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[Camelo Thread Part 6] - Update: NJ tries again Pg. 71

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Re: [Camelo Thread Part 6] - Update: NJ tries again Pg. 71 

Post#1121 » by god shammgod » Sat Jan 8, 2011 3:49 pm

knicks742 wrote:Although we do need a second superstar, the performance and growth of this team, is making it a lot easier to not worry about the Melo sweepstakes. As far as I am concerned, we get him, great, we don't get him, I am over it already.


wait till we see miami again, you'll change your mind
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Re: [Camelo Thread Part 6] - Update: NJ tries again Pg. 71 

Post#1122 » by AllanHoustonFan » Sat Jan 8, 2011 3:49 pm

knicks742 wrote:Although we do need a second superstar, the performance and growth of this team, is making it a lot easier to not worry about the Melo sweepstakes. As far as I am concerned, we get him, great, we don't get him, I am over it already.


Couldn't have said it better myself.
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Re: [Camelo Thread Part 6] - Update: NJ tries again Pg. 71 

Post#1123 » by captain subtext » Sat Jan 8, 2011 3:53 pm

@KnicksGod: The Amar'e comparison is a fair point. I certainly didn't see that fierce competitive streak of his coming, and I'm delighted by the way he held himself in NY. Though I was more on the fence on his aquisition because of his injury history - the jury is still out on that one (*fingers crossed*).

The thing is: Melo could have passed that character test already by taking a stronger stance towards the Knicks and shutting down those Nets rumours for good.
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Re: [Camelo Thread Part 6] - Update: NJ tries again Pg. 71 

Post#1124 » by FieldsMedal » Sat Jan 8, 2011 3:55 pm

KnicksGod wrote:Even you can concede -- regardless of what his motivations or influence may be -- that Adrian Wojina is a ridiculously biased "reporter" who is virtually indistinguishable from a Nets sales representative.


Eh.

I don't think he's carrying water so much as digging for it.

As Hahn is theorizing, the Nets are where the stories are. For SOME reason, some player in this game has the motivation to make information available that is Nets-centric.

Right now, there are where the story is.

Whether you find that palpable or not is debatable, but I don't think the guy has any vested motivation (financially or as a fan of team) in the Nets. I think like all reporters he has a vested interest in being relevant.
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Re: [Camelo Thread Part 6] - Update: NJ tries again Pg. 71 

Post#1125 » by K_ick_God » Sat Jan 8, 2011 3:59 pm

captain subtext wrote:@KnicksGod: The Amar'e comparison is a fair point. I certainly didn't see that fierce competitive streak of his coming, and I'm delighted by the way he held himself in NY. Though I was more on the fence on his aquisition because of his injury history - the jury is still out on that one (*fingers crossed*).

The thing is: Melo could have passed that character test already by taking a stronger stance towards the Knicks and shutting down those Nets rumours for good.




Well fair enough but he wants to land in NY *and* also wants his money. Keeping the Nets alive increases the chance of a deal right now. Can't really kill him for that. I mean, as good as Amar'e has been, he had the luxury of also getting his Max upfront and with no complications. Got his money first and then showed that he can lead a team dominantly (though also agree that the jury is still out, it's just 35 games).

I mean Melo is in a difficult spot. Should never have signed that extra year, that much is obvious now. It's a tough position for him, within the crazy context of superstar athletes. They all want their cake and to eat it too.

I actually think NYC is more important to Melo than it was to Amar'e. Amar'e would have stayed in Phoenix if they ante'd up. Melo wants the big city experience more than Amar'e did, though he is now enjoying it plenty.
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Re: [Camelo Thread Part 6] - Update: NJ tries again Pg. 71 

Post#1126 » by K_ick_God » Sat Jan 8, 2011 4:02 pm

FieldsMedal wrote:
KnicksGod wrote:Even you can concede -- regardless of what his motivations or influence may be -- that Adrian Wojina is a ridiculously biased "reporter" who is virtually indistinguishable from a Nets sales representative.


Eh.

I don't think he's carrying water so much as digging for it.

As Hahn is theorizing, the Nets are where the stories are. For SOME reason, some player in this game has the motivation to make information available that is Nets-centric.

Right now, there are where the story is.

Whether you find that palpable or not is debatable, but I don't think the guy has any vested motivation (financially or as a fan of team) in the Nets. I think like all reporters he has a vested interest in being relevant.



No doubt that these stories are being leaked very intentionally and I find that, too, pretty pathetic. I think the Nets are hoping that Melo blinks but also just want to get the Knicks to expend assets.

On the latter motivation, I think they are barking up the very wrong tree. Walsh won't be panicked here. Maybe they think that the deal he made to dump Jeffries shows he can be forced to overpay, but this is a different situation. Very different. They're kidding themselves if they think they can get Walsh to bite on this phony bait.

It is possible that Melo could still cave. But it's clear that this is a charade and it is kind of a pathetic attempt by both Denver and NJ. Pathetic strategies can still work, though, if Melo is more pathetic and goes from the above-average Nuggets to the way-below-average Nets.
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Re: [Camelo Thread Part 6] - Update: NJ tries again Pg. 71 

Post#1127 » by ITGM » Sat Jan 8, 2011 4:03 pm

KnicksGod wrote:Maybe Amar'e doesn't want to share the spotlight with Melo, as he was willing to do (and wanted to do) just recently?


Facing at least 30 media members at shootaround, Stoudemire said leading the Knicks' renaissance has made him feel "like a rock star."

"It's unreal," Stoudemire said. "New York City right now, it feels like being a rock star. It really does. It's unbelievable now. Fans are so appreciative. It's still early, still room to improve. But so far it's been out of control."

Read more: http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/knicks/b ... z1ASUF1Qyx


Don't allow the media to coax you into falling for their agenda bro. By no means was STAT saying we don't need Melo, this is just the media trying to make something out of nothing.
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Re: [Camelo Thread Part 6] - Update: NJ tries again Pg. 71 

Post#1128 » by knicks742 » Sat Jan 8, 2011 4:09 pm

The most interesting part of that article is that he says that every great team needs 1 2 punch and doesn't identify anyone on this team as the second punch. Interesting.
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Re: [Camelo Thread Part 6] - Update: NJ tries again Pg. 71 

Post#1129 » by FieldsMedal » Sat Jan 8, 2011 4:11 pm

KnicksGod wrote:No doubt that these stories are being leaked very intentionally and I find that, too, pretty pathetic.


I think Hahn has an astute theory. Listen, this is still a multi-million dollar game for the Nuggets. They have to sell Denver this team post-'Melo.

Some people are calling them immature and vindictive, but look was happened in Cleveland. The fans, who turned their hatred towards James, kept supporting a team without him, somewhat fooling themselves thinking they could compete. At least initially. I haven't looked their their attendance lately since they started doing their Washington General impression, but at least it out worked outta the gate.

Denver has a very REAL, practical motivation to put the onus on 'Melo for leaving, and he's not taking the bait.

On the latter motivation, I think they are barking up the very wrong tree. Walsh won't be panicked here. Maybe they think that the deal he made to dump Jeffries shows he can be forced to overpay, but this is a different situation. Very different. They're kidding themselves if they think they can get Walsh to bite on this plastic fish.


Walsh didn't overpay in the Houston deal.

That said, NO story in the press, either by substance or volume is going to affect this process in any significant way. It is strictly a show, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing.

This is all about what impression fans are left with AFTER whatever trades happens (or not).
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Re: [Camelo Thread Part 6] - Update: NJ tries again Pg. 71 

Post#1130 » by K_ick_God » Sat Jan 8, 2011 4:11 pm

knicks742 wrote:The most interesting part of that article is that he says that every great team needs 1 2 punch and doesn't identify anyone on this team as the second punch. Interesting.




He says something about how everybody on the team is even, that they're all leaders, that everybody is the second punch.
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Re: [Camelo Thread Part 6] - Update: NJ tries again Pg. 71 

Post#1131 » by knicks742 » Sat Jan 8, 2011 4:13 pm

KnicksGod wrote:
knicks742 wrote:The most interesting part of that article is that he says that every great team needs 1 2 punch and doesn't identify anyone on this team as the second punch. Interesting.




He says something about how everybody on the team is even, that they're all leaders, that everybody is the second punch.


I know but that's not how it works. You need that second guy. He could have said, over there was Nash and me, now it's Ray and me but he didn't. He didn't feel the need to highlight anyone as the second guy.
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Re: [Camelo Thread Part 6] - Update: NJ tries again Pg. 71 

Post#1132 » by K_ick_God » Sat Jan 8, 2011 4:15 pm

FieldsMedal wrote:
KnicksGod wrote:No doubt that these stories are being leaked very intentionally and I find that, too, pretty pathetic.


I think Hahn has an astute theory. Listen, this is still a multi-million dollar game for the Nuggets. They have to sell Denver this team post-'Melo.

Some people are calling them immature and vindictive, but look was happened in Cleveland. The fans, who turned their hatred towards James, kept supporting a team without him, somewhat fooling themselves thinking they could compete. At least initially. I haven't looked their their attendance lately since they started doing their Washington General impression, but at least it out worked outta the gate.

Denver has a very REAL, practical motivation to put the onus on 'Melo for leaving, and he's not taking the bait.

On the latter motivation, I think they are barking up the very wrong tree. Walsh won't be panicked here. Maybe they think that the deal he made to dump Jeffries shows he can be forced to overpay, but this is a different situation. Very different. They're kidding themselves if they think they can get Walsh to bite on this plastic fish.


Walsh didn't overpay in the Houston deal.

That said, NO story in the press, either by substance or volume is going to affect this process in any significant way. It is strictly a show, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing.

This is all about what impression fans are left with AFTER whatever trades happens (or not).



All fair points. I don't disagree with anything you said really.

Walsh didn't overpay in the Houston deal now that we look at the price, but the price could have been much higher if the Knicks turned in another poor season. He got a little lucky in that deal, even I have to admit.
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Re: [Camelo Thread Part 6] - Update: NJ tries again Pg. 71 

Post#1133 » by K_ick_God » Sat Jan 8, 2011 4:18 pm

knicks742 wrote:
KnicksGod wrote:
knicks742 wrote:The most interesting part of that article is that he says that every great team needs 1 2 punch and doesn't identify anyone on this team as the second punch. Interesting.




He says something about how everybody on the team is even, that they're all leaders, that everybody is the second punch.


I know but that's not how it works. You need that second guy. He could have said, over there was Nash and me, now it's Ray and me but he didn't. He didn't feel the need to highlight anyone as the second guy.




One can only hope that he's heard from Melo directly that he's just going to wait out the season and then sign.

The great irony of this, of course, is that if Melo is REALLY committed to going to free agency, then he will likely get traded to the Knicks in February. Because then Denver has no choice but to accept Gallo and a pick or Randolph and be done with it.

So this really all comes down to -- and always has -- how Melo plays his hand. Nothing else really matters. His determination will dictate all of the moves.
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Re: [Camelo Thread Part 6] - Update: NJ tries again Pg. 71 

Post#1134 » by K_ick_God » Sat Jan 8, 2011 4:22 pm

FieldsMedal, one other thing: Hahn's theory does seem to support your position far more than mine. Hahn does not mention that the media charade and leaks could be about getting the Knicks to ante up. He says it's all about their fan base only.

But I still think the public debate influences the actual players more than you (and maybe Hahn) realize. I remember Walsh saying that 'There's a lot of posturing going on' with Denver related to the Melo saga.

Well did Walsh mean they are posturing for their fan base or partially posturing to influence him or other internal players?

I think it's strategic and the fan base thing factors in, but it is also about trying to squeeze the Knicks.
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Re: [Camelo Thread Part 6] - Update: NJ tries again Pg. 71 

Post#1135 » by knicks742 » Sat Jan 8, 2011 4:23 pm

^^^^

Agreed. You know, one thing that I keep thinking about is how his sister's death has affected him. I've had a close friend died last year and it really puts things in perspective about your own life. Makes you evaluate your own life and figure out what's important to you and say, to hell with the rest, life is too short. I am not saying that would help or hurt the Knicks' position but I really think it will affect his decision. I think whatever he does, it will be what he wants, no regrets.
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Re: [Camelo Thread Part 6] - Update: NJ tries again Pg. 71 

Post#1136 » by Falstaffxx » Sat Jan 8, 2011 4:28 pm

If I were Carmelo I think I'd be getting rather annoyed by these head games Denver is playing in the media - especially right after a family tragedy. If I've given them my position on the matter - that I'll either extend in a trade to the Knicks so they can get value back, or else I'll sign in the offseason, and yet they keep up this campaign of posturing - I think that would make me even more determined to end up at my first-choice location.
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Re: [Camelo Thread Part 6] - Update: NJ tries again Pg. 71 

Post#1137 » by ophdog » Sat Jan 8, 2011 4:37 pm

If i were MElo and i didnt wanna go to NJ i would be telling Denver right now that i am not going to publicly say trade me to the knicks but i will be saying shortly that i will not be going to the nets effectively killling Den leverage.

I do think Melo prob says to the them " get me talent and i would think about it. pob is they cant get the talent he wants... amare like talents are hard to come by
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Re: [Camelo Thread Part 6] - Update: NJ tries again Pg. 71 

Post#1138 » by Knicks_Fan2 » Sat Jan 8, 2011 4:38 pm

Winning helps us in two ways: better record makes us look much better to Anthony as opposed to the nets an a winning record makes it clear to Denver that we are not desperate for a seal.
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Re: [Camelo Thread Part 6] - Update: NJ tries again Pg. 71 

Post#1139 » by cshoops » Sat Jan 8, 2011 4:49 pm

Win Win:
If Carmelo goes to Nets it will mean the Knicks will go for it all this year and make a move for a Camby or whoever else. If Carmelo joins us this summer we'll have to restart the process with him and Amare as the stars. Either way we are in good shape.
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Re: [Camelo Thread Part 6] - Update: NJ tries again Pg. 71 

Post#1140 » by towelie » Sat Jan 8, 2011 4:49 pm

HEY KG

Fix the wiretap plz, tired of reading about Gasol and his dumb iphone

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