Shaq/Wade vs. TD/Kobe

[jaypo]

Ok. I lied. I can't stay away!

Final statement- if you can show me an example of me hating on Kobe, I'll retract everything I've said since I started posting here. But I want an example of me hating on him. Not me posting something that he did wrong. I'll bet you 100 bucks that you can't! Because I don't hate him at all! And you saying that you know how I really feel does not count. So go find an example of me hating on Kobe.

You really have no understanding that just because you post something that a player did that was bad doesn't mean you're hating. If that was the case, everything you say can be interpreted as "hating on Shaq". You do a lot more "hating" than I do. So the challenge is laid down, brutha! Show me some hate that I've posted. I dare ya!

[jaypo]

Chosen1- I disagree. Shaq dove into the scorer's table and hurt his ass while playing on a bad knee. The Heat staff misdiagnosed his injury. So he hurt himself on a hustle play while playing on a bad knee. I wouldn't exactly call that "quitting on a team".

Somewhat, If you remember Shaq and RIley had some beef and criticized him for making him play with teammates in Quinn and Ricky, either way Shaq wasn't happy/motivated, I guess wouldn't blame him too much, he obviously proved he still had some left when he played in PHX.

He and Shaq almost came to blows at practice. After the season, Riley admitted that he failed the team as GM for letting the good shooters and defenders walk and not bringing in any talent to put around Wade and Shaq. Shaq said after he was traded that "Phoenix isn't asking me to carry Quinn and Davis", or something like that. And he was 100% correct. The problems started when Wade and Riley started making comments in the media about Shaq not being able to carry the team, even though Wade was out the whole season, Zo was out, Walker and JWill were out, Haslem was out, and Chris Quinn was the starting PG. And SHaq was playing on 1 leg and hurt himself diving for a ball, yet the media was saying he was washed up. Shaq was pissed that Wade was commenting about SHaq being paid big bucks so he should be doing better. And it carried over to the offseason. But Riley did admit that he screwed up by not putting the right players around Shaq and Wade.

[Vincent 666]

Ok. I lied. I can't stay away!

Final statement- if you can show me an example of me hating on Kobe, I'll retract everything I've said since I started posting here. But I want an example of me hating on him. Not me posting something that he did wrong. I'll bet you 100 bucks that you can't! Because I don't hate him at all! And you saying that you know how I really feel does not count. So go find an example of me hating on Kobe.

You really have no understanding that just because you post something that a player did that was bad doesn't mean you're hating. If that was the case, everything you say can be interpreted as "hating on Shaq". You do a lot more "hating" than I do. So the challenge is laid down, brutha! Show me some hate that I've posted. I dare ya!

its the way you spin and rewrite history.

Just one of the top of my head like you claiming that the nurse said the rape exam was consistent with rape when she testified in court that it couldnt be determined because of the fact that she showed up to the exam with the semen of other men on her.

That just one example. There are many many others. Its not like its just me whos called you out for being a kobe hater.

I dont see how the way you analyze Kobes actions is any different than someone claiming Shaq sabotaged the 04 finals with his play. Same type of logic.

[jaypo]

So now, because a bunch of people that have never met me call me a Kobe hater, that makes it true? That wouldn't happen to be because you and those guys are Kobe fans, would it? I don't "spin" what Kobe did at all. I just put it in writing. I don't have to spin it. What he did speaks for itself! Like you guys trying to justify his actions in Eagle, CO! At absolute BEST, he is a multiple time adulterer. That is from his own mouth. There is no need to "spin" any of it.

Secondly, the initial response to the rape exam was that she had "injuries consistent with rape". But having other semen on you does not render those findings wrong.

How can you possibly link purposely refusing to shoot just to prove a point to a reporter that criticized your shot selection to "only" averaging 26.6 ppg and 10.8 rpg against the league's best rebounder at the time and NOT think that it is (Please Use More Appropriate Word) logic? One was done purposely to prove a point. The other was not. And to say that he had a horrible series for ONLY averaging 10.8 rpg is just as (Please Use More Appropriate Word). What about Kobe's fg% during that entire series? Wanna talk about that??? Could the outcome of that series have anything to do with Kobe shooting a whopping 38% from the field? Noooo, surely it was Shaq ONLY shooting 63%, but ONLY averaging 10.8 rpg. Oh, it was only because he had 1 monster game, right??? And you claim that I am the one rewriting history?????? You're worse off than I thought!

So, I'm still waiting for an example of me hating on Kobe. Are you gonna show me one, or not??

[Vincent 666]

[Vincent 666]

At absolute BEST, he is a multiple time adulterer. That is from his own mouth. There is no need to "spin" any of it.

So was Shaq

Secondly, the initial response to the rape exam was that she had "injuries consistent with rape".

Wrong. As usual.

But having other semen on you does not render those findings wrong.

Apparently it does because the nurse testified to it in court. Not surprising that you are getting your facts wrong, again.

How can you possibly link purposely refusing to shoot just to prove a point to a reporter that criticized your shot selection to "only" averaging 26.6 ppg and 10.8 rpg against the league's best rebounder at the time and NOT think that it is (Please Use More Appropriate Word) logic? One was done purposely to prove a point. The other was not.

And to say that he had a horrible series for ONLY averaging 10.8 rpg is just as (Please Use More Appropriate Word).

Do you understand the difference between a series average and looking at what a player did in specific games?

What about Kobe's fg% during that entire series? Wanna talk about that??? Could the outcome of that series have anything to do with Kobe shooting a whopping 38% from the field?

Ive never claimed that Kobe wasnt at fault for the Lakers losing that series. You're the one who cant seem to accept Shaqs poor defensive showing that series. Both were reasons for the loss along with injuries.

What I dont understand is why Kobe having a bad offensive series mean that he was "selfish' and that he "sabotaged" the finals. Why cant Kobe just have had a bad offensive series and leave it at that? Thats what makes you a hater.

Noooo, surely it was Shaq ONLY shooting 63%, but ONLY averaging 10.8 rpg. Oh, it was only because he had 1 monster game, right??? And you claim that I am the one rewriting history?????? You're worse off than I thought!

Again, Shaqs had 3 total blocks for the series. His rebounding numbers in games 2,3 and 5 speak for themselves. I guess Shaq was selfish and tried to sabotage the finals. Maybe he was following through on his threat not to rebound and defend if he didnt get the ball?

So, I'm still waiting for an example of me hating on Kobe. Are you gonna show me one, or not??

[Andrewchos]

Your a joke, no one blamed Shaq's defense for them losing that series, trying to do so now is purely revisionist history. The Pistons were a perimeter oriented team and rarely drove into the paint so obviously Shaq didn't have a chance to block many shots.

Shaq was beyond amazing in pretty much every series in the 04 playoffs from dominating Duncan down in SA to dominating B.Wallace in DTroit, please don't blame him when he was the main reason they got to the Finals in the first place and was the only player in the LA VS Detroit series that didn't play like a D-Leaguer .

They lost that series because of injury's to key players, horrible defense by Payton, and horrendous / selfish play by Kube (20/2/2 37FG%)

[initiald]

The thought of Kobe/Duncan together makes people wonder what coulda, woulda, shoulda been. This is a beautiful duo. It's like you take a current prime Kobe + Gasol on steroid and put them together on a team. The past-prime Kobe + lesser version of Duncan went to the Final 3 times, won 2. I can't see how people can say no to this combo.

That's how I feel. And honestly, Gasol is a great player, but I don't think it's him on steroids even. It's just a guy who's in a whole other league. Honestly, everything Gasol can do, prime Duncan did better. Post up (footwork, low post scoring, forcing the defense to collapse), pass, rebound, put the other team's bigs in foul trouble, maybe even the midrange jumpshot. He was more clutch too. And I purposely didn't even touch defense, prime Duncan was on another planet defensively.

[/Duncan homer rant]

Yeah, there is too many things going right for Kobe/Duncan duo to ignore. Seriously, I can't find any weakness in this duo. What's in their offensive game that is a weakness that opposing teams can exploited? And defensively as well? None!

Kobe on the perimeter and Duncan on the inside. Or Kobe in the post, Duncan in the perimeter to knock down those pass out shot. It's too perfect!

Then if you're talking about defensively, Kobe locking down his man in crunch time with Duncan supreme anchor ability? Unbelievable!

Not only that, but think about the chemistry of these two. Both are hard workers, one like the spotlight while the other don't. However both come into the game playing at a high level all the times. Their teammates respect them for their preparation and dedication to the details. Also the spacing that these two can generated for their teammates, unlike the combo of Shaq/Wade. Shaq clocks up the paint, forcing Wade to be a perimeter shooter, which is clearly not his game.

Kobe/Duncan duo is the best duo in 00s decade that you can think of.

[yongaz]

i've only read like 3 pages... why was I not surprised by the same old posters posting the same old **** with the same old arguments?

but hey every player has their haters and homers so like whatever. that's what a basketball forum is for... to read each other's opinions, however disagreeable or stupid they might seem.

One thing that annoys me as hell though - it's Andrewchos continually saying he posts "facts" while everyone else's is opinion. I'm backseat modding here (and looking to get a warning even, but hey I gotta say it)... his "facts" are as much opinion as everyone else's so why is he allowed to continue saying **** like that? Not only that, he continues to lump people who argue against him as ballboys and Kobe homers and what not. Isn't that bannable / suspension-worthy?

Just grow some balls and admit that you dislike Kobe.

[Andrewchos]

#1. When I post Fact's I can call them Facts, there is nothing wrong with that.
#2. Your not a "mod" or in a position to warn or judge anyone but thats funny.
#3. When someone says a Duo that never existed would be "this" and would be "that" I can call it opinions because thats what they are "opinions" maybe you just dont understand what the word opinion means.
#4. I have nothing against Kobe I just judge him fairly and subjectively. I see what he accomplished and what his court impact actually was not what Kobe "Fan's" pretend it was.

I haven't called anyone personally a BBoy or a Homer so please don't lie and or put words in my mouth. Im a mature adult and have no reason to flame or attack other posters, I simply express my opinions and move on.

[The_Purple_Tape]

You called me a ball boy.

[Andrewchos]

[LascelleL]

Wow....Im exhausted from reading all this ****...same **** over and over again.

[Andrewchos]

I know, these threads would actually be decent if the same 4-5 overzealous LA fans didn't ruin them everytime.

[yongaz]

#1. When I post Fact's I can call them Facts, there is nothing wrong with that.
#2. Your not a "mod" or in a position to warn or judge anyone but thats funny.
#3. When someone says a Duo that never existed would be "this" and would be "that" I can call it opinions because thats what they are "opinions" maybe you just dont understand what those words mean.
#4. I have nothing against Kobe I just judge him fairly and subjectively. I see what he accomplished and what his court impact actually was not what Kobe "Fan's" pretend it was.

#1. I can easily pull out 10 posts where your facts are just as much opinion as the others that you've called opinions. Not going to bother because I really cbf. anyone with half a brain can see it.
#2. I never said I was a mod... I even admitted to backseat modding and potentially getting a warning. You're the only hater I'm calling out because you're the only doing what you're doing. As I've said, haters will always be haters and they'll always be around, but you really take the cake. I suppose congratulations is in order.
#3. Again, see #1.
#4. Like I said, grow some balls.

I haven't called anyone personally a BBoy or a Homer so please don't lie and or put words in my mouth. Im a mature adult and have no reason to flame or attack other posters, I simply express my opinions and move on.

I really think the Mods are keeping you around for entertainment purposes, even though you do make every Shaq and Kobe thread essentially unreadable.

[Andrewchos]

Translation : I hate you, grow some balls.

Reality : Pretty much everything I said occurred and was documented so yes they are "facts", the fact that I don't rate Bryant as highly as you do is not a good reason to flame or attack me and you should be suspended or warned for this sort of repeated behavior.

There were about 10-12 people in this Thread that had the exact same opinion that I shared and posted it, so why exactly do you single me out? is it because your immature and just dont like me? Yea im pretty sure thats why.

[yongaz]

oh and for the record, since you're so adept at going around and editing all your posts all the time (and not just in this thread too)

continue on to a smarter realgm experience.

Haha, not if your a part of it.

I'm very glad I wont have to hear anymore BS/Fanboy talk from you two ballboys, thanks.

[yongaz]

Translation : I hate you, grow some balls.

Reality : Pretty much everything I said occurred and was documented so yes they are "facts", the fact that I don't rate Bryant as highly as you do is not a good reason to flame or attack me and you should be suspended or warned for this sort of repeated behavior.

Right.

[Andrewchos]

Yea after they both flamed me for saying Shaq/Wade would be > Duncan/Kobe and called me a Troll I put them both on my ignore list and called them Ballboys. I never denied it.

You need to get a.... seriously.

No one is going to warn/suspend me for expressing my opinions especially when its clear they are logical and based on concrete evidence and 10-12 other posters agreed with me and posted the exact same opinions.

Just admit you have a personal beef with me because I dont love your "idol" Kobe and rate him subjectively like I would any other player I am not a personal fan of.

[Father Time]

I know, these threads would actually be decent if the same 4-5 overzealous LA fans didn't ruin them everytime.

Seems like you kind of ruin them every time...