Arenas and Mcgee

[Ruzious]

I don't think it matters whether Arenas scores 18 a game or 30 a game (unless you're more concerned about a fantasy league). The important thing is that he does it efficiently and in the flow of the offense (and not do things like fire up 26 foot treys with 18 seconds left on the shot clock). Btw, I think he can still get 5 assists a game - even playing with Wall.

[Brenice]

The important thing is that he does it efficiently and in the flow of the offense

I didn't know offense was the problem during Gil's tenure here, I thought it was defense. If there was a scoring problem, it was the lack of a low-post threat.

[AceDegenerate]

I don't think it matters whether Arenas scores 18 a game or 30 a game (unless you're more concerned about a fantasy league). The important thing is that he does it efficiently and in the flow of the offense (and not do things like fire up 26 foot treys with 18 seconds left on the shot clock). Btw, I think he can still get 5 assists a game - even playing with Wall.

I think somebody needs to rewatch Gil's 60 point game VS the Lakers. There were plenty 26 foot treys fired up with 18+ seconds on the shot clock in this game.

Gilbert is at his best when he's focused on scoring the ball, he can do that with the best players in this league. Nobody questions Kobe when he pulls a 26 footer early in the clock, cause more often than not they go in, Gilbert has that same ability and should be able to regain it this season.

[Ruzious]

I don't think it matters whether Arenas scores 18 a game or 30 a game (unless you're more concerned about a fantasy league). The important thing is that he does it efficiently and in the flow of the offense (and not do things like fire up 26 foot treys with 18 seconds left on the shot clock). Btw, I think he can still get 5 assists a game - even playing with Wall.

I think somebody needs to rewatch Gil's 60 point game VS the Lakers. There were plenty 26 foot treys fired up with 18+ seconds on the shot clock in this game.

Gilbert is at his best when he's focused on scoring the ball, he can do that with the best players in this league. Nobody questions Kobe when he pulls a 26 footer early in the clock, cause more often than not they go in, Gilbert has that same ability and should be able to regain it this season.

Rationalize it any way you like, but it's horseshyt garbage basketball - unless you're way behind and need to score in a hurry. It hurts the team. Pretty much every time Gil did that last season, there was a long defensive rebound which led to a fast break dunk by the opposition. Notice he stopped doing that crap in his last few games before the suspension, because Flip finally flipped out about shot selection - and that's when Gil was playing his best last season. I could give a flying **** about 1 game years ago vs the Lakers. The objective is to become the best team they can be; not to get Gilbert 60 points.

[Ruzious]

The important thing is that he does it efficiently and in the flow of the offense

I didn't know offense was the problem during Gil's tenure here, I thought it was defense. If there was a scoring problem, it was the lack of a low-post threat.

5 years ago wasn't last season. Gil's scoring efficiency last season was way below what it was in his best years.

[Brenice]

5 years ago wasn't last season. Gil's scoring efficiency last season was way below what it was in his best years.

But what did he do last year? More specifically, what did he do when he was playing off the ball last year? I read on "Bulletsforever" he was damn near 50% on spot-up 3's. How's that for efficiency?

The thing about it, Gil's numbers were getting better and better, and then.....! But anyway, he seemed to be getting rid of rust.

[AceDegenerate]

I'm shocked it's come to the point that people want to legitimately question Gilbert's offensive ability.

Stay tuned, the season will be here before you know it.

[Wizardspride]

I'm shocked it's come to the point that people want to legitimately question Gilbert's offensive ability.

Crazy....isn't it?

[Ruzious]

5 years ago wasn't last season. Gil's scoring efficiency last season was way below what it was in his best years.

But what did he do last year? More specifically, what did he do when he was playing off the ball last year? I read on "Bulletsforever" he was damn near 50% on spot-up 3's. How's that for efficiency?

The thing about it, Gil's numbers were getting better and better, and then.....! But anyway, he seemed to be getting rid of rust.

And then... read what I said. "Notice he stopped doing that crap in his last few games before the suspension, because Flip finally flipped out about shot selection - and that's when Gil was playing his best last season."

[dobrojim]

Actually, I think Wall will benefit from Gil just like Gil benefiting from Wall. If he only does this, Gil stretches the defense. That helps create penetration lanes for Wall. Remember the Gil/DeShawn or Gil/Jeffries backcourt. To penetrate, Gil had to split a lot of cheating guards, that were dropping off the DeShawn/Jeffries.

Are you suggesting DeBrick or Jeffries couldn't shoot!?!??!

how could you

[dobrojim]

Rationalize it any way you like, but it's horseshyt garbage basketball - unless you're way behind and need to score in a hurry. It hurts the team. Pretty much every time Gil did that last season, there was a long defensive rebound which led to a fast break dunk by the opposition. Notice he stopped doing that crap in his last few games before the suspension, because Flip finally flipped out about shot selection - and that's when Gil was playing his best last season. I could give a flying **** about 1 game years ago vs the Lakers. The objective is to become the best team they can be; not to get Gilbert 60 points.

what I have a vague recollection of was that this actually stopped in the very
last game Gil played vs PHL. Flip called him out during a TO and Gil humbly
backed down and said he would cut it out.

But I think you're basic point is absolutely the right one and KZ probably
agrees as well. It doesn't matter one whit whether Gil avgs 23 or 26 or
some other #. What matters is how well he helps us get Ws.

[willbcocks]

For the past X years with Gil we have had terrible ball movement (just check # of assists or % of assisted shots) when Gil is leading the team. Yet we have been a highly efficient offensive team. Part of me says this might just be a matter of style--sure it wasn't the prettiest offensive basketball, but he (and Jamison) can make tough shots and got the job done. Part of me, however, thinks this style of offense hurt us in other areas.

My experience playing basketball is that if you move the ball on offense, guys play much harder on defense (yet weren't iverson's teams great on the defensive end? Maybe it depends on the personnel) and are more cohesive. Someone should do a study looking for a correlation between assist ratio and defensive stats.

Next year will obviously different because Gil will be running with Wall. Wall is going to be moving the ball around, one way or the other. If Gil plays off him well, we'll probably be a decent offensive team (only decent because we are short on shooters), but it's very difficult to predict how they will work together.

[Brenice]

Ruzious

I pretty much agree with you, but don't act like it can't be done. You yourself just said he did it, after Flip flipped. If Flip flipping is what it took, so be it. I think Flip is still the coach isn't he? Gil has been use to playing with only 2 people on the court to trust offensively, Antawn and Caron/Hughes. With the Big 3 and garbage, Gil did what he had to do and the offense was one of the best in the world. Were bad habits picked up, probably. And as we know, habits are hard to break.

But now, after Flip flipped out, Gil is not playing the point now, he still is the #1 scoring option on the team, Wall be damned, Blatche be damned. The #1 option is Gil. #2 Blatche. Or do you just want Gil to not be used at the 2? Do you want Nick or Thornton to be #1 option? Wall is the point.

Sure Gil jacked in the past. But a worse option was feeding Etan or Brendan(back then), Michael Ruffin, Jeffries, Stevenson, Jarvis, or whoever else besides the the Big 3. Matter of fact, a case can be made that by everybody besides the Big 3 being self-check, they made it more difficult for Gil, Antawn, Hughes/Caron. How often did Gil have to split a tight double-team because a defender leaving somebody else to help out on Gil?

True that is years ago, but there are more options now and that will help Gil's efficiency. Like Wall is being quoted as saying above "Gil is better than I thought", with options, who you gonna cheat off of? Cheat off Gil, Wall, Blatche, Thornton/Josh Howard, or leave JaVale open for the lob? That is where your efficiency will come from and Gil will not have to jack shots.

[Ruzious]

Brenice, this is what I said:

I don't think it matters whether Arenas scores 18 a game or 30 a game (unless you're more concerned about a fantasy league). The important thing is that he does it efficiently and in the flow of the offense (and not do things like fire up 26 foot treys with 18 seconds left on the shot clock). Btw, I think he can still get 5 assists a game - even playing with Wall.

You seem to have read a lot more into what I said than what I actually said. I really don't disagree with what you just posted. I think Gil can work very well with Wall. People were focusing on how much they wanted Gil to score, and I was trying to help them see the forest from the trees - what matters isn't whether or not he scores 30 points a game; it's whether or not he helps the team win.

[Brenice]

Brenice, this is what I said:

I don't think it matters whether Arenas scores 18 a game or 30 a game (unless you're more concerned about a fantasy league). The important thing is that he does it efficiently and in the flow of the offense (and not do things like fire up 26 foot treys with 18 seconds left on the shot clock). Btw, I think he can still get 5 assists a game - even playing with Wall.

You seem to have read a lot more into what I said than what I actually said. I really don't disagree with what you just posted. I think Gil can work very well with Wall. People were focusing on how much they wanted Gil to score, and I was trying to help them see the forest from the trees - what matters isn't whether or not he scores 30 points a game; it's whether or not he helps the team win.

I got you Ruzious. I think it will no longer be a Big 3, but a medium 4 with spare parts.

[Ruzious]

Brenice, this is what I said:

I don't think it matters whether Arenas scores 18 a game or 30 a game (unless you're more concerned about a fantasy league). The important thing is that he does it efficiently and in the flow of the offense (and not do things like fire up 26 foot treys with 18 seconds left on the shot clock). Btw, I think he can still get 5 assists a game - even playing with Wall.

You seem to have read a lot more into what I said than what I actually said. I really don't disagree with what you just posted. I think Gil can work very well with Wall. People were focusing on how much they wanted Gil to score, and I was trying to help them see the forest from the trees - what matters isn't whether or not he scores 30 points a game; it's whether or not he helps the team win.

I got you Ruzious. I think it will no longer be a Big 3, but a medium 4 with spare parts.

I like the way you put that. It sounds more like a team.

[go'stags]

I gotta say I don't mind Gil's deep three's all that much. If Gil is shooting those shots it usually means he is fully confident, and his "swag is phenomenal". That is the Gil that makes us a very dangerous team. It also makes his man cover him out there, which gives him and the rest of the offense more room to operate.

Yea, his long threes lead to long rebounds and some fast break buckets, but that doesn't mean we cant give still be a good defensive team. Let's face it, the reason we were a horrible defensive team was because AJ was at PF and Eddie Jordan was our coach, not because of Gil's offense.

Plus with a smart, uber-athlete like Wall in the back court, stopping the ball in transition should be easier for us now.

But a confident, unconscious, unstoppable Gil is what we really need, and long threes are a part of it. To me it's up to Flip to adjust to his players; we shall see if he can do that.