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Tracking the Defense

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Severn Hoos
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Re: Tracking the Defense 

Post#41 » by Severn Hoos » Wed Nov 10, 2010 6:17 pm

Nivek wrote:
AnotherFinn wrote:Can you tell what the defence of Cartier Martin is looking like?


Very limited sample size (48 total minutes that I've tracked so far), but he's looked good in what I've tracked. His defg isn't good (.565), but he's forcing turnovers. His stop percentage is 55%; his drtg is 100. Team drtg is 111 in the games I've tracked.


That seems about right from my non-professional observations. I recall after the pre-season game against NY, Mike Lee wrote this in the Insider:

This is a critical stretch for players battling for roster spots and spots in the rotation, and Saunders gave Cartier Martin a chance in the starting lineup. He finished with four points and three rebounds, but helped neutralize Danilo Gallinari, who missed all seven of his field goal attempts and scored just one point.

"It felt good. I'm pretty confident in myself," Martin said. "Defensively, I was able to get a couple of stops, slow down Gallinari. My offense didn't go the way I wanted it to, but I know there are other phases of the game, besides scoring. It was difficult to lose a game that we played so well in."


I know - it was preseason. And Gallinari isn't exactly 1st team all-NBA. But in the game Cartier started & was the primary defender, he was 0-7 with 1 point. In the regular season, with Cartier on the bench, he scored 16 points and had a team-high +24 differential. I didn't understand why Flip never called Cartier's number in that game.

I realize Cartier's no all-star, and has his limitations. But he seems like a useful player, and is definitely willing to work hard in whatever role he's asked to fill, particularly on defense. Seems we'd want to get a guy like that more minutes based on the current makeup of the team.
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Re: Tracking the Defense 

Post#42 » by AnotherFinn » Wed Nov 10, 2010 7:20 pm

Nivek wrote:
AnotherFinn wrote:Can you tell what the defence of Cartier Martin is looking like?


Very limited sample size (48 total minutes that I've tracked so far), but he's looked good in what I've tracked. His defg isn't good (.565), but he's forcing turnovers. His stop percentage is 55%; his drtg is 100. Team drtg is 111 in the games I've tracked.


So the other spot we thought would be bad is actually best with AT, Martin & Howard. Now if we get others better...
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Re: Tracking the Defense 

Post#43 » by zenvibes » Wed Nov 10, 2010 11:33 pm

Nivek wrote:Thanks, zen. I'm not seeing it with Kirk so far. It could be some aging signs -- he seems to be having some trouble staying in front of his man. And, he doesn't really have the size to affect shots much. So far this season, guys are shooting over him pretty easily. He's doing okay at forcing turnovers, but nothing spectacular. It's still VERY early, though. I'm hoping he looks better as the season goes on.


yeah...he is best at guarding PG's. Since he is(has been) a good defender coaches usually have him guarding SG's and SF's.

He's more of the harrassing type, body you up, not allow you to get to your comfort zone type of defender. Not a shot blocker or a steals guy. Similar to Battier in that sense. But like Battier, needs strong palyers on the court with him on both ends to be effective. Guys will still get their shots off against him but usually off balance a bit and since he is best playing on a guys hip he needs guys that will rotate or block shots at the rim behind him. if the overall defense is weak behind a player like Kirk that plays tight it wont really help his game as any NBA player know how to get a round a tight defender if there is little obstruction in the paint or at the rim. What Kirk will end up doing if the D is weak behind him is play off his man to help prevent the ball getting into the paint for easy buckets. This may be leading to the shots over him on the perimeter if that's what is happening. If you are interested i will record a few wizards games and compare kirk's defense now to that of the last few years and see if his head and heart is still in it...quite sure the motor still goes. He looked good against the Bulls in preseason but then was playing SF guarding the 6'9" Deng.
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Re: Tracking the Defense 

Post#44 » by nate33 » Wed Nov 17, 2010 2:26 pm

The Toronto game boosted our offensive and defensive ratings quite a bit. The Wizards now rank 28th on offense (formerly 30th), and they rank 12th on defense (formerly 17th).

The team rebounding isn't so bad either. We rank 18th in offensive rebounding percentage and 22nd in defensive rebounding percentage. If you told me before the start of the season that we would be a middle-of-the-pack rebounding team, I wouldn't have believed it.
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Re: Tracking the Defense 

Post#45 » by fishercob » Wed Nov 17, 2010 3:00 pm

nate33 wrote:The Toronto game boosted our offensive and defensive ratings quite a bit. The Wizards now rank 28th on offense (formerly 30th), and they rank 12th on defense (formerly 17th).

The team rebounding isn't so bad either. We rank 18th in offensive rebounding percentage and 22nd in defensive rebounding percentage. If you told me before the start of the season that we would be a middle-of-the-pack rebounding team, I wouldn't have believed it.


I'd expect both rankings to go down after tonight.
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Re: Tracking the Defense 

Post#46 » by Hoopalotta » Wed Nov 17, 2010 3:24 pm

Yeah, the Guys have basically been devoured on the boards by Charlotte and Orlando and then put together reasonable showings otherwise (sometimes even being well better than that, actually).

Edit --> well, according to assorted rankings, we are now....

26th in total rebound rate
22nd in defensive rebound rate
21st in offensive rebound rate
12th in defensive efficiency (really?)
2nd in turnovers forced (our best metric all season)

The following field goal percentage numbers have not been updated since 11/15 (i.e. no Raps)

29th in opponents field goal percentage at the rim with .697%
27th in opponents made field goals at the rim 16.1 a game (only 3 teams with more makes against)
8th in opponents field goal percentage inside 10 feet - not counting the rim
7th in opponents made field goal attempts inside 10 feet - not counting the rim
25th in opponents 16-23 foot field goals attempted (that is, there are only 5 teams who's opponents have attempted less long 2's than the 'Zards opponents)

Those 'at the rim numbers were up over .73% a few games ago, so this is substantial improvement statistically.
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Re: Tracking the Defense 

Post#47 » by jimij » Wed Nov 17, 2010 3:30 pm

I have a question for Kevik regarding our use of the zone defense if he is still doing his in-game tracking of the teams defense. As a team, are the Wiz defending better in zone or in man-to-man?

I feel like one of the reasons we struggle on the boards at times is due to Flips extensive use of zone defenses where players are rotating and thus not always in good position to rebound especially because I feel like we don't play very good zone defense to begin with IMO. I just want to know if what I think I'm seeing is actually born out by the statistics or not.
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Re: Tracking the Defense 

Post#48 » by Nivek » Wed Nov 17, 2010 3:32 pm

zen: Sorry for the no response -- I'm just seeing it. Yeah, I'd love to see your obversations about possible changes to Hinrich's defensive game. I am seeing some more effectiveness from him. Guys can still shoot over him and he's not creating a lot of turnovers, but he is a pest.

Observations through last night's game...

- McGee is doing better. He forced several misses against Toronto without skying for the block. He's still terrifically busy with a defensive usage rate of 28%. His defensive rating is down to 110, which still isn't good, but it's at least better. His defg is .502, which is high. I'd like to see him work that down to the low 400s over time.

- Blatche -- lazy but effective. dusg of just 16% -- by far the lowest of the bigs. He just doesn't help very much. But, his drtg is 101 so he's getting stops.

- Arenas has been pretty good so far on defense. His drtg of 107 is best among the guards (Hinrich is at 115; Wall at 111). Wall struggles to force misses (defg of .626), but is creating almost 5 turnovers per 48 minutes (steals plus non-steal forced turnovers).

- Thornton's defense has moderated a bit. His drtg is up to 106, and his defg is .527. He doesn't force many turnovers.

The entire team needs to do a better job of forcing misses.
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Re: Tracking the Defense 

Post#49 » by WizarDynasty » Wed Nov 17, 2010 4:04 pm

this is an awesome thread...just wanted to add that tidbit in.
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Re: Tracking the Defense 

Post#50 » by Nivek » Sat Nov 20, 2010 3:45 pm

Did anyone happen to record last night's game? Would you be willing to burn it to a DVD or transmogrify it into an electronic file that you could send to me? My DVR suffered from possible user error and didn't record the Memphis game.

Also, I have some travel coming up and I'm not going to be able to track every game. If you're interested in tracking some games between 11/27 and 12/2, and then again from 12/18 through 12/26, please let me know. I'd give you info on "The Method." Lemme know. Thanks.
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Re: Tracking the Defense 

Post#51 » by nate33 » Sat Nov 20, 2010 4:46 pm

Nivek wrote:Did anyone happen to record last night's game? Would you be willing to burn it to a DVD or transmogrify it into an electronic file that you could send to me? My DVR suffered from possible user error and didn't record the Memphis game.

Also, I have some travel coming up and I'm not going to be able to track every game. If you're interested in tracking some games between 11/27 and 12/2, and then again from 12/18 through 12/26, please let me know. I'd give you info on "The Method." Lemme know. Thanks.

I'd love to do it, but I can only catch the games via illegal internet streams. I watch them live and haven't figured out how to record them. (By the way if anyone knows a good way to record live streams, let me know.)
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Re: Tracking the Defense 

Post#52 » by Hoopalotta » Mon Nov 22, 2010 2:06 am

nate33 wrote:I'd love to do it, but I can only catch the games via illegal internet streams. I watch them live and haven't figured out how to record them. (By the way if anyone knows a good way to record live streams, let me know.)


Nate, check your PM's.
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Re: Tracking the Defense 

Post#53 » by dlts20 » Mon Nov 22, 2010 2:28 am

I still say that I was right about Gil guarding Rip. I said he wouldnt want to chase him around those screens all night and it would eventually wear him down on both ends, espically from a scoring standpoint. If you saw him in the 2nd half he was breathing very hard. He shouldve guarded Stuckey tonight
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Re: Tracking the Defense 

Post#54 » by Induveca » Mon Nov 22, 2010 6:42 am

dlts20 wrote:I still say that I was right about Gil guarding Rip. I said he wouldnt want to chase him around those screens all night and it would eventually wear him down on both ends, espically from a scoring standpoint. If you saw him in the 2nd half he was breathing very hard. He shouldve guarded Stuckey tonight


Agreed, I was confused why they would have a guy getting back in shape chasing around Rip Hamilton and his legendary Reggie Miller like use of screens. Should have put Hinrich on him and let Arenas take Stuckey.

No need for Arenas to be wasting his energy. Stuckey is a much more "drive to the hole" kind of guy, much less running around. Need to blame Flip for this obvious oversight.
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Re: Tracking the Defense 

Post#55 » by Jimmy Recard » Mon Nov 22, 2010 12:21 pm

^^Not to mention Kirk fights through picks as good as any other player in the league imo.
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Re: Tracking the Defense 

Post#56 » by Nivek » Mon Nov 22, 2010 2:53 pm

jimij wrote:I have a question for Kevik regarding our use of the zone defense if he is still doing his in-game tracking of the teams defense. As a team, are the Wiz defending better in zone or in man-to-man?

I feel like one of the reasons we struggle on the boards at times is due to Flips extensive use of zone defenses where players are rotating and thus not always in good position to rebound especially because I feel like we don't play very good zone defense to begin with IMO. I just want to know if what I think I'm seeing is actually born out by the statistics or not.


Sorry, I somehow overlooked this post. I haven't been tracking based on defensive calls. That's something I can do going forward. My sense is that it hasn't mattered a lot what defense they've been in. The zone has been effective at times, and not as effective at others. I'll track it for awhile and see what comes up.

Also: still looking for a copy of the Memphis game, if anyone has it.
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Re: Tracking the Defense 

Post#57 » by jimij » Mon Nov 22, 2010 3:03 pm

Thanks Kev. I'll be interested in the results.

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