DEN-NYK-MIN

[younggunsmn]

I don't like PER. Randolph has played 30+ minutes only 15 times in his entire career (2+seasons).

Beasley has shown a decent bball IQ. Randolph has drawn gerald green comparisons for his on-court instincts. Beasley helped the Heat to the playoffs twice, with a coach who preaches defense. Randolph rotted on the bench for 2 horrible warrior teams that played no d. If you take the pot-smoking away, Beasley had shown much more on an actual basketball court. Not to mention Randolph can't stay healthy.

Randolph's star is fading, and fading fast, for every game D'antoni sits him his trade value goes down.
Walsh is in a tough position, trying to get value for a player his coach won't play (the 2nd coach who benched him). It's like trying to sell a used car while the mechanic points out all it's flaws.

This deal isn't going to be nearly enough for the Nuggets. The Knicks supposedly can get a first for Toney Douglas or Wilson Chandler (or is it Randolph?) from some team to send to the Nuggets. The Nuggets would prefer a young stud PF (like Favors) in the package too. Galinari + Chandler + Randolph and/or a first might tempt them if they look out of the playoffs. But why would the Knicks do that if their season is lost and Melo has all but told them he wants to come to NY as a FA? Every game the Knicks lose makes a trade less likely. They would be smarter to sign him outright and keep Galinari (who's shooting under 36% BTW), unless they're really that desperate after Lebron burned them and Amare has been LeSuck.

Randolph here? I'd like to see what we can do with our cap space first. The sixers are struggling bad and Iguodala might be on the market eventually, and we could either trade for him or gain a better asset for facilitating a trade. A couple of future 1st rounders for contracts from teams in the lux might be nice, but a bit of a longshot.

The potential is tantalizing, but how does he fit? Backup PF minutes? Will he ever be able to play center? Will he screw up the chemistry of the team? This would be alot more tempting if Kevin Love hadn't had such a monster week, but Randolph would be a nice compliment to Love as he fills the areas Kevin lacks (length, athleticism). I just think we have enough risky, talented, volatile young players on the team already. One more might throw the rest out of whack and Rambis would lose the rest of his hair.

[Worm Guts]

A little touchy aren't we?

You're comparing two players who've played wildly different amounts of playing time, not to mention Randolph DIDN'T have better stats. He had a higher PER, but you should know that PER is one of the more flawed statistics used in the NBA.

PER has it's flaws but I wouldn't call it "one of the more flawed statistics used in the NBA". if you were going to look deeper at Beasley, it's hard to say he had decent stats with Miami. He appeared to be a 6'8 PF, who didn't rebound, scored inefficiently, and couldn't play defense. The only way he was decent was in raw numbers. If I had the choice this offseason of Beasley or Randolph at the same price, I would have taken Randolph.

[shrink]

I can see both ways on this one myself, which is part of the reason I posted it.

1. The game is about predicting future performance, and we all have different views on when you can close the book on someone, so its very possible for two fair-minded people to differ wildly on the value of Anthony Randolph.

2. The crux of the deal is trying to sidestep giving up picks for Randolph, and using another asset instead .. this time cap space. I firmly believe a team can buy picks with cash, and the extra value is added here because MIN's cash doubles for DEN, because they are over the lux. I don't know if it'd be cheaper to simply use picks, but there's no big boost to the trade value that way -- a pick is worth a pick, whether its to DEN or to us.

3. I happened to check into this yesterday, and if we make no changes this year, after paying out 2011 draft picks (and with no Corey Brewer), we'll have about $10 mil in cap space next summer. If we did this trade, our cap space would be about $7 mil, since we'd be adding Anthony Randolph's $3 mil.

4. I agree that this is expensive. Randolph + Curry will certainly not be worth $13 mil in production, but having him on a $3 mil contract next year is worthwhile, as are his Bird Rights.

5. To me, it seems to come down to what you think the likelyhood is that Anthony Randolph is going to become a star player in the NBA. If its 10%, it's probably not worth the price. If its 30% .. maybe? Its tough for MIN to add potential stars.

[shrink]

I don't really care what you would classify as very good, that's a debate for Shrink to have...

Grow up. You have logical failures, and when they are pointed out, your tactic is to argue about what the definition of "is" is.

People don't want to hear about it, and you don't need to insert unnecessary little shots into new threads.

[Krapinsky]

Thanks Shrink, I can always count on you to brighten my mornings. Your posts are Thabeet level of bustness.

[Krapinsky]

A little touchy aren't we?

You're comparing two players who've played wildly different amounts of playing time, not to mention Randolph DIDN'T have better stats. He had a higher PER, but you should know that PER is one of the more flawed statistics used in the NBA.

Yes, and sorry to be rash. However, I just don't like it when posters don't acknowledge what they say was wrong and and instead their counter is a word play argument. Then when they make you play their word play game, they say it's your fault. This is Shrinktology 101. I've had enough of those lately and I didn't want to get boggled down in another one.

Can we just agree that Randolph's past stats are not a very good reason to not deal for him?? Maturity, injury-proneness, maybe price, maybe position, maybe BBIQ, all seem to be more valid arguments.

[shrink]

Anthony Randolph has played for the high-paced Warriors, then went to NYK to play for D'Antoni.

Do you think that helps or hurts him? Would Rambis be more of the same?

[Krapinsky]

Thank you for taking the high road Shrink. When considering future jabs, I will keep that in mind before posting.

Re D'antoni:

I think it can only hurt him. Playing for two megalomaniacs in a row can only hurt a kid. Also, both coaches pretty much ignore defense -- D'antoni more so -- which takes alot away from what makes Randolph a unique player.

I think he would look great in a system lik eours where big men get to use some creativity, where defense is mandated, and where if you make a mistake Rambis is just going to give you a back rub.

[Biff Cooper]

5. To me, it seems to come down to what you think the likelyhood is that Anthony Randolph is going to become a star player in the NBA. If its 10%, it's probably not worth the price. If its 30% .. maybe? Its tough for MIN to add potential stars.

Makes sense. Plenty of potential for AR to become a star. I'd probably put the percentage in the 10-15% range. If it were a year ago, this trade is an easy yes. With the clock ticking on the protection for our #1 pick, I lean towards no this year.