[Game 42] - SUNS @ PISTONS - POLL ADDED!

Wannabe MEP · Post #341 » by **Wannabe MEP** » Sun Jan 23, 2011 1:21 pm

For a stretch at the end of the fourth quarter that lasted more than six minutes, we scored exactly 3 points.

Why?

In part because...we went away from four-out with four 3-point shooters. Warrick came in for Frye, then Hill came in for Dudley, and we had only two 3-point shooters on the court. Four-out with four 3-point shooters built the lead.

NiGhtWiSh · Post #342 » by **NiGhtWiSh** » Sun Jan 23, 2011 1:45 pm

You can't win more than 1 of 5,6 games with 3-pointers. That's for sure.

Hopefully, I can see a huge improvement in team defense. The game in Mo-Town wasn't so low-scored thanks only to sucking Pistons. It was solid D from Suns for almost all the game. We lost 'couse our players got tired after such running in first 3 quarters. They seemed to be not familiar witch such effort on the court. And, in the 4 qt Gentry loosed his mind. The only DET player who wanted badly yto compete, Bynum, killed all Suns. Reason? No D at PG spot. Bad help, providing Daye open shots and Wilcox easy inside baskets.

It showed perfectly that our old guys (Nash, Hill) are useless in day-by-day competition. It's about stamina and tiredness. I can clearly predict that even if Suns will make PO, we will loose in 1st round. For that reason. Nash/Hill can play 2-3 games well, and will suffer in 2-3 next games.

Other thing: coaching. Well, after all, I can see Kokoskov hand on the team. But still, it's Gentry running games. It's him, as well as stupid Frye, who gave victory to DET. It's proven, that when a team looses a close game in last minutes, it's always coach's foult. Suns just needed put the ball inside or drive with power in last play, looking for 2+1, and NOT a shoot from the arc. Timeout was called before technical, but still, Gentry haved all time in the world to say 4 words: WE PLAY FOR 2 pts...

Finally: Nash is useless against teams with physical PG. He lost to Felton in NY, he played like a junior against Bynum, too. Shame on Gentry for not playing two PG in last quarter. Dragić on Bynum, Nash on anybody else in D...

I'm going to watch game again today, so later i'll have more observations.

Frank Lee · Post #343 » by **Frank Lee** » Sun Jan 23, 2011 2:04 pm

Such love being tossed around.

This was a team loss. Coach included. Our vets (Nash, Hill, Carter) we tired and their shooting showed it (surprise?). Frye had his standard 'I'm am not a good as you think I am' game (another surprise?)

Gentry really had no answers to what Detroit was doing to us defensively, and mismanaged the last part of the game, as mentioned here by DaRK

I blame Gentry for not getting Dragic in the game in the 4th. Nash could've really used some help to handle the ball when he was getting doubled by Bynum.

May be even Hill could have helped... but in reality, we do not have too many good ball handlers.

and Miklo with one

........ What I WILL criticize him on is letting 13 second run off the 24 seconds left in the game before telling Nash to foul. I was shocked and super pissed. FIRST, we would have had 3 seconds and change if we'd just gotten a stop. Second, we could have fouled...right away. Then had 24 seconds to screw around and get back into it.

actually 17 seconds ticked off...then an intentional foul with 11 left. a complete WTF ALVIN moment.

and this is the summarizing comment.... by 2Irish

What lost the game was our team as a whole. We aren't mentally strong enough to go on winning streakes. The best we can hope for is winning three to our one loss. We aren't tough enough, and we're too old to win that many in a row.

We have no killer out there that really wants the ball at crunchtime. I'm trying to think if Dudley or Frye have ever hit a game winner? Hill ? dont remember... Nash had to have the most recent.... but how long ago? Like we have 1 collective nut from 5pair when the game is on the line. Frye had no prob chucking it, but he was so puckered up he passed on a better shot.

Oh well, I suppose we will continue to have games like this. We just are not that good, making it easy for resident bosstradamus and imperial wizard of obvious thought, JMac to feather his ever expanding cap. I hope he can displant his lips from Red Robin's rearend long enough to pat himself on the back. Dude... you are not nearly as revolutionary with your thoughts as you think. Pity you choose abrasion as your method of delivery.

I'm going to watch game again today, so later i'll have more observations.

Jeez Nwish... you sure you want to??/

Calvin Klein · Post #344 » by **Calvin Klein** » Sun Jan 23, 2011 2:09 pm

This has been one of the ugliest games I've ever watched. From the tip off.

I vote Gentry because I am SURE he is the one telling Frye to keep shooting and setting up the last play for him (and he keeps doing that even though Frye has never made it). He is also the one NOT playing Dragic and keeping sucky Carter in there.

NiGhtWiSh · Post #345 » by **NiGhtWiSh** » Sun Jan 23, 2011 2:12 pm

Frank Lee wrote:
I'm going to watch game again today, so later i'll have more observations.

Jeez Nwish... you sure you want to??/

i 'm a pervert, loving watch lost games :lol:

And, to be serious, i love basketball. I like details. This game was full of details. It helps to improve my own knowledge and uderstanding of the game. But, if you guys want, i can easily stop posting about this game

Manocad · Post #346 » by **Manocad** » Sun Jan 23, 2011 2:20 pm

Dalerax wrote:
ginobiliflops wrote:
drsimp12 wrote:

A pistons troll? Really? Really?

Eh, let him have his. Being a Pistons fan, he doesn't get many opportunities like this.

drsimp12 is not a Pistons poster.

Don't assume that because you get laughed at for making smug prediction, the person laughing is a fan of the opposing team. It can be anyone who thinks you shouldn't be so smug with your predictions.

JMac1 · Post #347 » by **JMac1** » Sun Jan 23, 2011 4:50 pm

Frank Lee wrote:Oh well, I suppose we will continue to have games like this. We just are not that good, making it easy for resident bosstradamus and imperial wizard of obvious thought, JMac to feather his ever expanding cap. I hope he can displant his lips from Red Robin's rearend long enough to pat himself on the back. Dude... you are not nearly as revolutionary with your thoughts as you think. Pity you choose abrasion as your method of delivery.

(ruefully at the game) :lol:

(hearty at your post)

1. I would not have had to do the old perverbial "I told you so" if Ginobli wouldn't have badgered me during the Wash game. I took that display of insolence to heart.

2. Not one person spoke of the obvious until after tonights game' everyone was caught up in Gortat's double double and win more than they were the need for someone who could score close to the basket without a Nash assist.

3. I am as pissed as everyone here, but I could care less than some because I have made peace with this ownership, lack of talent, and lack of FO desire to develop young guys for a futile playoff push!

Trading Clark, not playing Childress, and playing Lopez 14mins a game has made me callous to these loses and the ineptness of this organization. If and when we win, it will be to my amazement and delight.

Go Suns....even if watching you means complete boredome....75-74... WTF HAPPENED TO US!?

NiGhtWiSh · Post #348 » by **NiGhtWiSh** » Sun Jan 23, 2011 5:25 pm

Watch carefully 4th quarter. How many times Gortat was 1st in fastbreak under Pistons basket, desperately waiting for a pass. No way. No single one pass. Sorry. One. Too late. Gortat gave the ball to someone behind the arc, who made a brick...

And those bricks were falling one after one. Boing. Boing. Boing. Finally, Gortat started run to fastbreak, being fastest on the court, but at the FT line he slowed with head down. And Suns passed the ball 20-22 seconds and somebody shooted a brick. Or turned the ball over. Or the brick landed just after first or second pass of the play... Forget about offensive boxing out etc.

Team was absolutely out of control. Dudley tryied to handle the ball, but he is not a ballhandler. Nash - too tired and with D-glove on him. Wow... Wow again. And again.

JasonDaPsycho · Post #349 » by **JasonDaPsycho** » Sun Jan 23, 2011 5:35 pm

I feel you JMac. *high five*
Still can't believe we made it to the WCF last year only to have this year seeing games being won as something that's not expected.
Life of being a Suns fan.

RvM · Post #350 » by **RvM** » Sun Jan 23, 2011 6:16 pm

It was bound to happen. We were riding a 5 game winning streak, and it was a back to back and the team eased up when we had that big lead.

That's why I put some blame for Gentry. He should be the ones motivating this team to put the foot on the pedal and not ease up in the 4th!! You have Nash that's being double team the entire game, put in Dragic to have another ball handler!! And why of all times would you just put in Pietrus at a random time? I didn't see him do anything remotely helpful.

It's a tough loss,but we are only 1.5 games out of the playoffs. We have two more winnable games before facing Boston, and we can reach 22-22. That'd be a huge accomplishment and people thought we wouldn't even win 4 on our roadtrip.

Channing Frye had a miserable game, so did Vince. He's been pretty lackadaisical since the knicks game. Grant Hill wasn't hitting anything and only Duds and Gortat played well.

It's to be expected. Just got to move on and focus on Philly.

Herman4MVP · Post #351 » by **Herman4MVP** » Sun Jan 23, 2011 8:22 pm

RvM wrote:It's a tough loss,but we are only 1.5 games out of the playoffs. We have two more winnable games before facing Boston, and we can reach 22-22. That'd be a huge accomplishment and people thought we wouldn't even win 4 on our roadtrip.

It's to be expected. Just got to move on and focus on Philly.

We should stop pretending there's still hope. Really, there is no way we make the playoffs when we are struggling against lower teams like the Pistons and all the other Western teams keep winning.

Sure it was nice to win some games again - finally some reason to watch these games again, but it was a sure thing to come we would fall again soon. What are we gonna do against a contender in this kind of shape? We will get blown out, that's what's gonna happen.

No matter how much some users seem to hate the idea of tanking - it is happening right now!
Not officially or planned but in the back of the players heads. It's a psychological thing - we know we are not good enough, don't have the needed inside scorer and won't stand a chance against San Antonio, L.A. etc.

The players know it, the coach knows it and we all know it if we are honestly reviewing this season so far. So let's just have some fun games, some wins and hope we get lucky to get some kind of player in the draft. OR hope for another trade that makes us somehow better.

BUT - season is over. End of story.

Dalerax · Post #352 » by **Dalerax** » Sun Jan 23, 2011 8:34 pm

Manocad wrote:Don't assume that because you get laughed at for making smug prediction, the person laughing is a fan of the opposing team. It can be anyone who thinks you shouldn't be so smug with your predictions.

Smug? God forbid I express confidence in my team winning.

RunDogGun · Post #353 » by **RunDogGun** » Sun Jan 23, 2011 9:22 pm

I wouldn't call it smug, but we should never think that any team will be easy to beat. Our coach will find ways to let the other team back into the game. It seems like Gentry has forgotten all the things that D'Antoni did wrong here.

Dalerax · Post #354 » by **Dalerax** » Sun Jan 23, 2011 9:23 pm

RunDogGun wrote:I wouldn't call it smug, but we should never think that any team will be easy to beat. Our coach will find ways to let the other team back into the game. It seems like Gentry has forgotten all the things that D'Antoni did wrong here.

Unfortunately, you're absolutely right.

RvM · Post #355 » by **RvM** » Sun Jan 23, 2011 9:28 pm

Herman4MVP wrote:
RvM wrote:It's a tough loss,but we are only 1.5 games out of the playoffs. We have two more winnable games before facing Boston, and we can reach 22-22. That'd be a huge accomplishment and people thought we wouldn't even win 4 on our roadtrip.

It's to be expected. Just got to move on and focus on Philly.

We should stop pretending there's still hope. Really, there is no way we make the playoffs when we are struggling against lower teams like the Pistons and all the other Western teams keep winning.

Sure it was nice to win some games again - finally some reason to watch these games again, but it was a sure thing to come we would fall again soon. What are we gonna do against a contender in this kind of shape? We will get blown out, that's what's gonna happen.

No matter how much some users seem to hate the idea of tanking - it is happening right now!
Not officially or planned but in the back of the players heads. It's a psychological thing - we know we are not good enough, don't have the needed inside scorer and won't stand a chance against San Antonio, L.A. etc.

The players know it, the coach knows it and we all know it if we are honestly reviewing this season so far. So let's just have some fun games, some wins and hope we get lucky to get some kind of player in the draft. OR hope for another trade that makes us somehow better.

BUT - season is over. End of story.

?
If we really are tanking, it sure doesn't look like it. We were on a 5 game W streak, and we were about to win our 6th until that horrible mental breakdown in the 4th. Why tank now when we have a better chance at the playoffs than getting a Top 8th draft pick. I mean, we have Vince and Nash who both could quite possibly be gone after the season (or trade deadline) and after one loss, it's back to tanking?

We faced and beat some quality teams in the Knicks and Blazers in our run, and we could possibly be back to .500 when we face Boston next friday. I wouldn't give up right now just because of one game. Do you really think our players "feel" like they are tanking? Does Steve Nash? The guy is being a class act by staying loyal to his team and if he wants that ring he has at least a 0.1% chance of winning one as the 8th seed than just tanking when we can't do much worse than what the Kings and Wolves are producing.

Sundamental · Post #356 » by **Sundamental** » Sun Jan 23, 2011 10:25 pm

RvM wrote:
Herman4MVP wrote:
RvM wrote:It's a tough loss,but we are only 1.5 games out of the playoffs. We have two more winnable games before facing Boston, and we can reach 22-22. That'd be a huge accomplishment and people thought we wouldn't even win 4 on our roadtrip.

It's to be expected. Just got to move on and focus on Philly.

We should stop pretending there's still hope. Really, there is no way we make the playoffs when we are struggling against lower teams like the Pistons and all the other Western teams keep winning.

Sure it was nice to win some games again - finally some reason to watch these games again, but it was a sure thing to come we would fall again soon. What are we gonna do against a contender in this kind of shape? We will get blown out, that's what's gonna happen.

No matter how much some users seem to hate the idea of tanking - it is happening right now!
Not officially or planned but in the back of the players heads. It's a psychological thing - we know we are not good enough, don't have the needed inside scorer and won't stand a chance against San Antonio, L.A. etc.

The players know it, the coach knows it and we all know it if we are honestly reviewing this season so far. So let's just have some fun games, some wins and hope we get lucky to get some kind of player in the draft. OR hope for another trade that makes us somehow better.

BUT - season is over. End of story.

?
If we really are tanking, it sure doesn't look like it. We were on a 5 game W streak, and we were about to win our 6th until that horrible mental breakdown in the 4th. Why tank now when we have a better chance at the playoffs than getting a Top 8th draft pick. I mean, we have Vince and Nash who both could quite possibly be gone after the season (or trade deadline) and after one loss, it's back to tanking?

We faced and beat some quality teams in the Knicks and Blazers in our run, and we could possibly be back to .500 when we face Boston next friday. I wouldn't give up right now just because of one game. Do you really think our players "feel" like they are tanking? Does Steve Nash? The guy is being a class act by staying loyal to his team and if he wants that ring he has at least a 0.1% chance of winning one as the 8th seed than just tanking when we can't do much worse than what the Kings and Wolves are producing.

I certainly agree with Herman's point in general but perhaps not how it was stated. To me, the Suns chances of making the playoffs are quite slim. Hollinger's computer puts the chances at 10.2%. I think that's quite fair.

http://espn.go.com/nba/hollinger/playoffodds

Everyone is optimistic becasue of the 5 game streak but look at who they beat. According to Hollinger again, they beat numbers 12, 14, 28, 29 and 30. Five of those wins came against the three worst teams in the league. And the Knicks are kind of falling apart. I'm not saying to tank or to just give up but I think a realistic playoff run is quite hopeful.

JohnVancouver · Post #357 » by **JohnVancouver** » Sun Jan 23, 2011 11:58 pm

Kerrsed wrote:
The Blazers have expressed interest in Anthony Randolph, even though they are "not getting great reports" about the Knicks' 21-year-old forward.

http://www.rotoworld.com/content/playerpages/playerbreakingnews.asp?sport=NBA&id=1515&line=150538&spln=1

If they didn't like Fry, they'll hate AR.

JohnVancouver · Post #358 » by **JohnVancouver** » Mon Jan 24, 2011 12:15 am

By God, that was a tough one to watch - a completely crap game until it got close at the end and then we just fell apart. Terrible.

Some true WTF? moments - why Pietrus, who hadn't seen the floor in how long? Think he might have been a bit stale and cold to come in at that point? No Dragic? As astute board members pointed out, it surely could not have hurt having him on in the backcourt with Steve to relieve pressure.
Yes, nice pick by Hak but at the same time we saw another one of his mad "Wheeeee!" moments driving to the hoop and inevitable wild carom off the backboard back out to the 3-pt line. G-damn Son of Flubber Man

what was good? The defense was not bad at all - nothing you can do about a guy shooting like Bynum was. We played good team D, lots of help, showed some nuts. I have no problem with the last play either - not what I would have drawn up and I have no problem with Frye taking it. He shot miserably prior but sometimes a coach has to show belief in a guy, even knowing he'll likely miss. If he thought showing confidence in Frye was worth it, I back Alvin.

Sucked to lose it but I really have no great emotion about losing it, other than a bad taste in *how* we lost it. We lost it more that they won it ... I've made my peace with the notion that this is not a playoff team and in a way I'm glad we lost if it means the FO can't start believing this roster is good enough.
I'd rather take chances winning the lotto than just play for 8th seed and out in four straight.

chillinlikeavillain · Post #359 » by **chillinlikeavillain** » Mon Jan 24, 2011 12:51 am

Just because there's been so much negativity in this thread, I'm going to list all the positives.

1. Defense. Even though the Pistons are a pretty bad offensive team, the Suns played staunch defense and didn't give up any easy points. Frye, who had the worst night of anyone, made a pretty big contribution on the defensive end, grabbing boards and helping on D. Hill and Carter also made a big difference on the defensive end... they all missed shots but its not like they weren't trying.

2. Gortat. The more time he's played with the Suns, the better he has become. A young centre on a reasonable contract who can block shots and rebound? With continued improvement on offense Gortat is looking like a huge steal in the trade.

3. Playing hard on the road, second night of B2B. Given the age of Nash/Carter/Hill, I was impressed with the energy and hustle these guys all put in. Even a supposed slacker like Carter was crashing the glass and playing great help D. While the collapse sucked, up until the 3rd the Suns were grinding out a game in a way that no one would expect them to (no fastbreak, tough D). This is nowhere near the level of letdown that Sacramento game was... not even close.

4. Dragic and Dudley. Both guys played very well in their limited minutes.

JohnVancouver · Post #360 » by **JohnVancouver** » Mon Jan 24, 2011 6:08 am

chillinlikeavillain wrote:Just because there's been so much negativity in this thread, I'm going to list all the positives.

1. Defense. Even though the Pistons are a pretty bad offensive team, the Suns played staunch defense and didn't give up any easy points. Frye, who had the worst night of anyone, made a pretty big contribution on the defensive end, grabbing boards and helping on D. Hill and Carter also made a big difference on the defensive end... they all missed shots but its not like they weren't trying.

2. Gortat. The more time he's played with the Suns, the better he has become. A young centre on a reasonable contract who can block shots and rebound? With continued improvement on offense Gortat is looking like a huge steal in the trade.

3. Playing hard on the road, second night of B2B. Given the age of Nash/Carter/Hill, I was impressed with the energy and hustle these guys all put in. Even a supposed slacker like Carter was crashing the glass and playing great help D. While the collapse sucked, up until the 3rd the Suns were grinding out a game in a way that no one would expect them to (no fastbreak, tough D). This is nowhere near the level of letdown that Sacramento game was... not even close.

4. Dragic and Dudley. Both guys played very well in their limited minutes.

Al true, and none of it changes my contention that we are a mediocre team with little to no playoff potential. I just don't see it, not in the West. I'm not jumping off the bandwagon or turning on my guys, just trying to make peace with reality. Better days will come, but not this week

Who blew it for us tonight?