To Tank or not to Tank, that is the question

[Crazy-Canuck]

IM just ready to enjoy watching basketball again. We have young guys playing with nothing to lose and something to prove.

Last year was frustrating because the expectations were high and the effort just wasnt there. Too many players put themselves ahead of the team.

Im looking forward to the season. I want to see how Bargs handles the torch, if Derozen is ready to take the next step, if JJ can impose his will in the locker room, if Amir goes out and plays the way the BC thinks he can, if Klieza can play with the same form as he's shown during FIBA's etc....

Its gonna be a fun year and cant wait till it gets started.

[lobosloboslobos]

You need to have multiple can't miss prospects and then a bunch of complimentary players with big upside and they all need to be playing together quickly and becoming friends during those crucial rookie-contract impressionable years...

Oh and you forgot: avoid all serious injuries to key players for many years. So make sure you stay away from "can't miss prospects" like #1 picks Oden and Griffin.

Great plan. I totally like it. Here are a few others I like, each of which is about as easy to achieve as yours:

Get a psychic to convince the 3 best college players players they should play together and their team of choice should be the Raps.

Get a deity (take your pick) to make the Raps his/her/its team of destiny and give our players superhuman powers

Convince MLSE to go massively into the tax and to sign 5 max players

Go BC!

Actually, now that I think of it, we could also trade away all of our players for high draft picks and MLSE could sign some of us RealGMers to play for the Raps. We'd cost way less, so the team could save up money for later, plus we'd get to live out our dreams. And then we use all those draft picks to select multiple can't miss prospects who will become lifelong friends and bring us championships! it's a win-win-win situation!

[Indiana Jones]

i would be psyched if our young guys played big minutes, but i have a feeling davis and alabi will hardly see the floor, in favor on anderson and reggie evans....

[Inception]

I'm a little baffled because it seems like half the people here feel as if tanking the season is the solution to all of our problems. They act like it's foolproof and the obvious thing to do because it's worked so often in the past... right??

First off, it's called the "lottery" for a reason. Every year there are teams that compete for the worst record and every year the majority of those teams get screwed. Secondly, just because you're trying to suck doesn't mean you're automatically the worst team in the league. On the one hand, our team is too talented to be the worst and while it's easy for us as fans to cheer for losses, it's completely different from the players perspective. A losing season can be extremely disheartening and I imagine it'd be very difficult to swallow your pride and intentionally lose. We're talking about pro athletes that are competing for minutes, contracts and fame. Unless the coaches make adjustments with the intent of setting us back, I just don't see us finishing with the worst record. And if that does happen, what's that going to do for morale? Will the addition of one stud rookie all of a sudden change our team mentality? These guys want to win, the coaches want to win and I'm pretty sure that the general manager knows that tanking is a huge gamble.

How often does it REALLY work? Let's see...

2009/2010 - The Nets and the Timberwolves tanked, both teams finished with 15 or less wins in the "John Wall Sweepstakes" and neither ended up with the first. In fact, BOTH teams fell two spots and ended up with 3rd and 4th. The Nets were banking on getting Wall and then using that to convince a big time free agent like Lebron to sign with the team and none of that worked out. The funny (and scary) part is that if you ever went to the Nets RealGM boards last year every other thread was about Wall and fans were actually cheering for losses. Sounds familiar...

2008/2009 - The Kings, Wizards and Clippers all have the worst record with under 20 wins. On draft night the Clips jumped from 3rd pick to 1st and the Kings and Wizards fell to 4th and 5th. Hmmm...

2007/2008 - The Heat, Sonics and Grizzlies have the worst records (in that order) and the Bulls come out of nowhere to win the first pick, pushing the rest of the teams down.

2006/2007 - Grizzlies, Celtics and Bucks all tanked for Oden/Durant and each of them fell three spots to pick 4th, 5th and 6th. The Celtics bounced back because they were able to trade their picks and youth for Allen and Garnett but that's the type of trade that only a team like Boston (or LA) can pull off. Had that not work they'd still be fighting for lottery balls.

2005/2006 - The Blazers, Knicks and Bobcats tanked and we jumped from 5th to get the 1st pick, pushing everyone else down a notch.

This is getting repetitive so for the sake of saving myself some time... the last time that the worst place team landed the first pick was in 2004 when the Magic ended up with Dwight. That's six years ago and if you look at draft history since then the majority of the teams that have been in the lottery have stayed there year in and year out, with the exceptions being Oklahoma City and Portland. But those teams didn't turn it around with one star... they've built through the draft over the course of several years.

The only legitimate reason I can see for tanking is the potential of landing two high picks in a row if the lockout ends up happening. That's assuming that league determines draft order in the lockout year based on standings over the past several seasons. But again that's also a gamble and I doubt BC goes that route.

Tanking reminds me of a silly get rich quick scheme. Most of the time it doesn't work and it won't turn our fortunes around in one season. And finally, BC knows this and there's no way he's going to push his team to lose. If we lose because we suck that's one thing but to lose intentionally... not gonna happen. And unfortunately (or fortunately), we don't suck as bad as some of the crappier teams in the league.

[theSkinny]

see sig.

[Inception]

I spent a lot of time on this and figured it deserved it's own thread instead of getting lost in the middle of a bunch of other posts

[dagger]

I spent a lot of time on this and figured it deserved it's own thread instead of getting lost in the middle of a bunch of other posts

The fact you spent a lot of time on it doesn't mean it deserves its own thread and shouldn't be used in another thread as a rebuttal. It's basically the answer to the thread on why we should be thrilled with an awful team.

[Inception]

I get what you're saying but that same thread about us being awful could have gone in one of the hundred other threads about the same thing. And same goes for any stat of the day thread or any twitter thread, right? How is that distinction made? Does it depend on who's posting it?

In my opinion, I don't see why it's a problem to have a thread like this during the summer when there's nothing to talk about. A lot of threads with one line and very little thought end up staying open. Anyway, if it's that big of a deal you can merge it with the other one but to me it's a huge double standard when I look at some of the other threads that do stay open.

[kem416]

anyone else hoping for an Amir Johnson career-ending knee injury 10 games into the season?

You're an idiot. Ban this fool.

[Scott Carefoot]

It's not tanking if the team is legitimately bad. And just because you don't get the first overall pick, that doesn't mean you're not getting a potential All-Star. DeMarcus Cousins went fifth in the last draft and I think he could end up being the best player out of that draft class.

[Inception]

And for the record, I thought about posting it in an existing thread but I figured if I put enough thought into it, and added some numbers/stats then it would make my argument distinct enough that it would deserve it's own thread. Kinda like how Supersub can post a thread about Andrea's rebounding or defensive statistics in the midst of dozens of threads talking about the same thing. But again, if there's a difference between the two (not including the fact that he's a mod or ex-mod), please go ahead and merge

[Inception]

It's not tanking if the team is legitimately bad. And just because you don't get the first overall pick, that doesn't mean you're not getting a potential All-Star. DeMarcus Cousins went fifth in the last draft and I think he could end up being the best player out of that draft class.

I don't think we're going to be bad enough to land a top 5 pick but I could be wrong. If we are legitimately that bad then fine but if we're not I don't see BC trying to make us worse. If anything, he'll try to make us better and get us into the playoffs even if that means we're not in the lottery

[Scott Carefoot]

It's not tanking if the team is legitimately bad. And just because you don't get the first overall pick, that doesn't mean you're not getting a potential All-Star. DeMarcus Cousins went fifth in the last draft and I think he could end up being the best player out of that draft class.

I don't think we're going to be bad enough to land a top 5 pick but I could be wrong. If we are legitimately that bad then fine but if we're not I don't see BC trying to make us worse. If anything, he'll try to make us better and get us into the playoffs even if that means we're not in the lottery

Vegas odds list the Raptors as a bottom-five team and ESPN's NBA panel ranked the Raptors last in the East. The only people who are optimistic about this team's 2010-11 prospects are certain optimistic Raptors fans. If you weren't a fan, you would almost certainly peg the Raptors as a bottom-five team right now.

As for BC, he is not going to try to make the team worse intentionally, that's not his style.

[Inception]

Yeah but like others have mentioned, from an outsiders perspective we are going to suck because we lost the two biggest names on our team (Hedo and Bosh). But as Raptor fans we know that guys like Weems, DD, and Bargs can step it up and Hedo was more of a detriment than an asset last season. I think the fact that we're in Toronto automatically makes the rest of the league and American media underestimate us due to lack of exposure.

And don't forget we still have the TPE. If BC can get some value back that could change everything

[Bringbackoakley]

If it happens it happens, I will think about it then (it will most likely happen).


All I care about is seeing improvement from the beginning of the year to the end. I want our young players to get better, mainly on the defensive end. I want them to have as many minutes as they can handle. I want to see Davis getting time on the court and being allowed to play through his mistakes...

If all of this happens I will be a happy camper.

[Orsk]

There is no way Reggie Evans gets ANY minutes this season, Dorsey fills the same roll and is twice as good.

[orbesnet]

i hope we play well this year. I'm not satisfied with the way things have gone for the past, dare I say it, 10 years (almost).

For me it's not really one or the other, win and fail to get a high pick or lose and get a top 5 pick....

I want to see them play hard, I want to see development, and I want to be entertained. I think all 3 of those things are possible this year.... while we head to the lottery.... again.

sidenote: i love how people make it out like losing Hedo is going to affect things. The guy was a lump of coal, had like 3 good games the whole season, damn.

[bena2005]

title looks like some shakespear material

[Inception]

title looks like some shakespear material

Nooooo... really??? Are you sure it's not a Stephen King reference??

[Lionel Messi]

No, it's not "the question". We don't get to pick, there is a VERY small chance of us making the play-offs. Unless some SERIOUS internal improvement with DeMar/Weems/Amir/Bargs happens.