Leonsis; not Arenas. Some of the guys on WTEM say they are worried about the effects Arenas will have on Wall. They go a helluvalot more negative about him than anyone here does.

[Wizardspride]

I think pretty much the entire local media - other than Mike Wise - has been very skeptical about Arenas playing with Wall - not that there are any geniuses among them.

The "entire local media"? Like who, those jerks on the Sports Reporters. Haven't heard much skepticism, otherwise.

Pretty much everyone who I've heard talk about Arenas on the Fan and WTEM have been negative about Arenas. Doc's said the same thing. The only one we've heard be positive about him was Wise. When the media talks positively about the Wizards, it's almost always because they're talking about Wall and Leonsis; not Arenas.

FWIW, Lavar Arrington and David Aldridge are pro Gil as well.

But you're correct in that for the most part, its been fairly negative.

I also get the impression that many of Gil's biggest critics (Andy Pollin, Steve Czaban etc.) haven't actually seen many games.

[no D in Hibachi]

FWIW, Lavar Arrington and David Aldridge are pro Gil as well.

FWIW, Lavar Arrington is an idiot so everything he says must be taken with a grain of salt. David Aldridge, on the other hand, is the best non-biased basketball reporter on the planet. I highly value his opinion. His knowledge of the game is second to none, well, except Bill Simmons, but he's very biased.

[Benjammin]

Since I moved to Richmond I have not missed listening to the inane ramblings of Andy Pollin and Steve Czaban. John Thompson isn't much better when it comes to the Wizards either.

[montestewart]

A lot of (maybe most) sportswriters seem to me to try and get in front of public opinion, thus appearing to be more opinion makers than followers. But public opinion can be fickle, with extreme reactions and dramatic swings in the opposite direction in not too long a time. For sportswriters to unabashedly show the same fickleness looks indecisive, very unbecoming of a manly, decisive, tell-it-like-it-is sportswriter. Most sportswriters that dramatically change their positions won't readily admit that they did so, if they even recall their former opinions.

That's a long way of saying that sportswriters are generally prisoners of 1) their audience's opinions, and 2) their inability to openly change their opinions. I don't really care what most sportswriters say about Arenas, but I might have a little more respect for some, like Aldridge, who seem more measured in their judgments, whether I agree with them or not.

[hands11]

To me, the Wizards are "rebuilding", but if they are good enough to make the playoffs next year, they are going to try to continue to make the playoffs every year. For them to make the playoffs does everything from getting young players a taste of winning, to increasing team revenue, and to becoming a more attractive destination for free agents.

I really think too many people are assuming the Wiz are going to win 30 games next year and continue building through the draft. Yes, it's possible. But it's also possible they win 42 games, and at that point your draft position isn't as important.

A true rebuilding team would be going into the season with no Gilbert. But, it looks like we are going into the season with Gilbert on the roster. That makes things a little bit more unpredictable than some would iike to admit. The Wiz have a shot at being more competitive than what you would want from a rebuilding team.

"Build up his trade value and trade him for an expiring", really? How is that going to work if Gil is putting up 25/5/5 and the team is headed for the playoffs? Do you think thats going to be so easy for the fan base to digest if they re-accept Gilbert, watch him help lead us to the playoffs, and than dump him for the sake of the rebuilding proccess?

"But it's John Wall's team, he's the superstar, the main event, the frachise player." Sure, probably, but we don't know for sure yet. How do we know that Wall is going to be better than Gilbert in the next few years? What if Wall really is Rondo? Is Rondo a number one option on a playoff team? A healthy Gilbert Arenas can be a little bit better than some people here think.

But, these are the questions that will only be answered by the season itself. What we know is that barring a good reasonable offer, Gilbert will be on the roster come training camp. He can really dictate his own destiny based on how he plays. I believe the team really will be hesitant to trade him if he's an All-Star again.

Exactly... New flash to those that have gotten to caught up in things.

Lets be clear on what we mean when we say this is Walls team. All that means is Wall is the "projected" least trade-able asset on the team over the next four years and he will be "A" leader on the court. Specially as the PG handling the ball the most.

He is not the only concern. He is not the owner. Ted is. Flip is the head coach. We have leaders in the front office and we have leaders on the court. John is projected to be the main leader on the court based on expectation and the fact he will have the ball in hand a lot. That doesn't mean he will be the only leader and it doesn't mean he will be the only star.

Ted, EG, Flip and Sam are leaders off the court.
Kirk will be a leader on the court. So will, I sure hope, Dray... This goes along with Wall.
Gil is going to be a star and I expect will have ball in hand some also.

Lets not fall into the same trap we did with Gil. Its going to take a TEAM to win deeper in the playoffs. It's going to take several leaders and several stars. One if the things a really like about about Wall is that he appears to get this. He want to build up the team concept. He wants to make his teammates better.

Wall, Gil and Dray are three really nice pieces. We are one star away, and it's a big missing piece if you want to win it all, and that is a stud SF. I think we can find a defensive center if we dont already have one.

[Zonkerbl]

None of the sportswriters in this area have seen anything new from Arenas since he was suspended and disappeared from the public eye. Their opinions are stuck with the information they have, and they're not really in a position to change their opinion until they actually watch him and Wall play together.

You've got to see how it plays out. Can Leonsis get through to Gil, so Gil doesn't come back all sullen and angry and not willing to listen to anybody? Can Wall and Gil guard anybody? How's Gil's knee? If I'm a local media guy trying to make money, which answer is going to get me better ratings - the boring answer of "gosh I don't know, I guess we'll have to wait until next season and see what happens" or ranting and raving that the sky is going to fall with Wall and Gil playing together?

I still think there's a good chance Wall punches Gil's lights out sometime next season. We'll have to see what happens.

[DCZards]

I also get the impression that many of Gil's biggest critics (Andy Pollin, Steve Czaban etc.) haven't actually seen many games.

Your impression would be correct. You could put what they know about the NBA and the wizards on a small post it. That's why I make it a point to ignore most of the local media. Hey, but those same broadcasters are awfully good at covering the Redskins.

[DCZards]

None of the sportswriters in this area have seen anything new from Arenas since he was suspended and disappeared from the public eye. Their opinions are stuck with the information they have, and they're not really in a position to change their opinion until they actually watch him and Wall play together.

None of us have heard or seen GA much lately. He's been awfully quiet. The boy is getting ready to ball this season. I'm telling ya!

[JonathanJoseph]

Chaos,

50-some pages of reasonably intelligent back-and-forth and your post finally seems to have driven the point home. Again, both well researched and well reasoned, you made the point where others were unable.

But then you lost me on Carmelo Anthony! Ironically, one of the central, but ridiculously false reasons that the general public favors trading Arenas is that "Arenas needs the ball in his hands to be effective". This is one of the dumbest things I've ever heard.

Yes, it would go without saying that a "scorer" needs the ball in his hands to score. What? Is Arenas only suited for 2-against-5 games?

Arenas is one of the best scorers in the NBA. You know what fits perfectly next to a lethal scorer? An unselfish pass first PG with elite court vision. Even if Arenas never gets physically back beyond where he was last season, Wall will make Arenas an elite player again this season. Arenas the creator was a bad experiment, but Arenas as a finisher? Who is the best PG Arenas has played with in Washington? Antonio Daniels? Wall might be the best thing that ever happened to Arenas.

Back to Carmelo....Carmelo is also, at his core, a scorer. Maybe the best scorer in the NBA right now. That actually would be a redundant combination in my mind. Sure they could play effectively together, but only one player can take over the offense in the 4th quarter, and both of those guys need to be that guy to be at their best.

Personally? I'm not sure there will be another "Super Star" caliber player added to the Wall/Arenas/Blatche/McGee core. Blatche and McGee have very, very, very high ceilings and both have flashed the potential that they might get there sooner rather than later. If Wall/Arenas is as good as I think it will be, and Blatche/McGee both take that next step, we won't need a Super Star.

Shane Battier anyone? If the Wiz win 42-45 (as I expect) they'll be a team on the quick rise with plenty of firepower. How about a veteran winner, defender who can shoot the 3 (awfully important with Wall) to defend Lebron in the playoffs? He'll be a UFA, we can probably have him for the cap room we get back from renouncing Al Thornton and Yi alone and still have plenty of cap room left over.

I honestly believe that Wall/Arenas/Battier/Blatche/McGee (Seraphin/Booker/Hinrich/ FA Big) is a contender in the EC in 2011-2012.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

The player who can drop 60 Arenas is better than the player who got to the HOF but probably doesn't deserve to be there, Dumars. (Dennis Johnson, R.I.P., better player than Joe D and not in the hall. That is a travesty).

It ain't dumars vs. dj, ccj. both of them should be in the HOF, I'd argue.

Both should be--I have no problem with that.