Chicken Littles: Sky done fell! Draft Thread 2011

The Consiglieri · Post #241 » by **The Consiglieri** » Thu Jan 6, 2011 6:30 pm

That is definitely bad news, we'd need to really suck, and not have any teams jump in to be sure of landing one of the genuine difference makers come draft day. Quite scary, right now we appear locked in as one of the four worst teams in the league, but that still means with bad luck, we could pick as low as 7th. Way out of zone for the players we'd want. And the Wiz have been the hardest hit team in terms of draft day luck ever until last spring (and personally, one lucky lottery doesn't delete 25 years of horrible luck in the lottery).

If we got hosed, and say picked in the 6-10 range in a draft that didn't have Barnes, or Irving, who would be the most attractive guys in terms of athleticism+Projectable talent+Need? I see Chris Singleton (who is still seen as a late first in some quarters) and who do you guys like best among those guys?

Post #242 » by **Ruzious** » Thu Jan 6, 2011 6:53 pm

The Consiglieri wrote:That is definitely bad news, we'd need to really suck, and not have any teams jump in to be sure of landing one of the genuine difference makers come draft day. Quite scary, right now we appear locked in as one of the four worst teams in the league, but that still means with bad luck, we could pick as low as 7th. Way out of zone for the players we'd want. And the Wiz have been the hardest hit team in terms of draft day luck ever until last spring (and personally, one lucky lottery doesn't delete 25 years of horrible luck in the lottery).

If we got hosed, and say picked in the 6-10 range in a draft that didn't have Barnes, or Irving, who would be the most attractive guys in terms of athleticism+Projectable talent+Need? I see Chris Singleton (who is still seen as a late first in some quarters) and who do you guys like best among those guys?

This is a draft where I'd almost rather slip past the top 3. You know me - I think Singleton is the single best fit in the draft for us, but there are other players who might be good fits. Valanciunas could easily end up being the best player in the draft. He's just so young that we don't know how he'll fill out and how his skills will develop. And Derrick Williams could be the best scoring forward in the draft- maybe better than Terrence Jones will be. Yes, he's a tweener, but so is Jones.

Hoopalotta · Post #243 » by **Hoopalotta** » Fri Jan 7, 2011 11:29 pm

Kanter has been ruled permanently intelligible and will have to come out in next year's draft:

Ok, Ok, 'ineligible', but I was just enjoying the malapropisms so very mush.....

LEXINGTON, Ky. -- Kentucky freshman center Enes Kanter has been ruled permanently ineligible by the NCAA for a second time.

The NCAA Student-Athlete Reinstatement Committee on Friday upheld an earlier NCAA decision that deemed Kanter received more than $33,000 in impermissible benefits while playing for a Turkish club team two years ago.

"We were informed by the NCAA that the flexible decisions made by the NCAA staff in other high-profile cases could not be used in case precedent and were not binding on the NCAA going forward," Kentucky AD Mitch Barnhart said. "The University of Kentucky was very hopeful that our student-athlete might receive the same type of consideration afforded to these other athletes but that did not happen."

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/news/story?id=6000134

Say what you will about the NCAA, but this is good news for our selfish interests. :devil:

Post #244 » by **LyricalRico** » Sat Jan 8, 2011 12:46 am

Kanter's NCAA career is over, eh? I wonder if that will help or hurt him. On the one hand, teams will have a smaller sample size to evaluate meaning he's more of an unknown. But sometimes the mystery can work in a guy's favor, especially if he wows in workouts. He's currently in the Top 5 in lots of mocks, so he's got more to lose than gain as far as draft position.

doclinkin · Post #245 » by **doclinkin** » Sat Jan 8, 2011 5:55 am

LyricalRico wrote:Kanter's NCAA career is over, eh? I wonder if that will help or hurt him. On the one hand, teams will have a smaller sample size to evaluate meaning he's more of an unknown. But sometimes the mystery can work in a guy's favor, especially if he wows in workouts. He's currently in the Top 5 in lots of mocks, so he's got more to lose than gain as far as draft position.

On the flipside he can now head down to IMG academy (or the like) and work on his body and fundamentals with a jumpstart on his draft class. I like the kid, he's already got pretty good footwork, pump fake, ballhandling skills, good instincts. A bit of a floorbound game, but able to carve a bit of space with broad shoulders etc. and he's filling out quickly compared to a couple years ago, whatever his age. IF he puts on a bit more solid muscle he could be a solid player in this league. I don't see supastar status, but solid, yep. Good character as well, seemingly.

go'stags · Post #246 » by **go'stags** » Sun Jan 9, 2011 6:59 am

I know Ruz disagrees strongly, but I really think iman Shumpert, a guard from Georgia tech, can play in the league.

He is the best perimeter defender in the nation IMO, and does it even with no legit big men backing him up.

GT is woefully coached, and the rest of the team is comically bad, but this guy can play.

Hoopalotta · Post #247 » by **Hoopalotta** » Sun Jan 9, 2011 7:58 am

This is probably the best footage of the Lithuanian, Johnny Valentine; it's not all highlight footage exactly and is relatively recent:

Versus a Polish plodder:
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7SOU7J3_wZc[/youtube]

Versus a rather Shrimpy and the Gimps:
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VyoPcHuVDJo[/youtube]

Versus a Serbian serial killer:
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AjOTr6GTCXg[/youtube]

Versus Frog boy:
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VlvOtEeWf4k[/youtube]

Obviously he's physically a ways off, but I'd be well pleased if he was the pick. Bursty, technician'ish and tenacious with two way tools and excellent touch; I only wonder if he can play power forward or not (DX says he's a center, for what it's worth). My favorite Euro.

DX is also suggesting that he's also very likely to come out this year in their writeup (which won't open on this computer for whatever weird reason).

Here's a little bit of Donatas Motiejunas, again in non-highlight footage:

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=teXS_cZKvng&feature=related[/youtube]

Not a good get here; respectable offensive skills, but very short arms and a decided lack of presence. Not looking like a solid last line of defense at the rim.

Ed Wood · Post #248 » by **Ed Wood** » Sun Jan 9, 2011 3:12 pm

While I admire the effort it took to find those clips and I generally agree with both assessments there are at least one or two full games of both Johnny V. and Jan Vesely on espn3.com because both play in the euroleague and espn sometimes covertly shows euroleague games online. Valanciunas is also top 20 in per minute blocks, top in per minute scoring, top 10 in per minute rebounds and top 5 in 2 point field goal percentage in the Euroleague. The position question is, however, a tough one. He does have nice touch, as evidenced by his 87.5% conversion rate at the line but I don't remember seeing him taking outside shots. Perhaps he can but doesn't in Rytas' offensive scheme but right now he looks like an Andy Varejao type, maybe quick enough to defend power forwards but without a lot of offense. Still, for a guy so young there's so much to like there.

Other relatively young guys who've been doing pretty well in the Euroleague this year are Ante Tomic (rights held by the Jazz) who's posting 8 and 6 in twenty minutes a game for a very solid Real Madrid team (16 and 12 per 40) on 55% from the field. Alex Maric has been disgusting in four games for Panathinaikos, putting up over 20(!) rebounds per 40 minutes... in 10 minutes per game (probably that rate would decrease with playing time and with a larger sample). Tibor Pleiss (rights held by Nets) is shooting poorly but rebounding and blocking shots like a fiend for Bamberg (13.1 and 3.1 per 40 pace adjusted respectively) and actually shooting well from three in a tiny sample size and from the line in a slightly larger sample. Richard Hendrix is still doing his thing for Maccabi, as is Fran Vasquez (never coming over) for Barcelona. Lior Eliyahu (Magic) is having a nice season for Maccabi (~19/ 7.5/2 per 40 with solid efficiency) and the Blazers duo of Joel Freeland and Victor Claver are both doing okay, Freeland more than Claver. And to keep things in perspective Pech is putting up both a PER of 25 and over 25 points per 40 minutes, hooray for football head.

Post #249 » by **nate33** » Sun Jan 9, 2011 4:15 pm

Ed Wood wrote:And to keep things in perspective Pech is putting up both a PER of 25 and over 25 points per 40 minutes, hooray for football head.

gesa2 · Post #250 » by **gesa2** » Sun Jan 9, 2011 5:06 pm

nate33 wrote:
Ed Wood wrote:And to keep things in perspective Pech is putting up both a PER of 25 and over 25 points per 40 minutes, hooray for football head.

That's amazing! Can we draft him again?

Hoopalotta · Post #251 » by **Hoopalotta** » Sun Jan 9, 2011 11:52 pm

Ed Wood wrote:While I admire the effort it took to find those clips and I generally agree with both assessments there are at least one or two full games of both Johnny V. and Jan Vesely on espn3.com because both play in the euroleague and espn sometimes covertly shows euroleague games online.

Unfortunately, those channels don't work in most overseas markets, so I can't see any of the ESPN feeds.

Valanciunas is also top 20 in per minute blocks, top in per minute scoring, top 10 in per minute rebounds and top 5 in 2 point field goal percentage in the Euroleague. The position question is, however, a tough one. He does have nice touch, as evidenced by his 87.5% conversion rate at the line but I don't remember seeing him taking outside shots. Perhaps he can but doesn't in Rytas' offensive scheme but right now he looks like an Andy Varejao type, maybe quick enough to defend power forwards but without a lot of offense. Still, for a guy so young there's so much to like there.

Yeah, from where he's at now, it's the skills rather than the foot speed at the 4 that you'd worry about. I guess the real thing is we're projecting him from where he's at as an 18 year old, so you'd expect that his body would alter to where what appears to be true now might not be in the future. But I'd be tentatively optimistic that he can run the 4, which could be a nasty tandem with Javy-Poo as far as interior length.

I really haven't seen much of college ball, but if we have Johnny Valentine and Big Enes coming out, we'd just need three 'Merican prospects to take the money and run. In that case, we have a pretty safe landing spot out to the 5th pick as far as I'm concerned. If someone else hops in and or Kemba Walker goes top 5, we'd be pretty good out to the 6th pick. Pre-Pong-Ping, I'm feeling better about 'good' prospects out to six than I am about a winner take all "top pick or bust" situation. You can only ride the yellow jacket so far.

And I must say I Jubilate emphatically to hear that the perpetually bumblesome Billy King is closing in on Melo and Rip as that's a nice "back in the playoffs' screw-up move that knocks the Nyets out of the top of the lottery. They were breathin' down our necks for a minute there.

I've also decided to call Donatas "Donnie Mountjoy". So it's Donnie Mountjoy and Johnny Valentine as far as I'm concerned.

closg00 · Post #252 » by **closg00** » Mon Jan 10, 2011 1:04 am

gesa2 wrote:
nate33 wrote:
Ed Wood wrote:And to keep things in perspective Pech is putting up both a PER of 25 and over 25 points per 40 minutes, hooray for football head.

That's amazing! Can we draft him again?

Not surprising, he was a Euro player all along. Glad he's getting buckets overseas.

mhd · Post #253 » by **mhd** » Mon Jan 10, 2011 3:08 am

Plumlee sucks! Just another in a long list of hyped Duke busts. Jordan Williams kicked his butt tonight. Shavlik Randolph was better than this scrub, and Shav was all-time Duke scrub.

Post #254 » by **Ruzious** » Mon Jan 10, 2011 3:12 am

mhd wrote:Plumlee sucks! Just another in a long list of hyped Duke busts. Jordan Williams kicked his butt tonight. Shavlik Randolph was better than this scrub, and Shav was all-time Duke scrub.

Yup. He's just not skilled or strong enough to begin to be an NBA player - at least not for a couple more years. Frankly, if I was Coack K, I'd start his brother over him. His brother is much stronger.

Hoop, here's your Johnny Valentine - after getting bigger and more physical.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XqPg2Keu3O8

Cramer · Post #255 » by **Cramer** » Mon Jan 10, 2011 3:15 am

Haven't read the rest of this thread but I'd say that Jordan Williams would be the best back to the basket bigman on this team...right now.

mhd · Post #256 » by **mhd** » Mon Jan 10, 2011 3:19 am

Honestly, College b-ball is complete trash compared to 10 years ago. Duke 2001 would CRUSH this Duke team by 30 easily. Singler is the only NBA player on Duke with Irving gone, and he's at best an 8th man in the NBA.

Cramer · Post #257 » by **Cramer** » Mon Jan 10, 2011 3:24 am

heh heh heh.....dude, go back to the late 70s to mid 80s. It's not even the same game. You're completely correct but the further you go back the worse it gets.

I'll sum it up.....

Ralph Sampson stayed four years.

Post #258 » by **Ruzious** » Mon Jan 10, 2011 4:15 pm

Cramer wrote:heh heh heh.....dude, go back to the late 70s to mid 80s. It's not even the same game. You're completely correct but the further you go back the worse it gets.

I'll sum it up.....

Ralph Sampson stayed four years.

And Buck. Don't uh... mess with Buck.

But I do have to admit - Kyle Singler is one helluva college basketball player. But now, Duke is the only ACC team with a forward like him. Back in the day, there'd be multiple Kyle Singlers in the ACC.

Well, actually Singleton is up there with Singler as a college player. And Jeff Allen could have been if he wasn't fat. But yeah, the upper level talented upperclassmen just ain't what they used to be.

Post #259 » by **Ruzious** » Mon Jan 10, 2011 10:19 pm

The game to watch this week is Duke v FLaSt on Wedneday. The matchup is Singler v. Singleton. Duke's guards are going to kill FLaSt with 3's, but FLaSt's interior defense is very impressive.

Chocolate City Jordanaire · Post #260 » by **Chocolate City Jordanaire** » Mon Jan 10, 2011 11:35 pm

Cramer wrote:Haven't read the rest of this thread but I'd say that Jordan Williams would be the best back to the basket bigman on this team...right now.

I was disappointed to miss the game--apparently wasn't shown here.

If Jordan Williams as good as his streak of double doubles suggest, he's probably not returning after this season.