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[Camelo Thread Part 11] - Knicks make offer? Pg 82

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Re: [Camelo Thread Part 11] - Knicks make offer? Pg 82 

Post#1321 » by moocow007 » Fri Jan 21, 2011 10:30 pm

kosmovitelli wrote:About the trade proposal, we're on a four-game losing streak so the Nuggets hope Walsh will become desperate and will give up the farm for Melo. We're not dealing from a position of strength right now. Not only we're on a losing streak but the whole league expects us to trade for Melo (because the Nets are out of the way) and the Melo talk could be a distraction for the team. It's probably how the Nuggets see it. They hope the Knicks will fall under 0.500 and our players will be distracted so Walsh will become desperate. It's really a poker game on both sides.


Yeah I think that's a big factor in this right now. That's why now, more so than at any other time, is the time for this man to earn his contract...

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Re: [Camelo Thread Part 11] - Knicks make offer? Pg 82 

Post#1322 » by Context » Fri Jan 21, 2011 10:30 pm

CHARLYMURPHY wrote:
moocow007 wrote:
How about JR Smith? Not the boyscout that Fields is but Smith is a tough defender, can run the floor, can definitely shoot 3's and is also a great rebounder for a SG. Fitting him salary wise (as far as a trade goes) is the problem if the Knicks must take either Birdman or Harringtons contract in the deal.


I wouldnt mind JR Smith.. But isent his contract up after this year?


Moo answered your question for me. As far as his contract- I am sure he would love to stay :wink:
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Re: [Camelo Thread Part 11] - Knicks make offer? Pg 82 

Post#1323 » by GONYK » Fri Jan 21, 2011 10:34 pm

Knickplaya wrote:
AllanHoustonFan wrote:
knicks742 wrote:This is simply a horrendous first offer IF it is indeed true. Horrendous. You don't offer Chandler and Fields as your first offer, maybe you eventually have to give both of them up but you just set the floor of your offer at Chandler and Fields. Absolutely horrible move.


There first offer was Gallo/Curry/Pick back in September



We can't lowball them and piss them off though.

LOL, of course we can. What are they going to do? Trade him to the Nets again?
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Re: [Camelo Thread Part 11] - Knicks make offer? Pg 82 

Post#1324 » by Knickplaya » Fri Jan 21, 2011 10:34 pm

Would LOVE to get JR Smith back, he'd be filthy here.
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Re: [Camelo Thread Part 11] - Knicks make offer? Pg 82 

Post#1325 » by knicks742 » Fri Jan 21, 2011 10:36 pm

GONYK wrote:LOL, of course we can. What are they going to do? Trade him to the Nets again?


how do you feel about this rumored offer?
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Re: [Camelo Thread Part 11] - Knicks make offer? Pg 82 

Post#1326 » by nykinoz » Fri Jan 21, 2011 10:36 pm

Harrington would at least allow Stat some rest if we took him back. We need some big bodies off the bench, badly.
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Re: [Camelo Thread Part 11] - Knicks make offer? Pg 82 

Post#1327 » by kingmalaki » Fri Jan 21, 2011 10:36 pm

moocow007 wrote:When you have no other real offers what exactly would be considered "lowball"? Obviously you don't want to be insulting, but let's be realistic...it's pretty apparently finally to everyone else and not just many Knick fans (who have known this for months) that he ONLY WANTS TO resign with the Knicks. So unless there is a rental offer out there that is better than it isn't lowballing. And the last thing that the Nuggets FO should be worried about is bering insulted...they've done their share to about a half dozen teams in the NBA already with their schenanigans.


This potential Rockets offer is better than that offer:
- Yao's contract
- one of Hill or Patterson
- one of Lee, Williams or Budinger
- your #1 pick

Especially considering Chandler's upcoming free agency. The Rockets can also take back additional salary, although I don't see us wanting Harrington but either Birdman or Nene, as we need bigs.

You guys should be in the drivers seat unless the Nuggets just want to hold a grudge, but you do have to beat rental offers from teams like Houston. Lowballing won't get it done. The Nuggets are trying to maximize his value. They don't care about how much Melo wants to extend, and if they can get a better rental deal then what NY is offering then they will take it.
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Re: [Camelo Thread Part 11] - Knicks make offer? Pg 82 

Post#1328 » by AllanHoustonFan » Fri Jan 21, 2011 10:38 pm

kingmalaki wrote:
moocow007 wrote:When you have no other real offers what exactly would be considered "lowball"? Obviously you don't want to be insulting, but let's be realistic...it's pretty apparently finally to everyone else and not just many Knick fans (who have known this for months) that he ONLY WANTS TO resign with the Knicks. So unless there is a rental offer out there that is better than it isn't lowballing. And the last thing that the Nuggets FO should be worried about is bering insulted...they've done their share to about a half dozen teams in the NBA already with their schenanigans.


This potential Rockets offer is better than that offer:
- Yao's contract
- one of Hill or Patterson
- one of Lee, Williams or Budinger
- your #1 pick

Especially considering Chandler's upcoming free agency. You guys should be in the drivers seat unless the Nuggets just want to hold a grudge, but you do have to beat rental offers from teams like Houston. Lowballing won't get it done. The Nuggets are trying to maximize his value. They don't care about how much Melo wants to extend, and if they can get a better rental deal then what NY is offering then they will take it.


Do you want to rent Melo? You guys are giving up to much for a player that won't carry that team to the championship.
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Re: [Camelo Thread Part 11] - Knicks make offer? Pg 82 

Post#1329 » by knicks742 » Fri Jan 21, 2011 10:39 pm

kingmalaki wrote:
moocow007 wrote:When you have no other real offers what exactly would be considered "lowball"? Obviously you don't want to be insulting, but let's be realistic...it's pretty apparently finally to everyone else and not just many Knick fans (who have known this for months) that he ONLY WANTS TO resign with the Knicks. So unless there is a rental offer out there that is better than it isn't lowballing. And the last thing that the Nuggets FO should be worried about is bering insulted...they've done their share to about a half dozen teams in the NBA already with their schenanigans.


This potential Rockets offer is better than that offer:
- Yao's contract
- one of Hill or Patterson
- one of Lee, Williams or Budinger
- your #1 pick

Especially considering Chandler's upcoming free agency. You guys should be in the drivers seat unless the Nuggets just want to hold a grudge, but you do have to beat rental offers from teams like Houston. Lowballing won't get it done. The Nuggets are trying to maximize his value. They don't care about how much Melo wants to extend, and if they can get a better rental deal then what NY is offering then they will take it.


Why would you offer all of that to rent him? Do you really think that you are going to make a "profit" and get a better return than what you gave up sign and trading him this summer?
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Re: [Camelo Thread Part 11] - Knicks make offer? Pg 82 

Post#1330 » by kosmovitelli » Fri Jan 21, 2011 10:41 pm

knicks742 wrote:This is simply a horrendous first offer IF it is indeed true. Horrendous. You don't offer Chandler and Fields as your first offer, maybe you eventually have to give both of them up but you just set the floor of your offer at Chandler and Fields. Absolutely horrible move.


We really don't know if it's our first offer. Anyway, even if it's the first, it could be our first and final offer. I doubt Donnie will give up more assets. If you trade Fields, you need a SG and we already need a C. As Randolph, Mozgov, Douglas and Walker have little value right now (and not sure d'Antoni will ever develop them), we could have problems trying to upgrade the roster next summer and in the future (2012 first round pick will be conveyed to Houston and I guess the first round pick is the 2014 first round pick). I think Donnie knows all that. It's also possible Donnie made that offer and leaked it so Melo and the medias know we tried and we can't afford to give more. It's the best offer we could make and that's what we're going to tell Melo and that's probably how he will see things. If you lowball the Nuggets with your offer then Melo could think we're not ready to give up assets for him and he could be more willing to accept to sign an extension with another team. We did set the market and now it's up to the Nuggets to find a better deal and a team where Melo would be willing to sign an extension or they can call Walsh back and accept the trade proposal. Now that we made an offer, the ball is in Denver and Melo's court :
- the Nuggets needs to think hard about that offer because there's a good chance we won't add more assets
- Melo needs to see we tried our best and if the Nuggets don't want to trade him to the Knicks then he should remain with Denver until the end of the season and sign with us as a FA next summer.

The Nuggets and Melo need both to realize we can't afford to give more than Fields, Chandler and pick. And I think they will...Time is probably on our side.
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Re: [Camelo Thread Part 11] - Knicks make offer? Pg 82 

Post#1331 » by kane2021 » Fri Jan 21, 2011 10:41 pm

Too many dudes in this thread pushing off their opinion as fact. Lets discuss what we know. Lets discuss how we feel about it. Lets discuss what we think. Stop pushing your opinions on people like its fact. Dudes swear up and down they know what carmelo is thinking. Or what the team executives are doing. I dont like when people come on strong with their opinion and tell others to stop thinking otherwise.
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Re: [Camelo Thread Part 11] - Knicks make offer? Pg 82 

Post#1332 » by kingmalaki » Fri Jan 21, 2011 10:41 pm

AllanHoustonFan wrote:
kingmalaki wrote:
moocow007 wrote:When you have no other real offers what exactly would be considered "lowball"? Obviously you don't want to be insulting, but let's be realistic...it's pretty apparently finally to everyone else and not just many Knick fans (who have known this for months) that he ONLY WANTS TO resign with the Knicks. So unless there is a rental offer out there that is better than it isn't lowballing. And the last thing that the Nuggets FO should be worried about is bering insulted...they've done their share to about a half dozen teams in the NBA already with their schenanigans.


This potential Rockets offer is better than that offer:
- Yao's contract
- one of Hill or Patterson
- one of Lee, Williams or Budinger
- your #1 pick

Especially considering Chandler's upcoming free agency. You guys should be in the drivers seat unless the Nuggets just want to hold a grudge, but you do have to beat rental offers from teams like Houston. Lowballing won't get it done. The Nuggets are trying to maximize his value. They don't care about how much Melo wants to extend, and if they can get a better rental deal then what NY is offering then they will take it.


Do you want to rent Melo?


Depends on the cost. If it's for a package that I just laid out, which is basically an expiring, redundant players (solid ones, but Patterson and Williams get no PT due to our depth) and a pick that will lose value with Melo in NY, then I say go for it. I don't think we can beat some of the all-in, "full value" NY offers that I have seen in this thread. But the lowball offer that was supposedely rejected....yeah we can top that and not hurt the core of our team.
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Re: [Camelo Thread Part 11] - Knicks make offer? Pg 82 

Post#1333 » by GONYK » Fri Jan 21, 2011 10:42 pm

kingmalaki wrote:
moocow007 wrote:When you have no other real offers what exactly would be considered "lowball"? Obviously you don't want to be insulting, but let's be realistic...it's pretty apparently finally to everyone else and not just many Knick fans (who have known this for months) that he ONLY WANTS TO resign with the Knicks. So unless there is a rental offer out there that is better than it isn't lowballing. And the last thing that the Nuggets FO should be worried about is bering insulted...they've done their share to about a half dozen teams in the NBA already with their schenanigans.


This potential Rockets offer is better than that offer:
- Yao's contract
- one of Hill or Patterson
- one of Lee, Williams or Budinger
- your #1 pick

Especially considering Chandler's upcoming free agency. The Rockets can also take back additional salary, although I don't see us wanting Harrington but either Birdman or Nene, as we need bigs.

You guys should be in the drivers seat unless the Nuggets just want to hold a grudge, but you do have to beat rental offers from teams like Houston. Lowballing won't get it done. The Nuggets are trying to maximize his value. They don't care about how much Melo wants to extend, and if they can get a better rental deal then what NY is offering then they will take it.

That is NOT the Rocket's rental offer
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Re: [Camelo Thread Part 11] - Knicks make offer? Pg 82 

Post#1334 » by GONYK » Fri Jan 21, 2011 10:43 pm

knicks742 wrote:
GONYK wrote:LOL, of course we can. What are they going to do? Trade him to the Nets again?


how do you feel about this rumored offer?

The rumored offer is ok, provided we get JR Smith back
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Re: [Camelo Thread Part 11] - Knicks make offer? Pg 82 

Post#1335 » by kingmalaki » Fri Jan 21, 2011 10:44 pm

knicks742 wrote:
kingmalaki wrote:
moocow007 wrote:When you have no other real offers what exactly would be considered "lowball"? Obviously you don't want to be insulting, but let's be realistic...it's pretty apparently finally to everyone else and not just many Knick fans (who have known this for months) that he ONLY WANTS TO resign with the Knicks. So unless there is a rental offer out there that is better than it isn't lowballing. And the last thing that the Nuggets FO should be worried about is bering insulted...they've done their share to about a half dozen teams in the NBA already with their schenanigans.


This potential Rockets offer is better than that offer:
- Yao's contract
- one of Hill or Patterson
- one of Lee, Williams or Budinger
- your #1 pick

Especially considering Chandler's upcoming free agency. You guys should be in the drivers seat unless the Nuggets just want to hold a grudge, but you do have to beat rental offers from teams like Houston. Lowballing won't get it done. The Nuggets are trying to maximize his value. They don't care about how much Melo wants to extend, and if they can get a better rental deal then what NY is offering then they will take it.


Why would you offer all of that to rent him? Do you really think that you are going to make a "profit" and get a better return than what you gave up sign and trading him this summer?


That sounds like a lot but it's not because our young players are redundant. We lack stars but have plenty of quality players at every position but center, so guys like Patterson, Hill, Williams, Lee, Bud are fighting for minutes and they all aren't playing. Trading quality unused depth basically. Yes, I think that type of offer would be worth renting Melo and possibly getting something from him going to NY this summer. No, I don't think he will leave his $$ on the table.
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Re: [Camelo Thread Part 11] - Knicks make offer? Pg 82 

Post#1336 » by Jitpal » Fri Jan 21, 2011 10:45 pm

You figure if the Nuggets are so reluctant to taking Chandler, there is a 3rd team out there that will for a player Denver wants and possibly a 1st. Then the package to Denver would become Fields, Mystery Player and 2 1sts. Which is probably what Walsh is going for. Interestingly, by Walsh admitting that he plans on resigning Chandler, it might make a GM want to acquire him now via trade instead of having to overpay him in the summer to prevent the Knicks from matching. -Jitpal
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Re: [Camelo Thread Part 11] - Knicks make offer? Pg 82 

Post#1337 » by moocow007 » Fri Jan 21, 2011 10:46 pm

kingmalaki wrote:
moocow007 wrote:When you have no other real offers what exactly would be considered "lowball"? Obviously you don't want to be insulting, but let's be realistic...it's pretty apparently finally to everyone else and not just many Knick fans (who have known this for months) that he ONLY WANTS TO resign with the Knicks. So unless there is a rental offer out there that is better than it isn't lowballing. And the last thing that the Nuggets FO should be worried about is bering insulted...they've done their share to about a half dozen teams in the NBA already with their schenanigans.


This potential Rockets offer is better than that offer:
- Yao's contract
- one of Hill or Patterson
- one of Lee, Williams or Budinger
- your #1 pick

Especially considering Chandler's upcoming free agency. You guys should be in the drivers seat unless the Nuggets just want to hold a grudge, but you do have to beat rental offers from teams like Houston. Lowballing won't get it done. The Nuggets are trying to maximize his value. They don't care about how much Melo wants to extend, and if they can get a better rental deal then what NY is offering then they will take it.


What exactly was the original package again?

But as far as your proposed Rocket rental package?

1. And you are assuming that the Rockets are willing to offer this because?

2. Even if they do...

Jordan Hill has all the earmarks of a Kwame Brown like journeyman and Patrick Patterson has done what exactly in the NBA again? Having either as component one of a deal doesn't make it good.

Courtney Lee is another guy that doesn't have really any refined basketball skills and, if he's not playing with stud players around him to take the focus away from him really struggle to get his shot.

The Rockets aren't going to include Terrence Williams or Budinger as a component of a 40 game rental.

And our pick in 2012? If we assume that Melo will be with the team by then how good exactly will it be?

And what about considering the rather obvious fact that Chandler is FAR BETTER than any of the players mentioned in the rental?
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Re: [Camelo Thread Part 11] - Knicks make offer? Pg 82 

Post#1338 » by kingmalaki » Fri Jan 21, 2011 10:47 pm

GONYK wrote:
kingmalaki wrote:
moocow007 wrote:When you have no other real offers what exactly would be considered "lowball"? Obviously you don't want to be insulting, but let's be realistic...it's pretty apparently finally to everyone else and not just many Knick fans (who have known this for months) that he ONLY WANTS TO resign with the Knicks. So unless there is a rental offer out there that is better than it isn't lowballing. And the last thing that the Nuggets FO should be worried about is bering insulted...they've done their share to about a half dozen teams in the NBA already with their schenanigans.


This potential Rockets offer is better than that offer:
- Yao's contract
- one of Hill or Patterson
- one of Lee, Williams or Budinger
- your #1 pick

Especially considering Chandler's upcoming free agency. The Rockets can also take back additional salary, although I don't see us wanting Harrington but either Birdman or Nene, as we need bigs.

You guys should be in the drivers seat unless the Nuggets just want to hold a grudge, but you do have to beat rental offers from teams like Houston. Lowballing won't get it done. The Nuggets are trying to maximize his value. They don't care about how much Melo wants to extend, and if they can get a better rental deal then what NY is offering then they will take it.

That is NOT the Rocket's rental offer


No one knows what the Rockets rental offer is. If you know please share and let us know how you found out.
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Re: [Camelo Thread Part 11] - Knicks make offer? Pg 82 

Post#1339 » by moocow007 » Fri Jan 21, 2011 10:48 pm

knicks742 wrote:
kingmalaki wrote:
moocow007 wrote:When you have no other real offers what exactly would be considered "lowball"? Obviously you don't want to be insulting, but let's be realistic...it's pretty apparently finally to everyone else and not just many Knick fans (who have known this for months) that he ONLY WANTS TO resign with the Knicks. So unless there is a rental offer out there that is better than it isn't lowballing. And the last thing that the Nuggets FO should be worried about is bering insulted...they've done their share to about a half dozen teams in the NBA already with their schenanigans.


This potential Rockets offer is better than that offer:
- Yao's contract
- one of Hill or Patterson
- one of Lee, Williams or Budinger
- your #1 pick

Especially considering Chandler's upcoming free agency. You guys should be in the drivers seat unless the Nuggets just want to hold a grudge, but you do have to beat rental offers from teams like Houston. Lowballing won't get it done. The Nuggets are trying to maximize his value. They don't care about how much Melo wants to extend, and if they can get a better rental deal then what NY is offering then they will take it.


Why would you offer all of that to rent him? Do you really think that you are going to make a "profit" and get a better return than what you gave up sign and trading him this summer?


They likely wouldn't. He's just using that unlikely package to try to argue why the Knicks offer isn't lowballing.
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Re: [Camelo Thread Part 11] - Knicks make offer? Pg 82 

Post#1340 » by CHARLYMURPHY » Fri Jan 21, 2011 10:48 pm

GONYK wrote:
knicks742 wrote:
GONYK wrote:LOL, of course we can. What are they going to do? Trade him to the Nets again?


how do you feel about this rumored offer?

The rumored offer is ok, provided we get JR Smith back
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