[Build A Team 4.0] Discussion Thread Part 3 - I LOVE MY TEAM

[bishnykfan]

No problem, I don't like Ron nearly enough to move Smith for him. Honestly due to contract, age, and attitude I wasn't sure I would move Landry for him. But like I said, if you see something that you would give for Landry let me know, but I can't trade my 26 year old $3M a year starting PF who scored 17ppg last year for bench players. I think that we really don't match up well in this kind of trade, but I am always open to offers for anyone.

[Im Coming Home]

Wizards are looking for a scorer type, ala Andre Iguodala/Kevin Martin(I have already tried trading for both players). If anyone has these KIND of players, and sees something on my roster you like. Shoot me an offer at GallosOurFuture@aim.com

[Mecca]

Ny wonder why Q2N8's team isn't terrible like the last 4 teams... he has like 5 assistants. 5 LOL

[NBA Fan 1234]

Ny wonder why Q2N8's team isn't terrible like the last 4 teams... he has like 5 assistants. 5 LOL

No idea he had 5...no matter, I'm still the best out of all of them lol. If anyone who doesn't have an assistant gm/person to help with drafting/trades I can help if you want.

[NewEra]

In less than 13 minutes, I am making my pick!

We need more guys like you in this.

[I am Ra]

LeBronn2NY2010 I sent you a proposal.

[NewEra]

@Ra- What does your team look like now? I can't access the spreadsheet from work

[ctorres]

In less than 13 minutes, I am making my pick!

We need more guys like you in this.

Thanks guy! I'm so stoked I just drafted Rick Carlisle to be my coach. He's only 51 and he's already had a stellar coaching career.

[moocow007]

I'm going to still refrain from talking about any of the other top 5 teams in detail, but as far as the Heat goes? "not giving him any reason to stay"? Are you kidding me? Stop the nonsense, he's on the DEEPEST team in terms of talent in this league (HINT: there are NO 3 Queens in BAT). The core of the team are all in their prime. They have young talent, a flexible cap and while also being built to win now. If there is any team that ranks near the top in all 3 main categories that have been judged (win-now, future, cap) it's the Heat.

We're going to break your post down into parts. What is the reason for Carmelo staying in Miami? Harris is a shoot first point guard that is locked in for the next 3 years at 9 million. Did I forget to mention he is a shoot first point guard that can't shoot?

Did you forget to mention that he's an All-Star caliber PG? Did you forget to mention that he can get to the rack with the best of them? And did you forget that Derrick Rose is a shoot first point guard? So what does that say about any of the rest of those guys getting any shots on your team? Are you seriously, seriuosly, ripping another team for having a shoot first PG? Dude...if you google shoot first PG's, Derrick Rose's picture is the one you'll see before Devin Harris. So where's that "dynasty" of yours huh?

We already seen what Carmelo can do with a good point guard that can't stretch the floor. Remember Carmelo with Andre Miller?

You mean when Carmelo averaged 26.5ppg, 4.9rpg, 2.7apg while shooting 48% from the field in 2005-2006 and 28.9ppg, 6.0rpg, 3.8apg while shooting 48% from the field in 2006-2007? It's also known as his best 2 of the best 3 statistical seasons he's ever had.

Caron Butler is a nice piece to have on your team, especially with his 10 mil expiring, but is it really a good idea to pair Carmelo with a backcourt that can't stretch the floor for him? Hello double teams!

Wait...let me guess...cuz Caron ain't gots no 3pt% he can't stretch the floor right? Good lord with the simpleton way of thinking how 'floors are stretched'. You do know that he can postup, he can hit spot up jumpers (actually one of his best skills) and he actually can also faciliate an offense. Hint: There's a reason that he was considered one of the most versatile players in the NBA a couple years back...it ain't just for his scoring. Of course you didn't.

Next up, Lamarcus Aldridge...He is getting paid an incredible amount of money to not grab rebounds, not play defense, not score downlow, and just make midrange jumpers.

Hmm....seems like he averaged 8rpg last season...is that not good enough? And boy for a guy that just takes jumpers 49.5% from the field sure is terrific ain't it? And 1.8 bpg in the playoffs came from him just standing around doing nothing on defense right?

Is this the big man Carmelo want to be paired with for the next few seasons? I like Ibaka, no reason to criticize him. I'm just being truthful. You wrote a big essay, taking the little Melo comment to heart.

And that's why we have Ibaka for...defense...rebounding...etc? It's called building a team...not just grabbing stuff.

And those Melo comments are nonsense. They really are. You ask for other GM's opinions and when they pretty much unanimously say that you're team is not top 5, you gripe and bitch about why other teams that people consistently rank top 5 aren't top 5. If you are so freaking concerned about what other GM's think, then take what they say and try to improve your team instead of insulting other teams to try to get yourself up higher.

Do you do this in real life to get ahead?

And did you really just say the deepest team in the league? Did you look at your bench and really believe you have the deepest team in the league? Paul George? The same guy that nba analyst say shouldn't have been picked as early as he was? The same guy that wasn't that great in college? Marvin Williams? Isn't he a bust? I like Bayless, but congrats on grooming another shoot first point guard for Melo. He will learn well from Devin Harris. I almost forgot about Ian Manhimi. Haha. Really? At least you got the veteran presence of Big Ben.

Ahh...the nba analyst say argument. NBA analyst also say that Wesley Johnson is a mild mannered player that will never be able to maximize his talents. You know that right?

Marvin Williams is a bust and yet he's better than any of the guys on your bench. So what does that say about your bench? A bench of busters? To which...that's what you have. You have a GROSSLY OVERPAID Richard Jefferson looking like crap. You have Delonte West who is about two bulbs short and half a straw from flipping out, who's just been suspended by the NBA. A chucker in Reggie Williams. A lamp post in Joe Smith...I'll ask again...you do realize it's 2010-2011 right? Joe Smith is DONE FOR. There were a TON, A TON, of guys that would have made much better sense than Joe Smith left and you passed by them all. Good lordy. And then there's Marcin Gortat who you better hope can actually play a LOT cause with Oden there he'll finally get the wish he hasn't had in Orlando behind Dwight Howard.

But let's take a look at your team shall we?

PG: Derrick Rose/Delonte West
SG: MIckael Pietrus/Reggie Williams
SF: Wes Johnson/Richard Jefferson
PF: Zach Randolph/Joe Smith
C: Greg Oden/Marcin Gortat

Dude...you have ONE SINGLE proven stud. Derrick Rose...if you want to talk about a team not having anything else you just need to look at your own team. If there's any team that falls in the "but what do they have besides their best player", it's your team.And you have a psycho backing him up in West.

Derrick Rose and Zach Randolph are proven studs. If you didn't know, I have two All Stars on this team. One of them is a top 5 point guard, with amazing upside, and entering his 3rd year. The other is a 20/10 power forward who scores efficiently and get double doubles on the nightly basis. As far as "but what do they have besides their best player" lets take a look at what I have besides Derrick Rose and Zach Randolph.

So Devon Harris is just a chucking PG, but Derrick Rose is a proven stud? He ain't no chucking PG too? Why's that? Cuz he's on your team?

And Zach Randolph is suddenly mister studly? Oh for the love of pete. Why? Because he made an All-Star team? Devon Harris has been an All-Star. Caron Butler's been an All-Star. How come you didn't mention that earlier?

I know...because if they ain't All-Stars on your team then they aren't real. Only guys on your team are real All-Stars right?

Michael Pietrus = An athletic slasher that can spread the floor with his jumper. He is also a good defender and has a lot of playoff experience.

...and a backup starting at SG.

Wes Johnson = An anthletic energy player, that can score, shoot, defend, and rebound. 22 year old rookie, NBA ready.

And he's NBA ready how? You do know that analysts say that he's too mild mannered and unassuming to ever be able to be an impact player right?

Greg Oden = Former number 1 pick. When healthy, he has been a force in the NBA. Though health is a huge concern for him, he's only 22. He has been a force downlow on offense, defense, and rebounding. Only questionable thing about him is health.

When healthy? That's like me saying about Eddy Curry, when he's not fat, he's a top notch post player.

And you honestly don't think a 22 year old that can't stay healthy is a positive (because he's only 22?? I can understand it if it's a 35 year old, but he's ONLY 22 and he's already had multiple MAJOR surgeries on his knees. The fact that he's only 22 IS THE MAIN REASON why this he's a HUGE RISK. A 22 year old shouldn't be having all these physical problems!!!!

The only thing questionnable is his health? That's like saying the only thing bad about Iraq is their insane dictator of a president.

And Oden is one more (likely) injury away from being a bigger "bust" than my backup PF sport.

Bench
Delonte West = A combo guard that can shoot, score when called upon, and play defense. He also has a lot of playoff experience.

He's also a nutjob that just got suspended by the NBA and is one more nutjob away from being exiled to Timbuktu. You do know that right? Of course you didn't. Word of advice, keep him away from Derrick Rose's mom.

Reggie Williams = Instant scoring. He is 24 and has shown he can be a good and efficient scorer at every level, including last season in the NBA.

He's a CHUCKER that was allowed to CHUCK in Nelson's CHUCKATHON offense. He can't play defense (funny that you mention my guys as can't play defense but not yours...why's that?).

Richard Jefferson = Athletic wing player that can create for himself and is an average shooter from deep. He's a decent defender and have a ton of playoff experience.

Jefferson has looked like crap.

Joe Smith = He won't get much playing time playing behind Zach Randolph, but he's the veteran presence that all NBA teams have. He can provide decent minutes off the bench and can spread the floor with his jumpshot.

So Zach Randolph is going to play 48 minutes at PF? And spread the floor with his jumpshot? Dude...he shot less than 40% from the floor last season. Heck, Ian Mahinmi is better at "spreading the floor" than him and believe me that's an insult to Joe Smith and not a complement for Mahinmi.

Speaking of which...since I seem to have forgotten to...you do realize that Mahinmi actually was extremely productive (A LOT MORE THAN JOE SMITH) when he actually got minutes right? And Mahinmi's my 3rd string PF/C. Not to mention Mahinmi's a MUCH BETTER defender, MUCH YOUNGER and MUCH MORE UPSIDE (not hard since the last time Joe Smith had any upside it was probably for breakfast when he asked for his eggs sunny side up).

Admit it, you wasted the pick on him. Stop trying to sugar coat a mistake.

Marcin Gortat = Said by the media to be the best backup center in the NBA. He's an athletic center that finishes around the basket, is a great rebounder, and great defender. With Oden being injury prone, he's a guy that can fill in at center and we won't miss much. He will protect the paint. He is another player with big playoff game experience.

And you're going to need him with Oden there.

But hold on....did you just say he "can fill in at center (for Oden) and we won't miss much"? Are you saying that Gortat is almost as good as Oden when healthy (to which a big hearty LOL) or are you saying that Oden isn't that good?

You're relying on Greg Oden, who has not been able to show he can play even half a season in any of his 3 NBA seasons as the "backbone" (and honestly, only real member) of your defense. PS: looks like Oden hasn't made as much progress in his latest endeavor to recover from injury as Blazer management had expected.

No. I'm not "relying on Greg Oden". I have him because he's a good player, he's young, and he was the best center available at that time. He hasn't shown he can be healthy, which is why I immediately drafted Gortat when it became time to fill in for my bench. I know Oden's injury prone. There is little risk in this pick because my center position is covered well. The reward of a healthy Oden is to high to pass up. After this season, it would be on me to extend a qualifying offer. Once again, there was very little risk, but an extremely high reward for picking him. I'm "relying on Greg Oden" to make a DEEP playoff run. I'm not "relying on Greg Oden" to be successful in the regular season.

If you're not relying on Oden to anchor your team then what kind of a team do you have? The ONLY REASON you're team would be a top notch team is IF Oden is healthy. Why? Cause IF HEALTHY he's a potent defensive presence. Without Oden your team is basically Zach Randolph and Derrick Rose chucking you to wins. Which...is hardly something to get excited about.

You have a backup backup caliber player as your starting SG in Pietrus.

Do you see the starting shooting guards in the NBA? In a league where Raja Bell started and Arron Afflalo and Anthony Parker are starters, you have the nerves to criticize Mickeal Pietrus? Isn't Thabo a starter? A guy that plays good defense and can spread the floor, is a backup's BACKUP caliber shooting guard? You thought saying that was a smart comment? Haha. My little Melo jab wasn't that serious for you to start saying things like this. It was a little jab. It wasn't a reason for you to get mad, and then go overboard with your criticism of my team. You can bash the team all you want, its all in fun, but lets not say stupid things like that. Now Pietrus sucks? Haha. Isn't Kelenna Azubuike on his way to starting for the Knicks?

Oh please...it wasn't a little jab. You've been yapping about the Heat as "Melo and nothing else" whenever other GM's (your peers) have said that your team is not as good. Why can't you just accept that? Or maybe this is a consipiracy and they're all against you? Yeah, that must be it. They jealous!!!

An offensive blackhole at PF who you've referred to as more of an expiring contract than anything else, with a guy that may retire in Joe Smith as his backup? Dude...you need to get a real backup PF. This isn't 2006-2007 (the last time Joe Smith was remotely effective), it's 2010-2011. Joe Smith is that Thanksgivings Day turkey that was left in the oven for too long.

You ever heard the saying "feed the beast"? Now look at my team. Who is taking these shots away from this blackhole? Pietrus? Johnson? West? Who? That's right. That offensive blackhole will get his touches. You know what that means? That offensive blackhole will be happy that he's getting touches and therefore he'll continue to play hard, and grab rebounds on both ends. Doesn't that make me a better team? Doesn't that mean I put the proper players around Zach that will allow me to compete, while also catering to his needs? And Joe Smith won't be playing long. Most teams don't even go 10 deep. Using Joe Smith for about 10 minutes a game, isn't going to be the difference in my team winning or losing. Did you really believe that an 11th round pick was that important to point out? Haha.

"Feed the Beast"? If you're referring to Randolph as the Beast then wow...just wow. If Randolph is a Beast then half the team's have Godzilla's on their team. Randolph is a chucker, always have been, always will be. One season on a good team making him look good doesn't change things. Or have you forgotten his Knick days?

Keep your hype about your own team to yourself.

Lets see...Ra gave my team a 9/10 as far as winning now and this is with a team that doesn't have much besides its best player, according to you. Phenom rated my team in the top 5, top 2 in the West. Others have said my team is definitely in the top 10 and once again, this isn't exactly a team with older players. Most of the players are young and still entering, if not in their prime. The upside for my team is ridiculous and they're a team that can compete now for the marbles. I think I should take this hype nationwide.

One thing you must remember is the league isn't about the most individually talented players on one team. Its about what team plays the best together. Its about how the players fit on a team. Look at my team. My players compliment each other. You have the Devin Harris, Caron Butler, and Carmelo Anthony, but are those really the best players to put next to Carmelo? Are those great complimentary players for Melo? Are they going to take the load off of Melo? Are they going to space the floor for Melo?

Melo is a superstar cause he knows how to score.

In fact, most regard Melo as one of the most dynamic offensive players in the NBA in terms of being able to get his offense going regardless of what defenses throw against him. So I wouldn't be so worried about him getting his offense going.

Butler is also a terrific defender and an extremely tough player who can postup, attack the basket AND shoot from 18-20 out (i.e. REALLY spreading the floor)...funny that you dont' mention that.

Harris can push the tempo and was one of the most dynamic point guards in the NBA in 2009. Dynamic means being able to create shots for himself and others.

Jerryd Bayless also looked terrific in the playoffs with not only his scoring but also his passing. He'll be getting more time

In fact, one of the benefits of having all these options on offense IS so it makes it extremely difficult for opposing teams to defend any one guy....funny you didn't mention that. YOu know...easier to score when teams can't zone in on one or two or even three particular players?

And then, OF COURSE, you fail to mention any of the defensive players that the Heat have.

You fail to mention Ben Wallace at all. You then skim over Ibaka who showed that he can change the game with his defense and hustle with the Thunder. Oh and how's about Wallace (who UNLIKE your backup PF is still able to produce) being the perfect mentor to push Ibaka's game to another level? Failed to mention that as well.

Mahinmi is a young, super athletic and physically imposing 6'11" PF/C that can run, block shots and finish. Oh and he's only 23 years old...

And Marvin Williams (who...oh...is only 24 years old) was an integral part of the Hawks rotation. He's another extremely tough player (see Boston series) who often ends up guarding the opposing teams top offensive wings...but of course...you'll fail to mention that.

Analysts also project Paul George as being able to evolve into a top notch defender (all the tools)...oh and...you know what his best skill is? Of course you didn't. I'll help you with it...it's called shooting the ball (you know...stretching the offense). But of course, he's not ready but Wesley Johnson is a lock right?

Anything to belittle the other team to make yourself look better...it's your moto.

Words of advice: Stick to arguing about the strength's and merits of your own team instead of sinking to ripping other teams. If your team is good (and it is a very good team) then it should stand on it's own merits.

[moocow007]

Bish...thanks for updating the picks. Was giving me a headache.

[Jstarks3]

Honestly, next BAT needs to be done via some kind of simming. I know, I know but the only time one of these things were actually finished was via a sim. A sim is about as neutral as things will get. Judging would be awesome but it's almost impossible to get done. I'd be up for running a future BAF (franchise, not team) based on simming.

[Rich2Hassan]

Ny wonder why Q2N8's team isn't terrible like the last 4 teams... he has like 5 assistants. 5 LOL

No idea he had 5...no matter, I'm still the best out of all of them lol. If anyone who doesn't have an assistant gm/person to help with drafting/trades I can help if you want.

you're the only Asst. GM in the Hawks. Dont listen to kids.

[moocow007]

Honestly, next BAT needs to be done via some kind of simming. I know, I know but the only time one of these things were actually finished was via a sim. A sim is about as neutral as things will get. Judging would be awesome but it's almost impossible to get done. I'd be up for running a future BAF (franchise, not team) based on simming.

I'm all for a sim (came in 3rd last BAT).

Had an interesting idea from N8. How about we get a panel of judges from other boards to keep the impartiality. I think there is a concern that some of the GM's will vote for their friends and expect reciprocation...so no matter what scoring system we use it could be tainted.

I know we tried last time but it was kinda a quick random thing. No judges from this board. Maybe get some of the vet posters in the General, Trade and Player Comp boards. I would still suggest scoring it by having each judge rank from 1-30 each of the teams in the various categories.

Then we add the ranks up and the team with the lowest points win each category (i.e. win now, future, cap, etc.). Then add all the points across categories together and the team with lowest total points is the overall winner.

[Jstarks3]

^ agreed. there are way too many biases on this board.

[Jstarks3]

and btw, im in agreement with you bluest. 100%. the draft makes the whole BAT.

[I am Ra]

Honestly, next BAT needs to be done via some kind of simming. I know, I know but the only time one of these things were actually finished was via a sim. A sim is about as neutral as things will get. Judging would be awesome but it's almost impossible to get done. I'd be up for running a future BAF (franchise, not team) based on simming.

I'm all for a sim (came in 3rd last BAT).

Had an interesting idea from N8. How about we get a panel of judges from other boards to keep the impartiality. I think there is a concern that some of the GM's will vote for their friends and expect reciprocation...so no matter what scoring system we use it could be tainted.

I know we tried last time but it was kinda a quick random thing. No judges from this board. Maybe get some of the vet posters in the General, Trade and Player Comp boards. I would still suggest scoring it by having each judge rank from 1-30 each of the teams in the various categories.

Then we add the ranks up and the team with the lowest points win each category (i.e. win now, future, cap, etc.). Then add all the points across categories together and the team with lowest total points is the overall winner.

agreed. I can get you 1-2 guys right now.

[moocow007]

I'm all for a sim (came in 3rd last BAT).

Had an interesting idea from N8. How about we get a panel of judges from other boards to keep the impartiality. I think there is a concern that some of the GM's will vote for their friends and expect reciprocation...so no matter what scoring system we use it could be tainted.

I know we tried last time but it was kinda a quick random thing. No judges from this board. Maybe get some of the vet posters in the General, Trade and Player Comp boards. I would still suggest scoring it by having each judge rank from 1-30 each of the teams in the various categories.

Then we add the ranks up and the team with the lowest points win each category (i.e. win now, future, cap, etc.). Then add all the points across categories together and the team with lowest total points is the overall winner.

agreed. I can get you 1-2 guys right now.

Let's wait for mags and 2k2's feedback but definitely.

[moocow007]

And justdatdude....I still love you papi (no homo) even though we have our current disagreement.

[TheBluest]

23/20/22
29/24
23/22/22
22/22
23/22

THE FUTURE!!!!!!!!!

[moocow007]

23/20/22
29/24
23/22/22
22/22
23/22

THE FUTURE!!!!!!!!!

How many of those are under 6'4"?

EDIT: Never mind, just saw your roster. Not bad.