Miami is #1, did you think it would happen this quickly?

[cloud king]

Knicks absolutely did not deserve to win, they shot like 30% with wide open looks, were 7-36 from the 3 at some point and took horrible shots down the stretch until they got a couple of 3s to go down

of course, the Heat didnt deserve to win either, that was horrible iso ball shots with no chance for rebounds from Lebron and Wade, and then they actually drew up a play for some role player who was barely in the game offensively in the 4th to make a 3

[YFZblu]

I wish Spoelstra would have totally gone off Lebron on national television. This isn't Spoelstra's fault, Lebron is just dumb and thinks he can do it all. I don't even think a coach like Pops or Jackson can get through to Lebron.

Last night's LeBron debacle is what happens when a coach says "play defense, and you can do whatever you want offensively"...

[coldfish]

Way too much is made out of single games. It frequently happens that a bad team beats a good team. That's why you play 82 games because it all evens out and the true top teams end up with the best records.

Nothing to see here. The reality is that half the season is over and in the east, you have 4 teams relatively closely bunched who have now all dealt with varying degrees of injury problems. The biggest impact of the Knicks-Heat game isn't some long term meaning of where either team is. The big impact is that the top 4 in the east are going to finish really close. One loss might mean losing HCA in the second round.

[omerome]

Knicks absolutely did not deserve to win, they shot like 30% with wide open looks, were 7-36 from the 3 at some point and took horrible shots down the stretch until they got a couple of 3s to go down

of course, the Heat didnt deserve to win either, that was horrible iso ball shots with no chance for rebounds from Lebron and Wade, and then they actually drew up a play for some role player who was barely in the game offensively in the 4th to make a 3

So if the Knicks didn't deserve to win because of poor shooting and the Heat didn't deserve to win because of ISO plays? Who should win?

Should it be deemed a draw?

[cloud king]

Knicks absolutely did not deserve to win, they shot like 30% with wide open looks, were 7-36 from the 3 at some point and took horrible shots down the stretch until they got a couple of 3s to go down

of course, the Heat didnt deserve to win either, that was horrible iso ball shots with no chance for rebounds from Lebron and Wade, and then they actually drew up a play for some role player who was barely in the game offensively in the 4th to make a 3

So if the Knicks didn't deserve to win because of poor shooting and the Heat didn't deserve to win because of ISO plays? Who should win?

Should it be deemed a draw?

whoever wins wins, but clearly neither team deserved to win because they didn't play good basketball

[bruddahmanmatt]

Knicks deserved the win, I'm glad Spoesltra's offense or lack thereof was exposed on national tv. LeBron being cold and everyone else not being able to score on the Knicks was comical.Heat have probably reverted to 9-8 Heat with Le-iso and pounding the ball. Wade does a better job of moving without the ball and making quick decisions,LeBron... not so much, his post game needs A LOT of work as well for this team to be better.

It's funny. You clowns all jump on Wade's nuts when he's doing what, ISOlating and putting up points on 13-14 shooting, BUT, when LBJ tries to copycat and FAILs miserably because his post game sucks ass, it's Spoelstra's fault for not implementing more motion within the offense. Some of you folks who continually blame your coach and continue to make excuses for your "star" player need a slap in the face to wake you up. When Bryant makes bad decisions and takes bad shots like he did against the Spurs this year, you don't see us Laker fans pointing the finger at Phil Jackson. What is it with you folks being incapable of holding the PLAYERS accountable. I guess LBJ's penchant for excuses is contagious.

[WD]

We didn't play a good game last night

[illiance]

It is very interesting that the top 2 players in the NBA (using PER) cannot beat a middling .500 team in the Eastern conference that plays no defense. Granted Bosh was hurt but it surely shows some weakness, especially in their inability to have ball movement when the game gets close in the 4th. If nothing else, it's something to keep an eye out for.

Knicks deserved the win, I'm glad Spoesltra's offense or lack thereof was exposed on national tv. LeBron being cold and everyone else not being able to score on the Knicks was comical.Heat have probably reverted to 9-8 Heat with Le-iso and pounding the ball. Wade does a better job of moving without the ball and making quick decisions,LeBron... not so much, his post game needs A LOT of work as well for this team to be better.

didn't get to see the game, but dam how the hell does a guy with migranes all week along out perform a guy who is suppose to be the #1 player in the league? I dont know who guarded James but I can't imagine anyone of any significance on NYK that play much of any D to being with.

LeBron started and played PF most of the game. Because of this, he felt the need to work down in the post a lot. This led to him forcing up terrible, awkward shots that often wouldn't even hit the rim. This took him out of his rhythm early and he never recovered. By the 4th, he was so miffed by his struggles, that he looked for his offense on every possession by pounding the ball for 20 seconds without even looking for teammates. The announcers continuely called him out on this too.

I'm not sure why some Miami fans blame the coach. Sure Spo could have pubically embarassed Bron on national TV by yanking him out of the game but you can't do that to the best player on your team because it's a player's league and the coach will be gone before the player. Tha game was clearly on LeBron for letting his emotions control his game.

[Chosen01]

Knicks deserved the win, I'm glad Spoesltra's offense or lack thereof was exposed on national tv. LeBron being cold and everyone else not being able to score on the Knicks was comical.Heat have probably reverted to 9-8 Heat with Le-iso and pounding the ball. Wade does a better job of moving without the ball and making quick decisions,LeBron... not so much, his post game needs A LOT of work as well for this team to be better.

It's funny. You clowns all jump on Wade's nuts when he's doing what, ISOlating and putting up points on 13-14 shooting, BUT, when LBJ tries to copycat and FAILs miserably because his post game sucks ass, it's Spoelstra's fault for not implementing more motion within the offense. Some of you folks who continually blame your coach and continue to make excuses for your "star" player need a slap in the face to wake you up. When Bryant makes bad decisions and takes bad shots like he did against the Spurs this year, you don't see us Laker fans pointing the finger at Phil Jackson. What is it with you folks being incapable of holding the PLAYERS accountable. I guess LBJ's penchant for excuses is contagious.

Um no. Everyone was responsible for it in the 9-8 start but Wade has always been better playing the post, moving without the ball and making quick decisions.I have no problem calling out both players, Wade is so lazy on defense even though we all know he can be beast on the defensive end, he always has to chuck stupid 3s when unnecessary and is always bitching for calls.Each superstar has their own faults.

Spoesltra has no offense planned, When Wade and LeBron get the rebound its up to them to decide what them want to do on the offense, it was even said in an interview.Obviously Heat went with Wade because he was the only one making anything and even then when Wade was scoring 13 straight he wasn't constantly pounding the ball looking to force the action he ws assisted by LeBron twice once cutting(moving without the ball) and another from a fast break. He is also quick on what he wants to do if its drive or shoot. LeBron was forcing the issues when he knew he was off and he had a bad ankle.Spoesltra is clueless, if you watched the game, you'd see there was no offense, that is coach's job not the players. He has to be the only coach in the nba that can't get an easy two points out of a timeout.He took out Wade 2 minutes remaining in the 3rd despite him not missing a shot in 13 possessions, that was beyond stupid and even the tnt commentators were calling him out.What happens in the 4th? Wade becomes cold and out of rhythm.

I've been calling out Spoesltra for the past 2 years so don't come here talking like I call him out when Heat lose because I call his ass out every game since him sitting out Beasley for UD since he was hired head coach.

[bruddahmanmatt]

Knicks deserved the win, I'm glad Spoesltra's offense or lack thereof was exposed on national tv. LeBron being cold and everyone else not being able to score on the Knicks was comical.Heat have probably reverted to 9-8 Heat with Le-iso and pounding the ball. Wade does a better job of moving without the ball and making quick decisions,LeBron... not so much, his post game needs A LOT of work as well for this team to be better.

It's funny. You clowns all jump on Wade's nuts when he's doing what, ISOlating and putting up points on 13-14 shooting, BUT, when LBJ tries to copycat and FAILs miserably because his post game sucks ass, it's Spoelstra's fault for not implementing more motion within the offense. Some of you folks who continually blame your coach and continue to make excuses for your "star" player need a slap in the face to wake you up. When Bryant makes bad decisions and takes bad shots like he did against the Spurs this year, you don't see us Laker fans pointing the finger at Phil Jackson. What is it with you folks being incapable of holding the PLAYERS accountable. I guess LBJ's penchant for excuses is contagious.

Um no. Everyone was responsible for it in the 9-8 start but Wade has always been better playing the post, moving without the ball and making quick decisions.I have no problem calling out both players, Wade is so lazy on defense even though we all know he can be beast on the defensive end, he always has to chuck stupid 3s when unnecessary and is always bitching for calls.Each superstar has their own faults.

Spoesltra has no offense planned, When Wade and LeBron get the rebound its up to them to decide what them want to do on the offense, it was even said in an interview.Obviously Heat went with Wade because he was the only one making anything and even then when Wade was scoring 13 straight he wasn't constantly pounding the ball looking to force the action he ws assisted by LeBron twice once cutting(moving without the ball) and another from a fast break. He is also quick on what he wants to do if its drive or shoot. LeBron was forcing the issues when he knew he was off and he had a bad ankle.Spoesltra is clueless, if you watched the game, you'd see there was no offense, that is coach's job not the players. He has to be the only coach in the nba that can't get an easy two points out of a timeout.He took out Wade 2 minutes remaining in the 3rd despite him not missing a shot in 13 possessions, that was beyond stupid and even the tnt commentators were calling him out.What happens in the 4th? Wade becomes cold and out of rhythm.

I've been calling out Spoesltra for the past 2 years so don't come here talking like I call him out when Heat lose because I call his ass out every game since him sitting out Beasley for UD since he was hired head coach.

My point is that you folks only throw up Erik's name when things are going bad. When all is going well and you're pounding on scrub teams it's "OMFG WE HAVE T3H TWO BESTEST PLAYAZ W00TZ, HOW R DEY GOING 2 STOP US??!!!??"

If you folks really wanted to b**** and moan about Spoelstra last night you should have been complaining not just when LBJ was missing his shots, but when Wade was making his as well since both guys were doing the exact same thing out there on the floor, it just so happened that one guy was hitting his shots while the other wasn't. HOWEVER, all I saw were comments about how Wade is a beast and how he should "rock those glasses every night". When things were going well last night, NOT ONCE did I see ANYONE complaining about how Spoelstra didn't have a problem with Wade playing 1v1. My point is that if you wanna piss and moan about Erik's offensive schemes, then you should still be doing so even when the shots are falling since technically those made baskets are nothing more than fools gold as we all witnessed last night when the shots finally stopped going in. Of course, that's never the case with most of you. LeBron bricks shot after shot five feet from the rim because he has NO LOW POST GAME and all I see are comments about "F you Erik". Come on man.

I'm not saying that Spoelstra's offense (or lack thereof) isn't partly to blame, but how do you know that he wasn't instructing LeBron to move the ball last night while James just decided to disobey orders? On top of that, for those of you who put the blame on Erik and say "he should have benched LeBron if James wasn't listening to the game plan", REALLY? I mean REALLY? If that's the case it's pretty much a lose-lose situation for Spoelstra. If he leaves LBJ in there and James goes off and does what he wants (read: sucking in the low post), Erik isn't being a good coach by refusing to stand up to his players. However if Spoelstra DOES bench him and you guys still lose, "OMFG how could he pull our best player during crunch time. He should have just given the ball to James and let LeBron go to work".

There's nothing wrong with complaining about Spoelstra, I just think it's ridiculous that many of these so-called "Heat fans" elect to ignore the issue of Miami's offense when the shots are falling and only take up their pitchforks when things are not.

[Chosen01]

My point is that you folks only throw up Erik's name when things are going bad. When all is going well and you're pounding on scrub teams it's "OMFG WE HAVE T3H TWO BESTEST PLAYAZ W00TZ, HOW R DEY GOING 2 STOP US??!!!??"

If you folks really wanted to b**** and moan about Spoelstra last night you should have been complaining not just when LBJ was missing his shots, but when Wade was making his as well since both guys were doing the exact same thing out there on the floor, it just so happened that one guy was hitting his shots while the other wasn't. HOWEVER, all I saw were comments about how Wade is a beast and how he should "rock those glasses every night". When things were going well last night, NOT ONCE did I see ANYONE complaining about how Spoelstra didn't have a problem with Wade playing 1v1. My point is that if you wanna piss and moan about Erik's offensive schemes, then you should still be doing so even when the shots are falling since technically those made baskets are nothing more than fools gold as we all witnessed last night when the shots finally stopped going in. Of course, that's never the case with most of you. LeBron bricks shot after shot five feet from the rim because he has NO LOW POST GAME and all I see are comments about "F you Erik". Come on man.

I'm not saying that Spoelstra's offense (or lack thereof) isn't partly to blame, but how do you know that he wasn't instructing LeBron to move the ball last night while James just decided to disobey orders? On top of that, for those of you who put the blame on Erik and say "he should have benched LeBron if James wasn't listening to the game plan", REALLY? I mean REALLY? If that's the case it's pretty much a lose-lose situation for Spoelstra. If he leaves LBJ in there and James goes off and does what he wants (read: sucking in the low post), Erik isn't being a good coach by refusing to stand up to his players. However if Spoelstra DOES bench him and you guys still lose, "OMFG how could he pull our best player during crunch time. He should have just given the ball to James and let LeBron go to work".

There's nothing wrong with complaining about Spoelstra, I just think it's ridiculous that many of these so-called "Heat fans" elect to ignore the issue of Miami's offense when the shots are falling and only take up their pitchforks when things are not.

You obviously didn't read where I said I CALL OUT SPOESLTRA EVERY GAME and for the past two years. If your calling out other Heat fans those are OTHER heat fans we're not 1 whole person.Like I said before stop trying to make it seem like I call him out when the going is bad because i've called him out during the win streak like the Wizards game and the lackadaisical defense around the end of the streak and even a year ago (if you want to go back to previous heat threads).

Wade was hot on the Knicks game, nobody said anything when LeBron was hot against the Knicks and CLE because was hot.I've been saying the offense sucks since how long... during the win streak Heat were moving the ball better but once injuries hit it when back to 9-8 heat which was ball pounding and Le and Wade Iso.

[Sir Buckets]

bruddamanmatt is exactly right.

[CrossOver]

bruddamanmatt is exactly right.

Not really, people should check out the Heat forum for the ongoing debate on Spoelstra and the concerns people have when the time comes and the Heat are facing a strong team in the playoffs. The lack of true offensive sets have been something several Heat fans have griped about. Just because you personally don't see it doesn't mean it isn't there.

[ELCIDz]

didn't get to see the game, but dam how the hell does a guy with migranes all week along out perform a guy who is suppose to be the #1 player in the league? I dont know who guarded James but I can't imagine anyone of any significance on NYK that play much of any D to being with.
LeBron started and played PF most of the game. Because of this, he felt the need to work down in the post a lot. This led to him forcing up terrible, awkward shots that often wouldn't even hit the rim. This took him out of his rhythm early and he never recovered. By the 4th, he was so miffed by his struggles, that he looked for his offense on every possession by pounding the ball for 20 seconds without even looking for teammates. The announcers continuely called him out on this too.

I'm not sure why some Miami fans blame the coach. Sure Spo could have pubically embarassed Bron on national TV by yanking him out of the game but you can't do that to the best player on your team because it's a player's league and the coach will be gone before the player. Tha game was clearly on LeBron for letting his emotions control his game.

This. Hilarious to see Heat fans calling for Spo's head. There isn't a better coach out there available, and no you don't count Riles who has been crystal clear he's too old for it. Get Bron to move the damn ball around, or better yet give just give it to Wade he was en fuego.

[Chosen01]

didn't get to see the game, but dam how the hell does a guy with migranes all week along out perform a guy who is suppose to be the #1 player in the league? I dont know who guarded James but I can't imagine anyone of any significance on NYK that play much of any D to being with.
LeBron started and played PF most of the game. Because of this, he felt the need to work down in the post a lot. This led to him forcing up terrible, awkward shots that often wouldn't even hit the rim. This took him out of his rhythm early and he never recovered. By the 4th, he was so miffed by his struggles, that he looked for his offense on every possession by pounding the ball for 20 seconds without even looking for teammates. The announcers continuely called him out on this too.

I'm not sure why some Miami fans blame the coach. Sure Spo could have pubically embarassed Bron on national TV by yanking him out of the game but you can't do that to the best player on your team because it's a player's league and the coach will be gone before the player. Tha game was clearly on LeBron for letting his emotions control his game.

This. Hilarious to see Heat fans calling for Spo's head. There isn't a better coach out there available, and no you don't count Riles who has been crystal clear he's too old for it. Get Bron to move the damn ball around, or better yet give just give it to Wade he was en fuego.

Except it was Spoesltra who pulled him out when he hadn't missed and made 13 consecutive fgs

[Googjob]

I wish some of you would be consistent. It seems if the Heat lose it's Spoelstra's fault, if they win it's the players who did it. Seems like a no-win situation and a convenient excuse for your star players.

But it's not like we haven't heard it before. Remember that the Cavs problems were all Mike Brown, or Danny Ferry, or Mo Williams, or Delonte West, or whatever else you could come up with. Just like this year's problems are Spoelstra, injuries, Bosh, and whatever else you can come up with. There is one factor in the equation that stays the same though.

And I don't care if you want to blame him for all the losses. Just give him credit for all the wins. Can't have it both ways.

[KDS91]

I like the direction this topic went in.

From Miami being 1st in the East to how much we whine about Spo.

Can this be locked now?

[Soap345]

I like the direction this topic went in.

From Miami being 1st in the East to how much we whine about Spo.

Can this be locked now?

Did you think it would happen this quickly?

[Biohazard]

I like the direction this topic went in.

From Miami being 1st in the East to how much we whine about Spo.

Can this be locked now?

Did you think it would happen this quickly?

i admit i didn't think the Heat would go on another losing streak this quickly

[umopapisdn]

Anything less than a championship will go down as one of the biggest chokes in the history of professional sports.