SoTD: Bargnani's defensive numbers over 4 years

Truthrising · Post #81 » by **Truthrising** » Fri Aug 20, 2010 8:22 pm

TMMC wrote:
andreafan wrote:Andrea with a tidy 30 13 and 3 blocks against latvia. Take that haters .

Didn't you know blocks mean nothing, atleast that is what we are led to believe around these parts simply because Bargnani has shown he isn't to shabby at gettin a few swats a game... So we now call them fake blocks to go along with his fake points, rebounds and assists...

What do you expect for a 7 footer....meh nothing special. :-?

andreafan · Post #82 » by **andreafan** » Fri Aug 20, 2010 8:22 pm

This thread sure had bad timing given andreas domination of latvia. :lol:

ZefSyde · Post #83 » by **ZefSyde** » Fri Aug 20, 2010 8:24 pm

Reignman wrote:
ZefSyde wrote:
Reg00 wrote:
Riiiight. Carry on Stat-heads, carry on.

My brain hurts from trying to comprehend this stupid ass thread.

Numbers aren't for everyone.

They trained monkeys to do math. Birds and elephants too. I guess any bird brain can pick up some numbers and come to a ridiculous conclusion.

Post #84 » by **Undefeated** » Fri Aug 20, 2010 8:27 pm

Reignman wrote:Can someone explain the PDSS DRat to me? Never heard of it before.

http://www.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/showthread.php?1974-Project-Defensive-Stat-Scoresheet

J-Roc · Post #85 » by **J-Roc** » Fri Aug 20, 2010 8:27 pm

Shouldn't we always just look at net ORtg and DRtg. Why do you guys always split those stats apart, and then now split it again to on court and off court?

The_Hater · Post #86 » by **The_Hater** » Fri Aug 20, 2010 8:44 pm

ZefSyde wrote:
Reignman wrote:
ZefSyde wrote:
Numbers aren't for everyone.

They trained monkeys to do math. Birds and elephants too. I guess any bird brain can pick up some numbers and come to a ridiculous conclusion.

\

So you're actually stating that it's ridiculous to conclude that Bargnani is a poor defensive player?

I'd love to hear your viewpoint on this situation. Please enlighten me.

ZefSyde · Post #87 » by **ZefSyde** » Fri Aug 20, 2010 8:50 pm

He got worse every year right.

JN · Post #88 » by JN » Fri Aug 20, 2010 8:50 pm

A 2 point difference in defensive rating is very significant over the course of 82 games. The team improves by at least 2 points, and in some cases much more than that, for FOUR consecutive years. One year is a fluke, this is not. For significant differences to exist for four consecutive years, can only lead to one conclusion. He is likely one of the worst defenders in the entire league. One only needs to use their eyes and watch a game to then verify that.

Instead of looking at the trend of differences, the excuse makers either try to deflect from the obvious way of looking at the stats or say stats suck. Idiotic. The stat isn't trying to show he got worse every year (that is team dependent) -- it is meant to show the team is significantly worse for several years in a row with him on the floor.

Reignman · Post #89 » by **Reignman** » Fri Aug 20, 2010 8:50 pm

ZefSyde wrote:
Reignman wrote:
ZefSyde wrote:My brain hurts from trying to comprehend this stupid ass thread.

Numbers aren't for everyone.

They trained monkeys to do math. Birds and elephants too. I guess any bird brain can pick up some numbers and come to a ridiculous conclusion.

So you think Bargs is a good defender?

Reignman · Post #90 » by **Reignman** » Fri Aug 20, 2010 8:52 pm

andreafan wrote:This thread sure had bad timing given andreas domination of latvia.

Good game for Bargs. Too bad he doesn't play like this in the NBA. If he did these threads wouldn't exist.

BTW, CV once scored 48 pts in a game, beast!

The_Hater · Post #91 » by **The_Hater** » Fri Aug 20, 2010 8:54 pm

ZefSyde wrote:He got worse every year right.

That's not what the stats are saying. And several people in this thread have already answered why one might falsely conclude this, you just have to read their explanations.

Scott Carefoot · Post #92 » by **Scott Carefoot** » Fri Aug 20, 2010 8:55 pm

andreafan wrote:Scott i believe calderon was on the court during those minutes also , hint hint

Calderon is also an awful defender, nobody disputes that. The only players on last year's Raptors who could be considered above-average defenders and played over 1,000 minutes were Amir Johnson and Antoine Wright. When you have so many poor defenders and when your worst defenders play C and PG, that's a surefire recipe for having one of the worst team defences in the NBA.

Reignman · Post #93 » by **Reignman** » Fri Aug 20, 2010 8:55 pm

Undefeated wrote:
Reignman wrote:Can someone explain the PDSS DRat to me? Never heard of it before.

http://www.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/showthread.php?1974-Project-Defensive-Stat-Scoresheet

Thanks, I'm going to check it out once I get home.

Reignman · Post #94 » by **Reignman** » Fri Aug 20, 2010 8:57 pm

The_Hater wrote:
ZefSyde wrote:He got worse every year right.

That's not what the stats are saying. And several people in this thread have already answered why one might falsely conclude this, you just have to read their explanations.

Like numbers, reading isn't for everyone.

ZefSyde · Post #95 » by **ZefSyde** » Fri Aug 20, 2010 8:58 pm

That's irrelevant. This stat geek and his posse of sheep are trying to tell me bargs got worse every year he has been in the league.

RapsFanInVA · Post #96 » by **RapsFanInVA** » Fri Aug 20, 2010 8:58 pm

Why are people having such a hard time understanding these stats?

As Bargs has been given more minutes and a starting role with no accountability for poor defense by Triano, the team's overall defense has been worse with him on the court.

strangespot · Post #97 » by **strangespot** » Fri Aug 20, 2010 9:03 pm

RapsFanInVA wrote:Why are people having such a hard time understanding these stats?

As Bargs has been given more minutes and a starting role with no accountability for poor defense by Triano, the team's overall defense has been worse with him on the court.

maybe because:

evenflow wrote:
I don't think anyone is arguing the stats, its more the BS extrapolation that they have a problem with.

His PDSS DRat is 110.0 The same as Bosh and .5 worst than Amir. Calderon sits at around 118. So there you go big shot, put that in your pipe and smoke it

Here is the link: http://www.mediafire.com/?k7hbzunay6uzt4n

One factor that gets over looked from last year is how horrible the team was at defending the 3 point line.

4th worst in Opp. 3 pt attempts - 20.3
3rd worst in Opp. 3 pt made - 7.4
4tth worst in Opp. 3 pt % - 36.6%

How come no one bleats about this?

OvertimeNO · Post #98 » by **OvertimeNO** » Fri Aug 20, 2010 9:03 pm

Hay guize, I can has numbers too!

From 82games.com:

09-10 Raptors Top 4 lineups Min | Off | Def | +/-

Jack-Weems-Wright-Bargnani-Bosh 71.2 | 1.19 | 0.91 | +31
Jack-Belinelli-Turkoglu-Bargnani-Bosh 42.2 | 1.37 | 1.17 | +26
Calderon-Weems-Wright-Johnson-Bosh 38.8 | 1.34 | 1.03 | +24
Calderon-Weems-Turkoglu-Johnson-Bargnani 72.3 | 1.19 | 1.10 | +20

09-10 Raptors Top 4 lineups Min | Off | Def | +/-

Jack-DeRozan-Turkoglu-Bargnani-Bosh 369.7 | 1.02 | 1.15 | -99
Jack-DeRozan-Turkoglu-Johnson-Bargnani 53.5 | 0.96 | 1.16 | -16
Jack-DeRozan-Turkoglu-Johnson-Bargnani 53.5 | 0.96 | 1.16 | -16
Jack-DeRozan-Wright-Bargnani-Bosh 62.5 | 1.12 | 1.19 | -10

I *could* say, well, context is everything, and there's more to these numbers than meets the eye. But that's no fun. Instead, I'll just say something like

HAY GUIZE COMPARE THE BEST 5 WITH THE WORST 5 AND SEE WHICH PLAYERS ARE IN THEM! DISCUSS!

gamer4Life · Post #99 » by **gamer4Life** » Fri Aug 20, 2010 9:03 pm

Bargs is an excellent defender. He will prove himself this coming season.

ZefSyde · Post #100 » by **ZefSyde** » Fri Aug 20, 2010 9:04 pm

Now people are trying to tell me these stats and this thread in general don't allude to bargs getting worse every year. Who can't read? Like you bargs haters say, no excuses. The numbers show what they show and you can attempt to justify them but in the end you just look like pathetic kids grasping at straws.