Rumor from Bulls Board: Webster
Moderators: Domejandro, Worm Guts, Calinks
Re: Rumor from Bulls Board: Webster
- revprodeji
- Retired Mod
- Posts: 22,388
- And1: 8
- Joined: Dec 25, 2002
- Location: Freedom consists not in doing what we like, but in having the right to do what we ought
- Contact:
Re: Rumor from Bulls Board: Webster
Horace, that was a couple years ago. That video you are citing has Rambis calling Johnson a top-5 pick. Not "the type we need". See if you can find the video.
Shrink---Who honestly thinks we overpaid for Webster? Babbitt is doing nothing and Gomes was cut and still on the Portland books.
Shrink---Who honestly thinks we overpaid for Webster? Babbitt is doing nothing and Gomes was cut and still on the Portland books.
http://www.timetoshop.org
Weight management, Sports nutrition and more...
Weight management, Sports nutrition and more...
Re: Rumor from Bulls Board: Webster
- Krapinsky
- RealGM
- Posts: 20,712
- And1: 1,952
- Joined: May 13, 2007
- Location: Los Angeles
Re: Rumor from Bulls Board: Webster
shrink wrote:revprodeji wrote:Kahn was quoted saying he thought Johnson was a top-5 talent.
Webster is Rambis' pick.
Rumor has it that Kahn was paying his own way into Blazer games to watch Webster play.
The majority of non-MIN views (and me) say Kahn overpaid on Webster.
If you agreed with the majority of non-MIN views about anything regarding the Timberwolves then you would also think Beasley is a cancer, Rubio isn't coming to MN, and Darko is incredibly overpaid.
FinnTheHuman wrote: Your post is just garbage.
NewWolvesOrder wrote:Garbage post, indeed.
Re: Rumor from Bulls Board: Webster
- horaceworthy
- Head Coach
- Posts: 6,650
- And1: 250
- Joined: Jan 17, 2006
- Location: Ruining Fuddrucker's for everyone
Re: Rumor from Bulls Board: Webster
revprodeji wrote:Horace, that was a couple years ago. That video you are citing has Rambis calling Johnson a top-5 pick. Not "the type we need". See if you can find the video.
Shrink---Who honestly thinks we overpaid for Webster? Babbitt is doing nothing and Gomes was cut and still on the Portland books.
No, it was Kahn saying Johnson was the type of talent we need. I don't recall Rambis speaking at all. Or was that just a typo there and you meant to write Kahn, since that was the original claim?
It might have been talent to be "a top player from this draft", but I don't recall Kahn calling JJ a top 5 pick.
I checked the MNWolves youtube account back to about a year ago, saw some of the videos shown during that game, (Dwyane Wade on the Wolves, Kobe Bryant on the Wolves, Magic Johnson on the Wolves, etc.), but didn't see the one from the draft room. Is that the place where you saw the quote you're referencing, or did you see it somewhere else?
The really unfortunate thing is that they don't have the Bill Walton video. The King of Hyperbole made some hilarious statements during that one, calling Kahn a "visionary leader" and saying that Rambis was "cut from the same fabric as the great coaches of our time," etc. I'm really disappointed that those statements will likely be lost to the sands of time forever.
"A while back,'' Cardinal said, "I took a picture of the standings and texted it to Love, just to bust his chops,'' Cardinal said. "He sent me a picture back of a snowdrift.''
Re: Rumor from Bulls Board: Webster
- horaceworthy
- Head Coach
- Posts: 6,650
- And1: 250
- Joined: Jan 17, 2006
- Location: Ruining Fuddrucker's for everyone
Re: Rumor from Bulls Board: Webster
Krapinsky wrote:shrink wrote:revprodeji wrote:Kahn was quoted saying he thought Johnson was a top-5 talent.
Webster is Rambis' pick.
Rumor has it that Kahn was paying his own way into Blazer games to watch Webster play.
The majority of non-MIN views (and me) say Kahn overpaid on Webster.
If you agreed with the majority of non-MIN views about anything regarding the Timberwolves then you would also think Beasley is a cancer, Rubio isn't coming to MN, and Darko is incredibly overpaid.
Shrink was pretty vocal about that one for awhile. He may very well still be waiting for the other shoe to drop.
I hated the Webster trade when it was made, but not for the same reasons shrink did. I didn't see much value in the Gomes contract, but I really wanted some Dominique Jones. I came around a bit when I hit up Synergy for some Webster video, but I've really come around since getting to see him play in a Wolves uni.
"A while back,'' Cardinal said, "I took a picture of the standings and texted it to Love, just to bust his chops,'' Cardinal said. "He sent me a picture back of a snowdrift.''
Re: Rumor from Bulls Board: Webster
-
- RealGM
- Posts: 59,292
- And1: 19,304
- Joined: Sep 26, 2005
Re: Rumor from Bulls Board: Webster
Krapinsky wrote:shrink wrote:revprodeji wrote:Kahn was quoted saying he thought Johnson was a top-5 talent.
Webster is Rambis' pick.
Rumor has it that Kahn was paying his own way into Blazer games to watch Webster play.
The majority of non-MIN views (and me) say Kahn overpaid on Webster.
If you agreed with the majority of non-MIN views about anything regarding the Timberwolves then you would also think Beasley is a cancer, Rubio isn't coming to MN, and Darko is incredibly overpaid.
If you dismiss them all, then you provide me with an unsupportable position.
Do you guys really disagree that the majority of non-MIN views say we overpaid, or do you disagree that while they said it, they are wrong?
Re: Rumor from Bulls Board: Webster
-
- RealGM
- Posts: 59,292
- And1: 19,304
- Joined: Sep 26, 2005
Re: Rumor from Bulls Board: Webster
horaceworthy wrote:Krapinsky wrote: ... then you would also think Beasley is a cancer, Rubio isn't coming to MN, and Darko is incredibly overpaid.
Shrink was pretty vocal about that one for awhile. He may very well still be waiting for the other shoe to drop.
Yep, but I was in favor of the deal. You can't pass on the potential upside at that low price, even if I didn't think Beasley would ever achieve it, from what I'd seen him do with his life to that point. I've been excited, but I am still a little worried. Call me cautiously optimistic now.
And I would also like to point out that even though I haven't agreed with some of Kahn's moves, I gave him credit for the Beasley trade. Not because it's so complex -- it's a no-brainer that we offer cap space for Beasley so MIA could get their big three. No, he gets credit for not offering more than he did, and he gets credit for doing the early legwork. If rumors are true, he was one of the first to make that offer, and that allowed the Heat to talk to the agents with that deal in theeir backpocket, saying to LeBron "Yes, if you come here, we really can get Bosh too -- let me show you how."
Re: Rumor from Bulls Board: Webster
- horaceworthy
- Head Coach
- Posts: 6,650
- And1: 250
- Joined: Jan 17, 2006
- Location: Ruining Fuddrucker's for everyone
Re: Rumor from Bulls Board: Webster
Yeah, I know you were approving of the deal after it was made, just saying that there was awhile where you couldn't resist tossing some snark in Beasley's direction.
"A while back,'' Cardinal said, "I took a picture of the standings and texted it to Love, just to bust his chops,'' Cardinal said. "He sent me a picture back of a snowdrift.''
Re: Rumor from Bulls Board: Webster
- revprodeji
- Retired Mod
- Posts: 22,388
- And1: 8
- Joined: Dec 25, 2002
- Location: Freedom consists not in doing what we like, but in having the right to do what we ought
- Contact:
Re: Rumor from Bulls Board: Webster
Sorry Horace, I meant Kahn. We had not yet hired Rambis (I wish, draft would be much different).
http://www.canishoopus.com/2010/3/22/13 ... oopus-open
I know it is Canis, but someone else makes the "top-5" reference.
We need to find the video clip. It sticks out in my mind because I was like "whaaaaaaaaat"
http://www.canishoopus.com/2010/3/22/13 ... oopus-open
I know it is Canis, but someone else makes the "top-5" reference.
We need to find the video clip. It sticks out in my mind because I was like "whaaaaaaaaat"
http://www.timetoshop.org
Weight management, Sports nutrition and more...
Weight management, Sports nutrition and more...
Re: Rumor from Bulls Board: Webster
- horaceworthy
- Head Coach
- Posts: 6,650
- And1: 250
- Joined: Jan 17, 2006
- Location: Ruining Fuddrucker's for everyone
Re: Rumor from Bulls Board: Webster
I don't take Calvin Booth seriously.
I wish the clip were readily available too, although I think it would be more important to find the Walton video. That was classic. We both saw the same draft room video and agree it shows he liked Jim John, there's just a slight discrepancy over the exact wording he used.
By the way, does anybody have league pass and have they caught any Sacto games? I heard Walton was announcing some. The Kings suck but between Walton and Kayte Christensen they'd probably be watchable.
I wish the clip were readily available too, although I think it would be more important to find the Walton video. That was classic. We both saw the same draft room video and agree it shows he liked Jim John, there's just a slight discrepancy over the exact wording he used.
By the way, does anybody have league pass and have they caught any Sacto games? I heard Walton was announcing some. The Kings suck but between Walton and Kayte Christensen they'd probably be watchable.
"A while back,'' Cardinal said, "I took a picture of the standings and texted it to Love, just to bust his chops,'' Cardinal said. "He sent me a picture back of a snowdrift.''
Re: Rumor from Bulls Board: Webster
-
- RealGM
- Posts: 59,292
- And1: 19,304
- Joined: Sep 26, 2005
Re: Rumor from Bulls Board: Webster
revprodeji wrote:Shrink---Who honestly thinks we overpaid for Webster? Babbitt is doing nothing and Gomes was cut and still on the Portland books.
K is right that there is some amount of anti-Kahn bias, but I think most sportswriters would rather say something that they think is correct. I googled for analysis of the trade, and here's the results from the biggest national sources:
What really makes this draft terrible for Minnesota was the trade of their #15 pick (Luke Babbit) and Ryan Gomes for Martell Webster. Gomes for Webster was a lateral move at best and giving up their #15 pick in the process was the final layer of insanity.
The Blazers fetched Babbitt at No. 16 and Gomes from Minnesota in the trade of Webster. Yes, five years earlier, Webster was a No. 6 overall pick, but that was perhaps a bit of sentimental reach for a Seattle 18-year-old. A drop of 10 spots isn't too bad for someone who has been as inconsistent and injured as Webster.That said, if he can healthy and play regularly in Minnesota, his numbers are bound to look better, because his main skill remains his ability to shoot and score.
Listen, I even like Martell Webster(notes). Think highly of him. But to cash in Ryan Gomes' desirable contract and the 16th pick on Webster?
The confusing move was the decision to trade the No. 16 pick (Luke Babbitt) and Ryan Gomes to Portland for Martell Webster. Babbitt should be better than Webster by himself, and if they didn't like him, there were plenty of other good options available
The trade that sent Babbitt and Ryan Gomes to Portland for Martell Webster was awful.
That was a terrible move.
The head scratcher was the Wolves' decision to trade the 16th pick and Ryan Gomes for Martell Webster. The Wolves not only gave up two significant assets (Gomes' contract wasn't guaranteed, which made it valuable), but Webster has been marginal in his career so far.
Apparently conducting the draft despite his lame-duck status, Pritchard pulled off one last deal, trading Martell Webster to Minnesota in exchange for Ryan Gomes and the No. 16 pick. Getting out of Webster's contract by picking up Gomes, whose salary is only partially guaranteed over the next two seasons if he's waived by July 1 (see Sham Sports for details), is nice on its own merits. To also be able to add a mid-first-round pick is impressive stuff.
Did you expect David Kahn to let us down? Through 16 picks he looked like a genius, taking Johnson and Luke Babbitt, after that he was at it again. Trading Babbitt for Portland’s Martell Webster, ending up with a second round guy at No. 30 and three European prospects that likely will never come over. It seemed like Minnesota had all the cards in their hands this year; multiple picks and a number of trade assets
Minnesota Timberwolves Receive: Martell Webster
Portland Trail Blazers Receive: Luke Babbit and Ryan Gomes
Analysis: Martell Webster never panned out in Portland and it was time for a change of scenery. In return they get two solid forwards that can play both positions. As a veteran Gomes should be able to step in and contribute right away, while Babbit will take a little bit more time. The Blazers got great value for a player who ultimately never came into his own for them
Top 5 Biggest Draft Losers
2. Minnesota Timberwolves
The Wolves got their man Wesley Johnson at No. 4, but other than that, their Draft was a disaster. They took Luke Babbitt at No. 16 then traded him along with solid bench player Ryan Gomes to Portland for the oft-injured Martell Webster.
Maybe I missed somebody, but I didn't see anyone who thought MIN didn't overpay trading for Webster.
Re: Rumor from Bulls Board: Webster
- Esohny
- RealGM
- Posts: 11,613
- And1: 339
- Joined: Apr 18, 2009
- Location: Saint Paul
-
Re: Rumor from Bulls Board: Webster
Except the arguments were pretty poor at the time, because they assumed that Babbitt was going to be good, despite the fact that he never looked special at all.
SMAC-K wrote:Mayo>>>>Love and that 5th pick
OJ Mayo is one of the best defenders in the league, hes a two way player and hes a great passer and playmaker.
Re: Rumor from Bulls Board: Webster
- horaceworthy
- Head Coach
- Posts: 6,650
- And1: 250
- Joined: Jan 17, 2006
- Location: Ruining Fuddrucker's for everyone
Re: Rumor from Bulls Board: Webster
It would be helpful/interesting to see where the quotes came from.
Also, rev was speaking with the benefit of hindsight. Given that POR couldn't/didn't find a taker for Gomes and Babbitt hasn't exactly set the world on fire, it's tough to say Minnesota overpaid, despite the 6 month old opinions of the talking heads.
Also, rev was speaking with the benefit of hindsight. Given that POR couldn't/didn't find a taker for Gomes and Babbitt hasn't exactly set the world on fire, it's tough to say Minnesota overpaid, despite the 6 month old opinions of the talking heads.
"A while back,'' Cardinal said, "I took a picture of the standings and texted it to Love, just to bust his chops,'' Cardinal said. "He sent me a picture back of a snowdrift.''
Re: Rumor from Bulls Board: Webster
-
- General Manager
- Posts: 7,741
- And1: 1,177
- Joined: Jan 02, 2008
- Location: St. Paul
Re: Rumor from Bulls Board: Webster
Shrink, perhaps we should emphasize "does any STILL think we overpaid?"
I think a lot of us were upset at the time it happened, but Babbitt hasn't done squat, Portland did nothing special with Gomes contract, and Webster has proven to be a more effective player.
I think a lot of us were upset at the time it happened, but Babbitt hasn't done squat, Portland did nothing special with Gomes contract, and Webster has proven to be a more effective player.
Lattimer wrote:Cracks me up that people still think that Wiggins will be involved in the trade for Love. Wolves are out of their mind if they think they are getting Wiggins for Love.
Re: Rumor from Bulls Board: Webster
-
- RealGM
- Posts: 59,292
- And1: 19,304
- Joined: Sep 26, 2005
Re: Rumor from Bulls Board: Webster
I hear what you're saying, but I think we still overpaid.
If we spent $500 of confederate money in 1860 on a piece of candy, that doesn't mean we didn't overpay because confederate money has no value now. We could have spent that money on other better assets, so its a lost opportunity cost.
I continue to maintain that was certainly too much to pay POR for Webster, who was going in a different direction. People are welcome to disagree.
If we spent $500 of confederate money in 1860 on a piece of candy, that doesn't mean we didn't overpay because confederate money has no value now. We could have spent that money on other better assets, so its a lost opportunity cost.
I continue to maintain that was certainly too much to pay POR for Webster, who was going in a different direction. People are welcome to disagree.
Return to Minnesota Timberwolves