What is really wrong with Wallace?

Post #1 » by **fatlever** » Tue Feb 1, 2011 5:00 pm

Obviously something is going on...

What do you believe is the primary reason for his slump this season, particularly the past 2 months?

Post #2 » by **fatlever** » Tue Feb 1, 2011 5:02 pm

follow up question - if you believe its due to ankle injury being much worse than he is letting on, what should coach silas do?

1) let him continue to play 40 minutes on ankle
2) sit him until he is close to 100% healthy
3) cut his minutes back to less than 30 minutes per game until he gets healthy

dmutombo321 · Post #3 » by **dmutombo321** » Tue Feb 1, 2011 5:24 pm

Wallace's game is and always has been predicated almost entirely on his athleticism.

Yes, he's taken a hell of a beating over his career and thats a factor but he's also pushing 30 and as such, while still an elite athelete, he doesnt have quite the same speed/first step/explosiveness. He's a mediocre ball handler who has no stutter-step and no ability to change direction off the dribble. In year's past, this hasnt been much of an impediment; he would face up, put his shoulder down and blow by his defender. But as he gets a step slower, this becomes a problem. This same move is now resulting in alot of offensive fouls.

The past two seasons, I was a vocal advocate of trading Wallace while his worth was high and he would have yielded a lucrative return. By waiting as long as they have, he's lost alot of value around the league.

This is not to say that he's washed up and has no value at all and is no longer a well above average SF. He still has value around the league (I still think a Wallace/Nazr/Tank for Battier/Jeffries/Hill/Twill would help Houston immensely and give Charlotte some young assets/expirings), he's just not going to command the same return he would have during the previous couple seasons.

If the ankle is a contributing factor in the immediate term, he should be shelved until its better. Playing him when he is hurt and putting up sh*tty stat lines only serves to further erode his perception around the league.

Post #4 » by **BigSlam** » Tue Feb 1, 2011 5:28 pm

Option #7: After his breakout season last season, the rest of the leauge has now worked him out and game plan for him.

ohara · Post #5 » by **ohara** » Tue Feb 1, 2011 5:42 pm

Honestly, I think it is closer to Does Not Care, but with a reason. I think he is not mixing with Jax or DJ and has lost interest in playing for Charlotte. He will just "float" through games and be happy if he is traded to a team with more pieces and with better playoff aspirations. If no trade, then play hard the last year of his Contract and benefit from FA status. Hate to say it, but this is what I really believe is happening.

Post #6 » by **BigSlam** » Tue Feb 1, 2011 6:02 pm

There might be something said for him getting a taste of "the life" last season and wanting more of it now?

Think about it: Playing in the All Star game being surrounded by all those great players coming from great teams. Then going and running with the Team USA squad over the summer, again being surrounded by all those great players coming from great teams.

Maybe Crash tasted that and and he misses it? Maybe there is some resentment that he has busted his arse for 6 years here for what he thinks is not enough return? Maybe he knows the window is closing for him to have a serious impact on a championship contending team?

Maybe everything that came his way last season got up inside his head and is making him think of what he is missing out on and is now having a negative impact on this season?

Bassman · Post #7 » by **Bassman** » Tue Feb 1, 2011 6:09 pm

I think Mutumbo and Slam are both right. The ankle may be bothering him some, but he certainly peaked last season, and the league is defending him differently. Also, our team has migrated how they play and attack on offense. Between defenders or changes or injury issues, Crash has become marginalized here. I don't think he doesn't care. But he's not putting out max effort for some reason.

It is time to trade him for a decent return. Jax can be a headache but he is a more dynamic scorer. Plus, I just don't see a market for SJ. I've got to believe Houston will take a serious look at Crash; perhaps another team trying to stay in the race. If we can get a quality young player and some expiring $, like the suggested deal floating around for Hill & Battier, I say do it.

Post #8 » by **BigSlam** » Tue Feb 1, 2011 6:12 pm

This is not a trade trade thread guys!! It's a "what's wrong with Crash" thread!

Post #9 » by **fatlever** » Tue Feb 1, 2011 6:15 pm

BigSlam wrote:Option #7: After his breakout season last season, the rest of the leauge has now worked him out and game plan for him.

added to poll

ohara · Post #10 » by **ohara** » Tue Feb 1, 2011 6:43 pm

I cannot see the game planning by other teams as being the reason for his lack of play. It could have an effect on his points, but not all the hustle aspects of the game which have dropped. He doesn't look for his shots, doesn't drive, doesn't move much without the ball, and has an overall lack of hustle. I think that is giving him a pass by giving the other teams the credit. I think this is much more about Crash and not nearly as much about the opposition and their strategy. I can understand that the game planning argument will be the easiest option here as it allows his fans to not put the blame on Crash as much and they dont feel like they are turning their back on him. But I cannot see where there is a good argument as the most factual option.

Edit: I want to clarify that as a Crash fan, I really WANT to vote for the " opposition game planning" option. I am merely saying that I cannot vote that way in good conscience. But if anyone else can, and they are being honest with themselves, I admire that and appreciate it.

countryboi · Post #11 » by **countryboi** » Tue Feb 1, 2011 7:23 pm

i am at the point where i really dont care what his problem is......he needs to get it together or get shipped out....and to think i had dreams of DJ, jack and wallace all playing at a high level dancing in my head

bobcats3wallace · Post #12 » by **bobcats3wallace** » Tue Feb 1, 2011 7:43 pm

I think it's a combination of the league knowing his game and him being on a sharp decline. This decline is painfully obvious if you watch him play. He no longer has spectacular dunks, great defense, and most importantly no longer drives to the bucket like h used to. He has just lost a step in all parts of his game, and his game has been exposed. He can't shoot, well now he can't drive because of the fact he has lost a step. I just think were seeing a fast decline, which really started since the all star game last year.

Marvel · Post #13 » by **Marvel** » Tue Feb 1, 2011 7:53 pm

He's flatlined. Trade talks bothering him. His offense is like watching a 70s horror flick, you know what's coming. Him and Jack = water and oil. He's lost a step, no longer able to blow by his man. All of the above.

Overall, i don't really care what his problems are, get over it and help your team win.

vorbis · Post #14 » by **vorbis** » Tue Feb 1, 2011 8:32 pm

i just feel like his actions sometimes are beyond "oh crap they know what i'm going to do before i do it" or "ugh this team is lame when is my next paycheck". his lack of movement and his utter disdain for hustling or moving around on offense just seem to me because he's in serious pain and wants to save his 3-4 significant athletic moves per game for optimum moments, like blocking a layup attempt from behind, or maneuvering to take a big shot etc.

as for the followup question, in my opinion the guy should not be playing if this is all his ankle is going to allow him to contribute. rest it up for a couple of weeks and give it another go. maybe it's one of those debilitating things like plantar fascitis or something. you don't see players just changing their entire attitude towards the game like this without some physical limitation dictating it.

captaincrunk · Post #15 » by **captaincrunk** » Tue Feb 1, 2011 8:59 pm

He's obviously been injured all season, as evidenced by him being injured all season. Also, the team spent a lot of time playing without him, and when Silas came in he was injured so Silas was drawing up plans for the other guys. It seems like he's been having a harder time reintegrating, especially with his injuries. He's gonna be fearful of reinjuring himself right now it seems.

And the trade rumors are bothering him for sure. Jack too. For Crash, he's been the best player on this team for ages. He's probably dealing with the (erroneous) knowledge that the team doesn't want him anymore. And Jack, he's sensitive to that too because he's probably never finished a contract in the same place he signed it.

Post #16 » by **fatlever** » Tue Feb 1, 2011 9:11 pm

vorbis wrote:i just feel like his actions sometimes are beyond "oh crap they know what i'm going to do before i do it" or "ugh this team is lame when is my next paycheck". his lack of movement and his utter disdain for hustling or moving around on offense just seem to me because he's in serious pain and wants to save his 3-4 significant athletic moves per game for optimum moments, like blocking a layup attempt from behind, or maneuvering to take a big shot etc.

as for the followup question, in my opinion the guy should not be playing if this is all his ankle is going to allow him to contribute. rest it up for a couple of weeks and give it another go. maybe it's one of those debilitating things like plantar fascitis or something. you don't see players just changing their entire attitude towards the game like this without some physical limitation dictating it.

i'm going to go with this option.

i am really starting to believe that his injuries to his ankles are much worse than he is letting on and he is trying to play at about 60% saving himself mostly or defense and a few plays when needed. he doesnt have the burst to get to his spots on offense and sadly his jumper seems to have left him which compounds the problem.

he is trying to be a champ and play through the injuries knowing we are close to playoffs, have no depth and just lost our only bench scoring in tyrus until march.

all that being said, either he or silas needs to come to grips with the situation and fix it. playing him 40mpg like this is only furthering the problem. he either needs to take a few weeks off or he needs to have his minutes scaled way back until he is back close to 100%.

there is a point when being tough becomes a liability and not a strength. we hare reached that point.

captaincrunk · Post #17 » by **captaincrunk** » Tue Feb 1, 2011 9:18 pm

fatlever wrote:
vorbis wrote:i just feel like his actions sometimes are beyond "oh crap they know what i'm going to do before i do it" or "ugh this team is lame when is my next paycheck". his lack of movement and his utter disdain for hustling or moving around on offense just seem to me because he's in serious pain and wants to save his 3-4 significant athletic moves per game for optimum moments, like blocking a layup attempt from behind, or maneuvering to take a big shot etc.

as for the followup question, in my opinion the guy should not be playing if this is all his ankle is going to allow him to contribute. rest it up for a couple of weeks and give it another go. maybe it's one of those debilitating things like plantar fascitis or something. you don't see players just changing their entire attitude towards the game like this without some physical limitation dictating it.

i'm going to go with this option.

i am really starting to believe that his injuries to his ankles are much worse than he is letting on and he is trying to play at about 60% saving himself mostly or defense and a few plays when needed. he doesnt have the burst to get to his spots on offense and sadly his jumper seems to have left him which compounds the problem.

he is trying to be a champ and play through the injuries knowing we are close to playoffs, have no depth and just lost our only bench scoring in tyrus until march.

all that being said, either he or silas needs to come to grips with the situation and fix it. playing him 40mpg like this is only furthering the problem. he either needs to take a few weeks off or he needs to have his minutes scaled way back until he is back close to 100%.

there is a point when being tough becomes a liability and not a strength. we hare reached that point.

Finally someone who doesn't think Crash is conspiring to make us fail or that he's a corpse being propped up by unskilled gremlins controlling his body.

Post #18 » by **fatlever** » Tue Feb 1, 2011 9:32 pm

or i should say i think injuries are the MAIN reason. i do believe there are some underlying factors that are also at play however:

- obvious teams are doing a better job gameplanning for him - he gets doubled more, teams are cutting of baseline and everyone is playing him for drive, looking to take charge knowing he doesnt have any form of in-between game.

- there does seem to be something to the notion that there is some chemistry issues between crash and dj/jax. dj obviously has been deferring to jax more this season.

- his slip in form seems to coincide with his trip to the all-star game last year. he hasnt been the same player since then. unless he has been injured for a solid year, i believe there is some truth to the idea that he got stars in his eyes last year and again this summer.

- and there is no doubt that the pounding his body has taken is having a cumulative effect on his game.

BUT i still believe current injuries are the primary reason for his play. wallace has always played tentatively when he is injured or concerned about injuries and that appears to still be the case now.

Marvel · Post #19 » by **Marvel** » Tue Feb 1, 2011 9:37 pm

Maybe he's sucking it up so he doesn't get traded. There's a thought.

captaincrunk · Post #20 » by **captaincrunk** » Tue Feb 1, 2011 9:40 pm

fatlever wrote:or i should say i think injuries are the MAIN reason. i do believe there are some underlying factors that are also at play however:

- obvious teams are doing a better job gameplanning for him - he gets doubled more, teams are cutting of baseline and everyone is playing him for drive, looking to take charge knowing he doesnt have any form of in-between game.

Uhh... He's been in the league for ages, and been our best our nearly best player for like 5 years. There's nothing new here, and the scouting reports are no more accurate than they were.

fatlever wrote:BUT i still believe current injuries are the primary reason for his play. wallace has always played tentatively when he is injured or concerned about injuries and that appears to still be the case now.

I agree some more.

What is wrong with Wallace?