[Camelo Thread Part 8] - NJ Gets Threats From Denver!

[CHARLYMURPHY]

I think after almost all the stars on the NBA were on one team on the olympics and since they all won the gold together.. their comraderie became great. i think that is why Lebron joined up with bosh and wade.. and Melo wants to do that too now.

[kane2021]

Avery Johnson

Negotiations have been documented on Twitter, with rampant contradictions coming from reporters trying to break the NBA's biggest story since LeBron James uttered "South Beach."

"When I started working in the media, I clearly understood what sources mean," said Johnson, who was an analyst at ESPN for two years. "Sources are not always accurate and sometimes there's not really a source. So that's a part of the deal. The players have to manage it."

Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/baske ... z1AtQsJz1o

[GONYK]

G- Felton
G- Mayo
F- Melo
F- Amare
C- Dalembert

[AllanHoustonFan]

Avery Johnson

Negotiations have been documented on Twitter, with rampant contradictions coming from reporters trying to break the NBA's biggest story since LeBron James uttered "South Beach."

"When I started working in the media, I clearly understood what sources mean," said Johnson, who was an analyst at ESPN for two years. "Sources are not always accurate and sometimes there's not really a source. So that's a part of the deal. The players have to manage it."

Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/baske ... z1AtQsJz1o

So he is basically doing early damage control just in case the Nets don't get Melo.

[kane2021]

Avery Johnson

Negotiations have been documented on Twitter, with rampant contradictions coming from reporters trying to break the NBA's biggest story since LeBron James uttered "South Beach."

"When I started working in the media, I clearly understood what sources mean," said Johnson, who was an analyst at ESPN for two years. "Sources are not always accurate and sometimes there's not really a source. So that's a part of the deal. The players have to manage it."

Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/baske ... z1AtQsJz1o

So he is basically doing early damage control just in case the Nets don't get Melo.

I thought it was interesting that he talks about his experience in the media, then goes on to say, in a nice way, sometimes reporters lie. Not that we never suspected that.

[Knickplaya]

Sheridan just linked this on his twitter about the Nuggets loll

Zugzwang (German for "compulsion to move", pronounced [ˈtsuːktsvaŋ]) is a term originally used in chess which also applies to various other games. The concept finds its formal definition in combinatorial game theory. It describes a situation where one player is put at a disadvantage because he has to make a move – the player would prefer to pass and make no move. The fact that the player must make a move means that his position will be significantly weaker than the hypothetical one in which it were his opponent's turn to move.

In game theory, it specifically means that it directly changes the outcome of the game from a win to a loss. The term is used less precisely in games such as chess; i.e., the game theory definition is not necessarily used in chess (Berlekamp, Conway & Guy 1982:16), (Elkies 1996:136). For instance, it may be defined loosely as "a player to move cannot do anything without making an important concession" (van Perlo 2006:479). Zugzwang is a common technique to help the superior side win a game and sometimes it is necessary to make the win possible (Müller & Pajeken 2008:173).

The term zugzwang is frequently used in chess. A player whose turn it is to move who has no move that does not worsen his position is said to be in zugzwang (Soltis 2003a:78). Thus every move would make his position worse, and he would be better off if he could pass and not move. Sometimes different chess authors use the term zugzwang in different ways (Flear 2004:11–12).[note 1] In some literature a reciprocal zugzwang (see below) is called zugzwang and a one-sided zugzwang is called a squeeze (Hooper & Whyld 1992).

The term zugzwang was used in German-language chess literature in 1858 (or earlier) (Winter 1997). The first known use of the term in English was by World Champion Emanuel Lasker in 1905 (Winter 2008). The concept of zugzwang (as distinguished from the word) must have been known to players many centuries earlier, since it is necessary to win the elementary king and rook versus king endgame, among others. The concept is also seen in an endgame study published in 1604 by Alessandro Salvio, one of the first writers on the game. It also appeared in Shatranj studies dating back to the early 9th century, over 1000 years before the first known use of the term zugzwang.

In a chess endgame, being in zugzwang usually means going from a drawn position to a loss or a won position to a draw, but it can be from a win to a loss, or a substantial loss of material which probably affects the outcome of the game. A chess position of reciprocal zugzwang or mutual zugzwang is equivalent to the more precise definition of zugzwang in game theory. Opposition is a special kind of zugzwang (Flear 2000:36). Trébuchet is a special type of zugzwang that is discussed below.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zugzwang

[DowNY]

Please pardon the high theory but quick question guys;

Do you think Knicks make a play for Greg Oden or Yao Ming in the off-season if Melo is already on board?

[Knickplaya]

Sources: proposed NJ-Den-Det deal "not dead, but dormant." that means part 1 (reaching agreement). Part 2 (Melo signing) still a longshot
half a minute ago via Echofon -------------CHRIS BROUSSARD TWITTER

[kingOfqueens]

the only reason tonights game wasn't a blowout was because walker and williams shot 10-13 from downtown. When Amare gets in foul trouble like he did tonight (especially in the playoffs where you're playing boston and orl and even chicago with boozer and noah down low in a seven game series) I'd be much more confident with having Melo rather than hope walker and williams shoot 77% from beyond the arc.

[GONYK]

Please pardon the high theory but quick question guys;

Do you think Knicks make a play for Greg Oden or Yao Ming in the off-season if Melo is already on board?

No, because that would be (Please Use More Appropriate Word).

Yao Ming is finished, and Greg Oden isn't far behind. Besides, neither of them fit our style of play.

[RHODEY]

the only reason tonights game wasn't a blowout was because walker and williams shot 10-13 from downtown. When Amare gets in foul trouble like he did tonight (especially in the playoffs where you're playing boston and orl and even chicago with boozer and noah down low in a seven game series) I'd be much more confident with having Melo rather than hope walker and williams shoot 77% from beyond the arc.

Jazz at home
3 days rest
team is entirely healthy

Knicks without Gallo
Douglas Hurt
Felton Ankle sprain
Amare hasd foul issues
end of a back to back on the road

Yet we still make a game of it.

We needed a solid center if anything.

[GONYK]

We needed a solid center if anything.

Too bad none are available.

[Knickplaya]

Please pardon the high theory but quick question guys;

Do you think Knicks make a play for Greg Oden or Yao Ming in the off-season if Melo is already on board?

No, because that would be (Please Use More Appropriate Word).

Yao Ming is finished, and Greg Oden isn't far behind. Besides, neither of them fit our style of play.

Wouldn't be able to fit Yao under the cap, I would try Oden on a 1 yr deal or 1 yr and team option for 2nd yr for 2 million

[DowNY]

Please pardon the high theory but quick question guys;

Do you think Knicks make a play for Greg Oden or Yao Ming in the off-season if Melo is already on board?

No, because that would be (Please Use More Appropriate Word).

Yao Ming is finished, and Greg Oden isn't far behind. Besides, neither of them fit our style of play.

how so? Obviously, both are major injure prone players & lost some zip in their play. But knowing that as fans, I'm sure every GM in the league knows that too & would end up not going to those players as resolutions. But do you think either player takes less money [not full MLE] to play with our squad. We all said it before....we need a defensive stop at Center ....& if we don't put our eggs in 1 basket & sign 1 of them to reasonable deal...I can't see how neither can't have a solid season(s) with the Knicks [aside from another injury of course....lol] .... I know a lot of people may have gave up on Oden but I'm not 1 of them. His age leaves a little bit of faith in me that he can turn around & be at least 80% the player he should have been coming out.

[GONYK]

Please pardon the high theory but quick question guys;

Do you think Knicks make a play for Greg Oden or Yao Ming in the off-season if Melo is already on board?

No, because that would be (Please Use More Appropriate Word).

Yao Ming is finished, and Greg Oden isn't far behind. Besides, neither of them fit our style of play.

Wouldn't be able to fit Yao under the cap, I would try Oden on a 1 yr deal or 1 yr and team option for 2nd yr for 2 million

Portland isn't letting him go for 2 million.

[TrueWarrior]

the only reason tonights game wasn't a blowout was because walker and williams shot 10-13 from downtown. When Amare gets in foul trouble like he did tonight (especially in the playoffs where you're playing boston and orl and even chicago with boozer and noah down low in a seven game series) I'd be much more confident with having Melo rather than hope walker and williams shoot 77% from beyond the arc.

I dont think anyone disagrees with you, but superstar Melo the last 3 years has only been a 44% shooter who still cant hit form behind the arc. He can get to the line no doubt, but hes not an efficient scorer overall considering his usage. For the money he is going to get paid and since scoring is his biggest strength, I expect better.

If we get him he has to be our #2 guy, up his percentages/shot selection, be a more willing passer, step up his D, and work on that three pt shot. I hope playing with Amare would give him better looks, because theres no reason he shouldnt be close to or above 50% from the field if hes only going to take 2 threes a game.

If he continues to shoot the way hes been IDK how anybody could be comfortable paying him so much. That is one aspect some people forget, not only are we probably going to lose a young player in a trade or FA to bring him here, but we will have to pay Melo MAX dollars. All Im saying is he better improve because Im not down with paying Glenn Robinson that kinda dough.

[TheBluest]

Did people forget that Melo sucker punched Mardy Collins? What if it was Gallo he suckered punched or say Fields?

Melo is not worth 3 high quality future assets, an expiring, $20mil dollars, and 18FGA/gm, and ball stoppage galore are you kidding me


At what point does it sink in for those who are like cats in heat

[RHODEY]

We needed a solid center if anything.

Too bad none are available.

None that seem to fit perfectly. A young Camby might be ideal...

[GONYK]

how so? Obviously, both are major injure prone players & lost some zip in their play. But knowing that as fans, I'm sure every GM in the league knows that too & would end up not going to those players as resolutions. But do you think either player takes less money [not full MLE] to play with our squad. We all said it before....we need a defensive stop at Center ....& if we don't put our eggs in 1 basket & sign 1 of them to reasonable deal...I can't see how neither can't have a solid season(s) with the Knicks [aside from another injury of course....lol] .... I know a lot of people may have gave up on Oden but I'm not 1 of them. His age leaves a little bit of faith in me that he can turn around & be at least 80% the player he should have been coming out.

Yao cannot physically play the game, and I can't think of a center worse for our system. Yao is finished.

PDX is keeping Oden unless we overpay, which we won't, because Donnie isn't dumb. Oden also does not fit our system.

[kingOfqueens]

Jazz at home
3 days rest
team is entirely healthy

Knicks without Gallo
Douglas Hurt
Felton Ankle sprain
Amare hasd foul issues
end of a back to back on the road

Yet we still make a game of it.

We needed a solid center if anything.

yea i agree that we were at a huge disadv coming into the game. But my point was when situations like this happen with injuries and foul trouble, I'd be much more comfortable having a second go to guy in Melo (who would be the first go to guy in 90% of the other NBA teams). He would have also grabbed more than 3 boards that walker and williams managed to grab in their combined 60 minutes of play time. But they did play an amazing game tonight off the bench.