Worst Blue Jay Ever

evilRyu · Post #1 » by **evilRyu** » Mon Jan 17, 2011 10:27 pm

In response to the "Best" Blue Jay Ever, who do you feel is the worst? I guess there are a lot of ways to define "worst".. Should we take into account longevity? Contract? Suckitude? I'll let you decide.. but to start off:

Erik Hanson
Joey Hamilton

DonYon · Post #2 » by **DonYon** » Mon Jan 17, 2011 11:14 pm

I'm just gonna throw in some odd names to just to see what ppl think

Esteban Loaiza
Corey Koskie
Roger Clemens

rarefind · Post #3 » by **rarefind** » Mon Jan 17, 2011 11:17 pm

there has to be some criteria, max seasons played or something.

but i will go with josh towers.

Post #4 » by **Schad** » Mon Jan 17, 2011 11:23 pm

Two excellent choices to start it off. I'm going to beat Michael Bradley to the punch and mention Robert Person...not just because he posted a 6.18 ERA in 177.2 IP with the team, but because he was the lone return for Olerud (who then hit .305/.414/.484 over the next six seasons).

For consistent terribleness, I'm going to go with Garth Iorg. He was tremendously versatile, in that he could suck at any number of positions. 2615 plate appearances with the Jays over nine seasons, a career line of .258/.292/.347. Bonus points for going 2-15 during the epic 1985 choke job (though 1985 was the only season in which Iorg didn't suck) in the ALCS while his platoon partner was having an excellent series.

Randle McMurphy · Post #5 » by **Randle McMurphy** » Tue Jan 18, 2011 12:07 am

I wasn't around then, but Danny Ainge really sucked at major league baseball (721 PA, .220/.264/.269, -1.7 WAR)
http://www.fangraphs.com/statss.aspx?pl ... tion=2B/3B

Dave Berg might have been the worst infielder I've ever seen live, I have no idea how he kept a job on the Jays as long as he did (.263/.307/.372, -1.6 WAR):
http://www.fangraphs.com/statss.aspx?pl ... tion=2B/SS

Robert Person is a good choice but guys like Bill Risley, Marty Janzen (who also started for a stretch in that terrible 1996 year), and Corey Thurman could also be in contention with the pitchers.

Randle McMurphy · Post #6 » by **Randle McMurphy** » Tue Jan 18, 2011 12:12 am

Remembered a good resource for this:

Jays hitters ranked by WAR: http://www.fangraphs.com/graphswd.aspx? ... 1&grid=500

Wally West · Post #7 » by **Wally West** » Tue Jan 18, 2011 12:20 am

Russ Adams and Bryan Bullington comes to mind.

number15 · Post #8 » by **number15** » Tue Jan 18, 2011 1:18 am

rarefind wrote:there has to be some criteria, max seasons played or something.

but i will go with josh towers.

not to sound like the bad guy, but there was a time when Roy Halladay was have Josh Tower type seasons, early in his career. Im shocked they didnt trade him when everyone was wanting Halladay out of Toronto....... they kept him and became the best decision in Jays history

................................. that was the reason JAYS just wouldnt give up on Josh Towers. bad start after bad, loss after loss, home run after home run, he was handed the ball. Even when every JAYS fan out there wanted him cut. Jays were hoping for a Halladay type turn around (not to that degree though). I mean Towers had an promizing young career just a season ago

:wink:

evilRyu · Post #9 » by **evilRyu** » Tue Jan 18, 2011 1:34 am

oh man, don't remind me about Robert Person haha. I was an Olerud fan, and had no idea who Robert Person was.. I kind of assumed he was gonna be a stud, but it certainly did not turn out that way.

some of these names mentioned brings back lots of memories

Post #10 » by **Schad** » Tue Jan 18, 2011 2:37 am

number15 wrote:
rarefind wrote:there has to be some criteria, max seasons played or something.

but i will go with josh towers.

not to sound like the bad guy, but there was a time when Roy Halladay was have Josh Tower type seasons, early in his career. Im shocked they didnt trade him when everyone was wanting Halladay out of Toronto....... they kept him and became the best decision in Jays history

................................. that was the reason JAYS just wouldnt give up on Josh Towers. bad start after bad, loss after loss, home run after home run, he was handed the ball. Even when every JAYS fan out there wanted him cut. Jays were hoping for a Halladay type turn around (not to that degree though). I mean Towers had an promizing young career just a season ago

What? No, the Jays were never expecting Josh Towers, who was a late-20s journeyman fifth starter, to turn into an ace. He was just a guy who could eat some innings.

Skin Blues · Post #11 » by **Skin Blues** » Tue Jan 18, 2011 2:53 am

Ken Robinson. Back in 1995 he scribbled his big loopy signature overlapping Cal Ripken's on a game ball I got my hands in. Thanks a lot. Why the hell did I want Ken Robinson's autograph anyway?

CapeCrusader · Post #12 » by **CapeCrusader** » Tue Jan 18, 2011 3:45 am

In recent memory, Adams and Woodward. Equally suck.

wlujaysfan55 · Post #13 » by **wlujaysfan55** » Tue Jan 18, 2011 4:02 am

Glenallen Hill. Had to change the channel anytime he went to bat though, on occasion, did prove he had some vision. Others: Randy Myers, Towers, and pretty sure I remember hating on Mark Whiten.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toronto_Bl ... ime_roster

evilRyu · Post #14 » by **evilRyu** » Tue Jan 18, 2011 4:17 am

I'd give Towers bonus points for drilling a-rod

Randle McMurphy · Post #15 » by **Randle McMurphy** » Tue Jan 18, 2011 4:54 am

Schadenfreude wrote:
number15 wrote:
rarefind wrote:there has to be some criteria, max seasons played or something.

but i will go with josh towers.

not to sound like the bad guy, but there was a time when Roy Halladay was have Josh Tower type seasons, early in his career. Im shocked they didnt trade him when everyone was wanting Halladay out of Toronto....... they kept him and became the best decision in Jays history

................................. that was the reason JAYS just wouldnt give up on Josh Towers. bad start after bad, loss after loss, home run after home run, he was handed the ball. Even when every JAYS fan out there wanted him cut. Jays were hoping for a Halladay type turn around (not to that degree though). I mean Towers had an promizing young career just a season ago

What? No, the Jays were never expecting Josh Towers, who was a late-20s journeyman fifth starter, to turn into an ace. He was just a guy who could eat some innings.

And he did that job well, including a 4.2 WAR season in 2005. He has no place in this thread.

rarefind · Post #16 » by **rarefind** » Tue Jan 18, 2011 6:01 am

Erase 2005 and look at his numbers again. Towers was dreadful as a Blue Jay and had one decent year but flamed out hard. You can't use one season as a barometer on guys, Towers simply put; was not very good at all here. I really felt bad for him, every outing (post 05') felt like we were leading him to slaughter.

Randle McMurphy · Post #17 » by **Randle McMurphy** » Tue Jan 18, 2011 10:03 am

rarefind wrote:Erase 2005 and look at his numbers again. Towers was dreadful as a Blue Jay and had one decent year but flamed out hard. You can't use one season as a barometer on guys, Towers simply put; was not very good at all here. I really felt bad for him, every outing (post 05') felt like we were leading him to slaughter.

#1. Why would you erase a player's best season when evaluating him, especially in a thread like this? That makes little sense. It would be like forgetting Bautista's 54 HR season never happened if he suddenly regresses to his pre-2010 form next year. Really, Towers had a great year and was the best pitcher on this team in 2005 (4.2 WAR, ranked 7th in the AL), whether you want to remember it or not.

#2. Towers put up a combined 2.6 WAR in his remaining 300+ innings with the team. Certainly not great, but hardly dreadful either, especially for a pitcher with his limited stuff and strikeout ability. In terms of overall win contribution, Towers was one of the better Jays starters of the last decade, not one of the worst.

Evermore · Post #18 » by **Evermore** » Tue Jan 18, 2011 11:08 am

Anybody got a coin?

Manny Lee heads

Dick Schofield tails

gei · Post #19 » by **gei** » Tue Jan 18, 2011 3:53 pm

Towers?

Michael Bradley · Post #20 » by **Michael Bradley** » Tue Jan 18, 2011 4:27 pm

Person is a great choice. Worst trade in franchise history + abysmal results + turning into something decent after leaving. As Schad said he had a 6.18 ERA in 177 innings in Toronto, then after being traded he went 34-19 with a 4.03 ERA in 518 innings for the Phillies (3.99 ERA in 507 innings as a starter over that span).

Another one of my favorites was Darrin Jackson in 1993. He seemed to pop out to the infield every time he stepped up to the plate that year. When the Jays traded him for Tony Fernandez I was doing backflips. Hard to believe the Jays started 1993 with Jackson in the OF and Schofield at short. Turning that into Henderson and Fernandez by the time the playoffs started seems like a miracle in hindsight.

Honorable mentions to Carlos Garcia, Erik Hanson, and Joey Hamilton.