Suns @ Jazz 8:30 MST ESPN

[oaktownwarriors87]

Yeah, join the masses of people who assume Hayward is nonathletic and can't dribble or create his own shot...and no one will admit it, but they ignore the fact that he IS all those things because he's white.

Because he's white? How about because he's skinny, has small shoulders, doesn't have long arms and he isn't that quick.... thats why big men like Cole Aldrich, DeMarcus Cousins, Ekpe Udoh and Patrick Patterson were beating him in the pre draft agility test.

And bad decision making regarding players? CJ was a great second round pick. SECOND ROUND

Are you kidding me? The Jazz had a high 2nd round draft pick the the greatest second round of all time. Monta Ellis, Marcin Gortat, Lois Willaims, Andray Blatche, Ryan Gomes, Amir Johnson, Ronny Turiaf and others were still available. Nothing to brag about there.

How many "intimidators in the paint" are there in the NBA anymore? Should the Jazz just draft and sign a bunch of tall players with no upside? And on a side not, Fes has actually been pretty solid for us so far. He should have had more minutes.

Portland has three on one team. How many teams outside of the Jazz don't have a shot blocker/rebounder at the center position?

And forgive me but athletes like Kevin Durant and Josh Smith don't come after the 20th pick too often. We did well to get Hayward and Evans, two of the bright spots so far.

You mean athletes like Paul George and Xavior Henry? In fact, the Jazz had the 16th pick when Josh Smith was drafted 17th... they also had the 14th pic that year. The last athlete the Jazz drafted was Brewer, and unlike Xavior Henry he can't shoot the ball.

Jazz have a history of their first round draft picks washing out of the NBA... in recent history they have more than any other team.

[StocktonShorts]

The Jazz's problem right now is not that they're not "athletic" - it's that they don't have any shooters.

[UTJazzFan_Echo1]

I find the comment about the Jazz having a history of 1st round picks being wash outs absolutely hilarious. Especially coming from a (apparently) Warriors fan.

I agree we don't need to be more athletic, we need more outside shooters. Look at Boston and the Spurs, they were never very athletic yet they still won plenty of championships. Heck, Detroit wasn't very athletic when they won theirs either. Athletes don't win games, basketball players do.

[Jazzfan12]

Ben Wallace was the leader of that Pistons team and he was crazy athletic.

[UTJazzFan_Echo1]

Ben Wallace was the leader? Uhhhh...maybe on the defensive end but Billups was the leader of the team. Wallace was also undersized and couldn't do anything on offense. The only other athletic player on the Pistons that comes to mind is Prince.....anyone else they had who was an above average athlete?

[dr0welf]

Where are the athletes? Where are the outside shooters? Where is the guy that can create his own shot? Where are the defenders? Where are the intimidators in the paint? When was the last time the Jazz actually addressed one of their glaring weaknesses? Get a PG like Williams and a low post scorer like Jefferson some of these players and they will win. CJ Miles? A way past his prime Raja Bell? Gordon Hayward? Really?

Yeah, join the masses of people who assume Hayward is nonathletic and can't dribble or create his own shot...and no one will admit it, but they ignore the fact that he IS all those things because he's white.

And bad decision making regarding players? CJ was a great second round pick. SECOND ROUND Other good picks include Williams, Millsap, Evans, Fesenko, Brewer. Also, Gaines and Mathews might not be in the league were it not for the FO. You can't honestly argue that the Jazz don't pick players well. They have some of the best scouting I've seen, and, BTW, tried drastically to move up and pick Cousins...it just didn't work out.

How many "intimidators in the paint" are there in the NBA anymore? Should the Jazz just draft and sign a bunch of tall players with no upside? And on a side not, Fes has actually been pretty solid for us so far. He should have had more minutes.

Defenders? Hayward has been our best defender. Raja has been a great defender, his shot just hasn't fallen. Kirilenko and Williams. In fact the Jazz were 10th defensively last season.

And forgive me but athletes like Kevin Durant and Josh Smith don't come after the 20th pick too often. We did well to get Hayward and Evans, two of the bright spots so far.

I know you didn't say Hayward is the problem...but to say the Jazz don't make moves or address issues is pretty ignorant as well. Everyone on realgm pretends to understand more than all the managers and owners do.

Chill the hell out everyone. Jefferson and the rookies are still pretty lost and the offense has no flow to it, but those things WILL come. Deron has sucked royally, but that will also change. Honestly my biggest concern is shooting and where its going to come from. Miles, Hayward and Bell all have it in them to shoot, and then there's Okur.

We've bitched and complained about the Jazz FO for so long for keeping Boozer around, for not making any moves, for not spending money on players, and for drafting Hayward and Evans...and we've had bounteous servings of crow on all those issues.

Have some damn faith.

Amen and thank you, you are a scholar and a saint, I couldn't have said it better.

[oaktownwarriors87]

I find the comment about the Jazz having a history of 1st round picks being wash outs absolutely hilarious. Especially coming from a (apparently) Warriors fan.

I agree we don't need to be more athletic, we need more outside shooters. Look at Boston and the Spurs, they were never very athletic yet they still won plenty of championships. Heck, Detroit wasn't very athletic when they won theirs either. Athletes don't win games, basketball players do.

Coming from a Warriors fan? I would expect that kind of comment from a Lakers fan, Yankees fan or a Patriots fan... but not a Jazz fan. How is it that the team I root for effects my judgment (especially considering I live in Utah and the Jazz are my second favorite team)? I can root for the Warriors because I don't base my self-esteem off the success of other, I just enjoy sports.

Kevin O'Conners first round history.

2010 Gordon Hayward
2009 Eric Maynor
2008 Kosta Koufos
2007 Morris Almond
2006 Ronnie Brewer
2005 Deron Willaims Deron or Paul? A draft pick that you can't screw up!
2004 Kris Humphries
2004 Kirk Snyder
2003 Aleksander Pavlovic,
2002 Ryan Humphrey
2001 Raul Lopez
2000 Deshawn Stevenson

Find one team that has done worse in the first round over the last decade. Picking Williams over Paul and picking Brewer, a player that can't shooting the ball, are the two best decisions he has made. I guess even a broken clock is right twice a day.

I agree the Jazz need outside shooting, but they also have other needs.

1. Interior defense
2. Outside Shooting
3. Another player that can create his own shot
4. More length and athleticism

The drafting of Gordon Hayward addresses ZERO of these. A player like Xavior Henry has an elite NBA body as a freshman and he's a great shooter.... Opportunity missed.

Rondo is one of the best athletes in the NBA and KG is a freak athlete that won defensive player of the year. Jazz don't have a single player on their team that can compare to their athleticism. Ginobli was very fast and very smooth and Parker was the quickest player in the NBA. Duncan is tall, strong and long. Detroits center, Wallace, was a top 10 athlete in the NBA. Billups had great size and speed for a PG, extremely hard to defend. Prince was extremely long and quick. These teams played defense and were far from un-athletic.