the tyrus thomas puzzle

[fatlever]

40 million for 21 minutes per game?

he puts up stats when he is in the game, but are they empty stats or is he really an impact player?

does he deserve to start over diaw or should he simply be getting more minutes off the bench?

is LB the one keeping his minutes down or is it all on tyrus and his inability to stay out of foul trouble in the first half?

we all talked about how tyrus was a different player now that he was with the bobcats and the bulls fans told us we were nuts. were they right?

did we make a mistake by resigning him?

[countryboi]

tyrus really needs to work on his dibbling he would be nasty with a face up dibble drive....

[Marvel]

The only thing that really puzzles me is his minutes.

[Jaruff]

40 million for 21 minutes per game?

Indeed.

he puts up stats when he is in the game, but are they empty stats or is he really an impact player?

I would say that he's an impact player at times but it's sporadic.

does he deserve to start over diaw or should he simply be getting more minutes off the bench?

No. He can't replicate the things that Diaw does such as ball distribution and the 3pt shot. I think 25mpg is good enough for him.

is LB the one keeping his minutes down or is it all on tyrus and his inability to stay out of foul trouble in the first half?

Probably a bit of both. LB will play guys that he trusts and it's apparent that he doesn't trust Tyrus enough to give him more minutes at this time. Same reason that McGuire grabs minutes over UPS and Kwame over Diop.

we all talked about how tyrus was a different player now that he was with the bobcats and the bulls fans told us we were nuts. were they right?

Probably a bit of both. While LB is a better coach than what he had in Chicago, he's only going to learn so much after being in the league for several years. I've always said that he's lacked BBIQ and that's not something you can improve on much.

did we make a mistake by resigning him?

Yes. We made a mistake by trading for him. He's another example of the stop-gap trades we've done since LB was named coach. He just happens to be younger than the other guys we've traded for.

I hope he proves me wrong but I don't see him putting up starter minutes and being a real contributor on the court every game.

[Battery]

I don't think it's much of a puzzle. Inconsistent player deserves inconsistent minutes. He doesn't deserve more playing time until the message sinks into his head that if he doesn't bring defensive toughness and energy every night, he can't expect to get many minutes. Rewarding players for playing well 1 game out of every 3 does not help the team or the player in the long run.

[BigSlam]

40 million for 21 minutes per game?

I think he was signed for that as a long term investment, not for an immediate return.

he puts up stats when he is in the game, but are they empty stats or is he really an impact player?

I think he is a legit player who can put up stats in real time or in garbage time.

does he deserve to start over diaw or should he simply be getting more minutes off the bench?

Diaw has been maybe our most consistent player this season IMO. No reason for his starting spot to be taken from him. I like the energy that T2 can bring from the bench - but I also think LB has to find ways to play him more meaningful time.

is LB the one keeping his minutes down or is it all on tyrus and his inability to stay out of foul trouble in the first half?

I think there has been only a handful of times where T2 has been in foul trouble in the 1st half - so that tells me it's all about LB - and also match ups. We can't always afford to go small (which bothers me and the long term viability of T2).

we all talked about how tyrus was a different player now that he was with the bobcats and the bulls fans told us we were nuts. were they right?

Nope. He's better than most of them were giving him credit for. They hated him taking jump shots - but guess what? His mid range J is money. I also think he is using his quicks to attack the rim a lot more now too. Heck, he's 2nd on our team in FTA's - and he only plays 21mpg. He's also "Tyson Chandlered" himself here going from a 60's/low 70's something percent foul shooter to a 82.7% free throw shooter.

did we make a mistake by resigning him?

No. But I view him as a tradeable asset than anything else. In saying that, with the right C next to him he might be a keeper.

Like everything, it's all about balance and fit.

[el-mago]

He has JR Smith/T-will type tardiness. Unsurprisingly those guys won't start because they just do not get things done as starters. They make dumb mistakes and their play is sporadic therefore they cannot be trusted. They tend to be ball hogs also (even if that's not the case with Tyrus). Sadly, LB is just playing the better player right now in Diaw. And of course, we should never have traded for him. Another short-sighted move cause we had to make the PO and LB needed a new pet.

[JeremyB0001]

Bulls fan here - I haven't been able to watch Tyrus play yet this season but he's 13th in the NBA in PER so he's been hugely productive. It doesn't surprise me to hear his basketball IQ is still lacking. I'm disappointed by this thread because all I want for Tyrus is a team that accepts him for the player that he is without focusing entirely on his flaws. Based on this thread and his playing time, it seems people are still fixated on the dumb mistakes he sometimes makes. It's a shame because he would really help win games if he got starters' minutes.

[AirP.]

Here's a recent CBSSports.com story on Tyrus and his minutes...

http://www.cbssports.com/mcc/blogs/entr ... 4/26210957

The most minutes Thomas has seen this season is 34. His numbers that night: 26 points, 11 rebounds, three assists and four blocks. In games where Thomas has seen over 25 minutes (four games), he's averaging 22.5 ppg, 8.3 rpg and 2.0 bpg. Thomas has a PER of 23.56, which ranks him 11th in the entire league. And third among power forwards.

I know he can look bad and maybe that's what holds him back, but the guy gets results when he's out there for long periods at a time instead of being jerked off and onto the court. I'd have to guess LB is in teaching mode with Tyrus for the long term.

[Battery]

Here's a recent CBSSports.com story on Tyrus and his minutes...

http://www.cbssports.com/mcc/blogs/entr ... 4/26210957

The most minutes Thomas has seen this season is 34. His numbers that night: 26 points, 11 rebounds, three assists and four blocks. In games where Thomas has seen over 25 minutes (four games), he's averaging 22.5 ppg, 8.3 rpg and 2.0 bpg. Thomas has a PER of 23.56, which ranks him 11th in the entire league. And third among power forwards.

I know he can look bad and maybe that's what holds him back, but the guy gets results when he's out there for long periods at a time instead of being jerked off and onto the court. I'd have to guess LB is in teaching mode with Tyrus for the long term.

Play well and you stay in the game. Play like crap and you get yanked. Real simple philosophy.

[Marvel]

Play well and you stay in the game. Play like crap and you get yanked. Real simple philosophy

I guess McGuire didn't get the "memo".

[captaincrunk]

Here's a recent CBSSports.com story on Tyrus and his minutes...

http://www.cbssports.com/mcc/blogs/entr ... 4/26210957

The most minutes Thomas has seen this season is 34. His numbers that night: 26 points, 11 rebounds, three assists and four blocks. In games where Thomas has seen over 25 minutes (four games), he's averaging 22.5 ppg, 8.3 rpg and 2.0 bpg. Thomas has a PER of 23.56, which ranks him 11th in the entire league. And third among power forwards.

I know he can look bad and maybe that's what holds him back, but the guy gets results when he's out there for long periods at a time instead of being jerked off and onto the court. I'd have to guess LB is in teaching mode with Tyrus for the long term.

Play well and you stay in the game. Play like crap and you get yanked. Real simple philosophy.

Exactly. He plays l,ike crap, he's taken out.. He's playing well? He gets to 25 minutes or more.

But I do think he can play well consistently. Just not all the time. Oh, wait...

[captaincrunk]

I've changed my mind. I want Tyrus and Kwame starting over Diaw and Mohammed.

[therebirth]

LB in April of 2009 "If he(Tyrus) does not develope, its on me"

[JeremyB0001]

Play well and you stay in the game. Play like crap and you get yanked. Real simple philosophy.

Is that what's happening though? If LB was handing out playing time based on merit alone, there's no way Diaw (12.9 PER) would be logging nearly twice as many minutes as Tyrus (22.4 PER). Instead, I imagine it's the same as it's always been for Tyrus: his coach is handing out playing time based not on who plays best but on who makes the fewest mistakes.

[Jaruff]

Play well and you stay in the game. Play like crap and you get yanked. Real simple philosophy.

Is that what's happening though? If LB was handing out playing time based on merit alone, there's no way Diaw (12.9 PER) would be logging nearly twice as many minutes as Tyrus (22.4 PER). Instead, I imagine it's the same as it's always been for Tyrus: his coach is handing out playing time based not on who plays best but on who makes the fewest mistakes.

PER can't compute the importance of having Diaw on the court. I doubt that Tyrus could run the offense like Diaw can and that's why Diaw receives the heavy minutes every game. In our system, the offense usually runs through Diaw or Jackson. That's how Larry does things.

Tyrus works well as a spot starter when you can keep Diaw in the starting lineup but you can't do that against every opponent. That's why Tyrus continues to play 20 minutes each game and Diaw is getting 35-40. In a different scheme with a different coach, Tyrus is probably playing 30+mpg.

[daidalos]

We should give T2 starter minutes. After his extensions I assume he is our future pf, so we should treat him like that regarding PT sooner than later

[AirP.]

It's quite amazing that Tyrus seems to be the only player I've seen for a while who doesn't get to play through his mistakes like everyone else does. I understand when he does bad he looks really bad, but what's the difference if the output is the same? A missed shot is a missed shot.

I just don't get it.. in the minutes he's getting he's putting up a pace of 20 points, 10 rebounds and 3 blocks in 36 minutes(starter minutes) while Diaw plays at a pace to put up 13 pts and 5 rebs in 36 minutes... I know... Tyrus is only shooting 51% while Boris is shooting 52%.

It's just odd how Tyrus keeps putting up solid overall numbers yet coaches won't utilize him. I do remember Chicago HAVING to play Tyrus big minutes for a 2-3 week stretch and the team won almost all of those games with him putting up nearly 18 and 10 the whole time. My guess, is that since he does look HORRIBLE shooting, even though it's the same as any other miss, it stands out in coach's/fans minds since it did look so horrible(and he looks absolutely horrible sometimes).

[Rich4114]

Tyrus should be the starter. You don't pay the guy starting PF money to use him sparingly, especially when you sacrificed your starting PG for it. Find a way to move Diaw if you don't want to pay two guys that much for one position. Give him away for free if you can.

Tyrus has at times, been our best player. Guys like Derrick Brown have looked really good too. Not sure why inferior guys get a bulk of the minutes now (D. Mcguire and Diaw).

[captaincrunk]

Tyrus should be the starter. You don't pay the guy starting PF money to use him sparingly, especially when you sacrificed your starting PG for it. Find a way to move Diaw if you don't want to pay two guys that much for one position. Give him away for free if you can.

Tyrus has at times, been our best player. Guys like Derrick Brown have looked really good too. Not sure why inferior guys get a bulk of the minutes now (D. Mcguire and Diaw).

To be fair, Diaw gets paid more than Tyrus. Also, Diaw is better than Brown and helps the offense a lot. Though DJ has been improving leaps and bounds in that area.