For those who Wanted Woody Gone...

[JoshB914]

This was the fairly terrifying alternative all along. All the cries to bring a "proven" and "experienced" coach to replace him were pointless. Our ownership is too cheap to hire an Avery Johnson, and as expected we end up with a random assistant and sink or swim with him. As if often the case, we appear to be sinking.

Larry Drew is the exact same thing Woody was when he started. A first-year head coach who needs to learn on the job thanks to having no experience. That's okay when you're starting a rebuilding period, it isn't when you are setting lofty goals like contending for conference titles.

There was simply no point in firing Mike Woodson if this was the scenario ASG envisioned regarding the coaching. Now we're suffering the consequences for doing so.
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[azuresou1]

Um, this game is disgusting but I've seen worse under Woodson.

We are currently at 8-5, and will likely drop to 8-6, which still puts us on pace for 47 wins, which is right in line with where everyone expected we'd be, if not better.

Larry Drew has been an assistant coach for something like 17 years. Woodson was an assistant for 5 years. There is a huge discrepancy. Furthermore, I don't know how you can list Avery Johnson when the Nets are garbage yet again.

[HoopsGuru25]

The only part I disagree with you on is the last one. They couldn't bring Woodson back after the Orlando series because the team had quit on him. Replacing him with an ever cheaper version while bringing Joe back was extremely stupid though.

[parson]

Josh, Your point seems to be that Woodson had grown as a coach and that Drew is behind his "growth." I think Woodson regressed as a coach. Every year, Woodson sank deeper and deeper into his isolation-based "offense." Please remember that he also began his time with us by installing a motion offense. He didn't develop his players but, rather, wanted only Joe to shoot (he did allow 1-and-a-half guards to go iso, as well). Smoove and Horford are demonstrating what could have been if Woodson had been fired earlier. Yes, I was (apparently) wrong about his effect on Marvin Williams but I've been dead-on about the rest. He did not develop his players; he only wanted to use them as they were. You've got to admit, Drew is, at least, trying to give Teague (and lately, Jo.Crawford) some time.

Woodson became a one-trick pony, a trick his team had memorized so well that they didn't need to listen to him any longer.

[azuresou1]

If you want to be honest, the thing I'm most pissed about right now is LD not sitting the starters right now as a lesson and letting the bench play the entire game.

Unless he's going the opposite route and making them play the entire game as punishment for not giving a **** a la SVG.

[JoshB914]

Parson, Josh Smith didn't develop? His numbers improved every year did they not? Do you really think Drew's schemes are making Josh the player he is now? Or is it just that he's found some semblance of a jump shot? What about the fact that he got career years out of Crawford and Flip? What about that we improved our win total every single year? To say that Woody regressed as an HC is confusing to me because the team most certainly did not.

What happened against Boston in the regular season last year? Of course there is a ways to go and things can change, but anyone who thinks we look more organized or inspired than we did last year is kidding themselves.

I was no Woody fan. But bringing in a guy to coach a supposed 50-win team with such little experience is worse. We can talk about schemes all we want, talk about Woody's dumb iso offense or bizarre "switch everything all the time" defense. But the wins and losses are what matters most, and after a strong start against terrible competition we are starting to look like a 40-45 win team rather than 50.

[azuresou1]

What happened against Boston in the regular season last year? What about what happened in the playoffs last season? The team so blatantly quit on Woodson that it's a wonder he even bothered showing up for the Orlando series.

[JoshB914]

az you're missing the point. I am not defending Woody as an overall HC. I'm just saying that going out an hiring a random assistant coach was basically like starting with Woody all over again like we did in 04. People can throw out all of the "well we quit on him and his offense sucked" hyperbole around all they want. All I know is that my team looks worse so far this year than they did last, and it's the EXACT same team.

[azuresou1]

Well this game we look much worse, sure. What about when we played Orlando vs. last year when we played Orlando? You're telling me we don't look much, much more competitive then?

Larry Drew has an extra 12 years of experience over Woodson did when he first started. That is a world of difference. Plus, Phil Jackson was just 'some random assistant coach' when he took over the Bulls from Doug Collins - and I think we all know how that goes.

[JoshB914]

Come on with the Phil Jackson comparison. That is the exception to the rule. Of course we could get lucky and find a diamond in the rough but that is obviously not something to bank on.

And honestly, does anyone care about experience as an assistant coach? If you look at hiring of "experienced assistants" in the past they turn out in disaster just as often as they do in success.

[Harry10]

i'm okay with Drew. the biggest thing i like about him, is that he is commited in letting the young guys develop and giving them consistent playing time. it is refreshing to see the Hawks letting a guy like Teague go out their and play his game, and not be worried about making mistakes.

I also like the effect Drew has on Josh and Al.

Woody, was just horrible, he would never let the young guys play, and the few times they did play, and if they made a mistake, it was over for them.

I do wish that Drew would allow Jamal to take over games and give him the clear role as the closer.

i wanted Larry Brown, but i think Drew is better than Woody.

[azuresou1]

How many previous HCs were available this offseason that didn't totally blow? Avery Johnson is mediocre and lost his team. Byron Scott is mediocre and lost his team. Doug Collins totally would not work in Atlanta. Vinny Del Negro blows and I could probably run a team better than him. Who else is left?

Eddie Jordan? Hot garbage.
JVG? Retired, not interested in coaching anymore.
Lawrence Frank? Okay coach, not any better than Drew.
Sam Mitchell? Nice guy, terrible coach.

What NBA championship caliber head coach was not once an assistant coach? Why would you want PROVEN failure when you can roll the dice and maybe get lucky?

[evildallas]

I'm not shocked, but still dismayed with the lack of patience around here. The team played like crap tonight and we've not had much of a home court advantage but I'm still willing to give Larry Drew more time before pining for what might have been had we had different ownership or whatever. Let's play a few more games before the freakout.

[parson]

Parson, Josh Smith didn't develop? His numbers improved every year did they not? Do you really think Drew's schemes are making Josh the player he is now? Or is it just that he's found some semblance of a jump shot?

You're ignoring the fact that Woodson and Smoove fought so badly that Smoove (visibly) tuned Woodson out. Josh Smith developed despite Woodson. Remember when Woodson publicly condemned Smoove's jumpers -- but Smoove wouldn't listen?

What about the fact that he got career years out of Crawford and Flip?

While Marvelous and Smoove and Horford stood and watched. JC and Flip played well in ISO offenses, didn't they?

What about that we improved our win total every single year?

We went from Joe to Joe/Smoove/Childress to Joe/Smoove/Childress/Marvelous/ to Joe/Smoove/Childress/Marvelous/Horford to - finally - Joe/Smoove/Marvelous/Horford/Crawford. Gee, think the IMPROVEMENT IN TALENT had much of a difference?

To say that Woody regressed as an HC is confusing to me because the team most certainly did not.

I wrote that Woodson regressed into his ISO-BASED OFFENSE worse and worse each year.

What happened against Boston in the regular season last year? Of course there is a ways to go and things can change, but anyone who thinks we look more organized or inspired than we did last year is kidding themselves. .

I remember hearing TV analysts complain about our lousy ball movement and team play in Woodson's LAST year.

[parson]

I'm not one who thinks that coaches are the most important part of an NBA team -- the players most certainly are.

But I think Woodson had become a negative. I think he was refusing to listen to those who tried to help him by telling him his isolations were stymieing the team. And his insistence on switching on defense was being exploited by everyone.

I think Drew is a solid coach. Honestly, that's all I think anyone can ask: that the coach be competent and not a negative.

To me, the real problem on this team is the lack of leadership on the court in running the offense. WE NEED A PLAYMAKER. It's probably a good thing that I'm not the coach right now because I'd be forcing Jordan Crawford into the backup PG role. The kid has a confidence I really like and that I'd love to see in our PG.

[parson]

I'd also be losing game by playing Teague major minutes. There is no future in Bibby, not even in the playoffs this year.

[killbuckner]

I think that Woodson needed to go- the team needed a change but I also fully expected the team to worse with a new coach. To me its a flawed roster that gives the coach few options and I do think that Woodson did a good job of getting production out of the team. There were so many people who thought that any coach would be an upgrade over Woodson and to me this is just a case of "be careful what you wish for".

ANyway- I'll pull up my prediction from before the season started and I still feel awfully good about most of it.

47-35. First round exit in the playoffs.

The offense takes a big step back and turnovers are a constant issue all season. People blame Woodson for this.

Josh Smith starts shooting more from the outside again as he gets the ball on the outside in the motion offense and just can't help himself. The Hawks crowd starts openly booing everytime he gets the ball outside- instead of him taking the hint he tries to prove everyone wrong. He wins at least 1 game this season by nailing a long outside jumper and in the postgame press conference he talks about how no one believes in him.

Bibby starts over Teague as the offense bogs down when Teague is in the game as teams are content to pack the middle and let the Hawks shoot long jumpshots. Teague looks good in garbage time of some games which causes many people here to still call for him to be the starter. Woodson is blamed for Teague's issues.

Jamal Crawford takes a big step back this season yet continues to complain he hasn't gotten extended even as his numbers regress. He is traded at some point in the season for a veteran PG. Chauncey Billups is traded for expiring contracts plus a pick but the ASG are not willing to pay the tax to bring Billups in.

Marvin reverses the slip he had last season and has something pretty similar to 2 seasons ago. Drew occasionally flirts with a small lineup where Marvin plays some PF. Marvin's reputation finally changes to the point where he is seen as an important roleplayer. Some people still act like he sucks because he isn't better than Chris Paul.

Al Horford takes a lot more long jumpshots this season so he takes a step forward on points per game but his percentages take a step back. He does make the allstar game again this season but people still complain that the Hawks need a center. Horford does not sign an extension before the season starts.

I missed about Horford signing the extension. I missed about Al's percentage of long 2 point shots going down. I don't think that anyone predicted that Josh would start actually making long 2 pointers though in both cases I do think that teams are still more than happy to let those guys shoot long 2 pointers.

Oh- and I have missed so far about Marvin. I thought he was going to finally turn the corner to be seen as a useful roleplayer when guys were making excuses for some losses based on him being out but he just hasn't produced enough this season.