[Camelo Thread Part 8] - NJ Gets Threats From Denver!

[GONYK]

see my only problem with a definition like that is you're describing a hall of famer. why use the term franchise player when you're actually describing a hall of fame player.

Well, if a franchise player needs another top player next to him, then he's not a player who makes your franchise all by himself. He's a "co-franchise player" at best and that's a fair way to describe both Amar'e and Melo probably.

HTis is what my response was LArry, Michael and MAgic anll had top players around them

Here is my criteria. If a player fits it, he is probably franchise.

1. Can you run the offense through him?
2. Does he make his teammates better?
3. Can you count on him to get a bucket when you need it?
4. Has he proven it in the playoffs?

Those players all fit my criteria, so they are all franchise players

[cgmw]

And the Detroit team from a few years back did not have a franchise player, they argueably didn't even have a true allstar caliber player.

It is more important to have the right combination of players than have big names.

Citing the exception and calling it the rule might work in Phoenix. Not here.

[seren]

1) No player is winning anything significant by themselves. That includes MJ. There is a reason why Ewing never won the title. He did not have the second guy.

2) gonyk's standards for franchise player is irrelevant. Anyone can make up a definition. The fact is you put talented players into their right roles, surround them with right players and they will win.

Still, since everyone is making up a definition, I will make mine. You are not winning a ring until your best player shows up on the defensive end. Everything else is secondary. MJ has six rings because him and Pippen were first team defense many years in a row. Guys like Kobe, Duncan, KG etc. all show up on defensive end. LBJ started to commit just recently. Amare is getting better but has ways to go. I hope if/when Melo comes, he will commit. Otherwise, we will be a good playoff team but will never win a ring.

[MarJJMar]

Melo is a franchise player. If he had someone like Pau Gasol, do you really think they wouldn't contend for a title? If yes then I think he can with Amare.

Amare is a completely different player than Gasol.

Gasols skills would mesh much better with either Melo or Amare.

Amare+Melo just doesn't make a good combo. Good combos either have such diverse skill sets that they can adapt like Wade and Lebron or have different types of skill sets and thrive because of that.

Amare and Melo have similier skill sets and similiar deficiencies.

[GONYK]

Melo is a franchise player. If he had someone like Pau Gasol, do you really think they wouldn't contend for a title? If yes then I think he can with Amare.

Amare is a completely different player than Gasol.

Gasols skills would mesh much better with either Melo or Amare.

Amare+Melo just doesn't make a good combo. Good combos either have such diverse skill sets that they can adapt like Wade and Lebron or have different types of skill sets and thrive because of that.

Amare and Melo have similier skill sets and similiar deficiencies.

You are right, but I feel Melo will be used the same exact way Chandler is used, so we should be able to make it work

[TheBluest]

Franchise Player IMO means if player on team by default does it equal more wins than losses assuming this player is anchoring a teams offense and/or defense. Supporting cast league average.

[defjux21]

http://www.realgm.com/src_wiretap_archi ... de_target/

Well, now we finally know what the Nuggets want in return for a Melo deal

[GONYK]

http://www.realgm.com/src_wiretap_archives/71087/20110111/griffin_is_denvers_dream_trade_target/

Well, now we finally know what the Nuggets want in return for a Melo deal

LOL at Portland not wanting to trade Batum, but people here want to throw in Fields

[Fury]

Melo is a franchise player. If he had someone like Pau Gasol, do you really think they wouldn't contend for a title? If yes then I think he can with Amare.

Amare is a completely different player than Gasol.

Gasols skills would mesh much better with either Melo or Amare.

Amare+Melo just doesn't make a good combo. Good combos either have such diverse skill sets that they can adapt like Wade and Lebron or have different types of skill sets and thrive because of that.

Amare and Melo have similier skill sets and similiar deficiencies.

I disagree. Amare and Melo would wear teams down. They are old school bully ball players. It'd be like having Elvin Hayes and Bernard King on the same team. In this system with all that spacing, they'd get easy buckets. And with each other they'd save energy. It's a nightmare defending these two on the same team.

[Knickplaya]

Melo and Amare would grow together. They are both still pretty young and coachable.

[Justdatdude]

Franchise Player IMO means if player on team by default does it equal more wins than losses assuming this player is anchoring a teams offense and/or defense. Supporting cast league average.

So Carmelo is a franchise player? Haha. First time you ever gave him credit.

[moocow007]

http://www.realgm.com/src_wiretap_archives/71087/20110111/griffin_is_denvers_dream_trade_target/

Well, now we finally know what the Nuggets want in return for a Melo deal

More and more I'm thinking that "Masai Ujiri" actually translates to "He Who Loves" this...



In fact maybe he's a former RGM poster "Cocaines-A-Helluva-Drug'.

[Knickplaya]

http://www.realgm.com/src_wiretap_archives/71087/20110111/griffin_is_denvers_dream_trade_target/

Well, now we finally know what the Nuggets want in return for a Melo deal

They must really believe Melo will sign anywhere.

[towelie]

Melo is a franchise player. If he had someone like Pau Gasol, do you really think they wouldn't contend for a title? If yes then I think he can with Amare.

Amare is a completely different player than Gasol.

Gasols skills would mesh much better with either Melo or Amare.

Amare+Melo just doesn't make a good combo. Good combos either have such diverse skill sets that they can adapt like Wade and Lebron or have different types of skill sets and thrive because of that.

Amare and Melo have similier skill sets and similiar deficiencies.

You are right, but I feel Melo will be used the same exact way Chandler is used, so we should be able to make it work

Melo also gives us a solid post-up option, which is something we completely lack on this current roster. Although, D'Antoni's offense hardly ever includes back-to-the-basket play.

[GONYK]

http://www.realgm.com/src_wiretap_archives/71087/20110111/griffin_is_denvers_dream_trade_target/

Well, now we finally know what the Nuggets want in return for a Melo deal

They must really believe Melo will sign anywhere.

Your sig is too big bro. They are going to take it away from you

[TheBluest]

Franchise Player IMO means if player on team by default does it equal more wins than losses assuming this player is anchoring a teams offense and/or defense. Supporting cast league average.

So Carmelo is a franchise player? Haha. First time you ever gave him credit.

All Franchise Players are not created equal though nor do they possess the same value.

[GONYK]

Melo also gives us a solid post-up option, which is something we completely lack on this current roster. Although, D'Antoni's offense hardly ever includes back-to-the-basket play.

It allows for it as long as there is a mismatch. If players switch off on Melo, he will be allowed to take them in the post

[BLACKFEET 2010]

It's clear they want a young big...we can trade Gallo for a Jason Thompson or maybe a Javale McGee,
trade AR for a pick. Send cash to an upper echelon team out west for their 1st rounder and even trade our 2014 pick for one in this draft....Jason Thompson, 2 picks, cash and filler.

http://www.realgm.com/src_wiretap_archi ... de_target/

[GONYK]

Franchise Player IMO means if player on team by default does it equal more wins than losses assuming this player is anchoring a teams offense and/or defense. Supporting cast league average.

So Carmelo is a franchise player? Haha. First time you ever gave him credit.

All Franchise Players are not created equal though nor do they possess the same value.

Exactly.

Melo is what KnicksGod dubbed 75% franchise. I simply maintained he is not TRUE franchise. He has major flaws that keep him from getting to that true franchise level.

[Li'l Penny]

Melo and Amare would grow together. They are both still pretty young and coachable.