[Camelo Thread Part 16] - Denver wants what?! p58

[cgmw]

I don't want to get into a complicated and irrelevant discussion with you.

If I'm Kroenke Melo has to either sign the extension pre 24th or he gets traded. Obviously if Melo is going to remain a Nugget then you don't trade him. However, he has made it clear for 8 months that he doesn't intend to sign TWO extension much less one. Therefore, you ask him one last time if he will commit pre 24th and if he refuses you trade him. You don't play guessing games when all signs are pointing to you losing...

At the end of the day, I think you're right. Kroenke will have to cut his losses. But there's a flipside that often gets ignored. I'll attempt to break it down mathematically (values not accurate, just being used for illustration):

A = Nuggets value with Carmelo
B = Nuggets value if Carmelo traded
C = Nuggets team value if Carmelo walks away for no compensation

A = $300 million
B = $225 million
C = $224 million

If you were the owner, would you really care about the difference between B & C? Or would you do everything you possibly could to get choice A?

Yes, Carmelo has turned them down ten times before. But by letting the deadline pass, Kroenke could play a high-stakes game of chicken by trying to call Melo's bluff. Nothing could be worth more to the value of his franchise between February and July than the opportunity to convince Melo to stay.

That's the devil's advocate argument that never seems to play on this board. To me it's very logical, and probably our biggest concern. Now this obviously doesn't mean Carmelo would sign that extension, but I for one wouldn't be shocked if he did.

[god shammgod]

hmm, is it worth holding on to moz more then gallo or fields. i'm really not sure.

[IllegalDefense]

i think id rather give up felton and take back billups to save gallo or fields

i would tell them to take felton/chandler/randolph/curry/1st

[ComboGuardCity]

hmm, is it worth holding on to moz more then gallo or fields. i'm really not sure.

A big no. Fields is the perfect 2 if he's surrounded by scorers.

And come on guys. Getting Chauncey would be a STEAL. Chauncey is the better PG with more experience.

[johnnywishbone]

Sorry for quoting myself but I did a little more work on this.

http://www.forbes.com/lists/2010/32/bas ... 24980.html

So the Denver Nuggets valuation is 310 million dollars. Now suppose they lose Melo and the franchise takes a hit similar to the Cavaliers who dropped 26% in value year-over-year. Let's just say they drop 20% in value. That would be about 64 million dollars. Given their position where they have to sell the team it would seem clear that priority #1 is resigning Melo (no captain obvious images please). Maybe they've done some calculus where they figured out that if they lose Melo via trade or free agency they are equally screwed so they might as well try to keep him.

Their top priority has to be sell the team more than build a championship given the 2014 date. I wonder how much of that factors in to Melo's desire to get out of there (if at all).

That's what I've been saying all along. For Denver, the monetary value of attempting to keep him by exacting leverage between February & July might be significantly higher than the monetary value of executing a trade that brings back only mediocre talent and/or limited cap flex.

Big sentence to say, yeah. I agree. This is a major factor, but not the only factor.

Yeah, it's an angle I just hadn't heard anyone discuss yet. All the talk about luxury tax savings made me start to wonder what made the most sense financially. Then I found out they had that 2014 hard date where they have to sell the team by. Changes the whole dynamic for me. When Melo says he wants a ring I believe him and if you are on a team where the owner's top priority is to sell that can't be very encouraging. I would guess that Kroenke's best case scenario is to re-sign Melo and then sell the team soon after that. I imagine if he is trying to sell the team saying you have Wilson Chandler and Landry Fields would not be much a selling point compared to I have Melo in my barn.

[drp07644]

isiahs trash expired this summer, so ny wouldve been players regardless

You're nuts because Isiah would have kept bringing in horrible contracts...
It's a slap to everyone's face here that you're a mod

[Jitpal]

SAS says Felton isn't a sticking point. Denver just "inquired" about Felton in an effort to jettison Billup's contract. -Jitpal

how much would they save, doesnt felton have more guaranteed next year than chancuey?

About $4 million higher. Someone else mentioned it earlier, I'm guessing Felton has more value to flip than Billups. Maybe some sort of 3 way where Felton goes to a team for an expiring + 1st rounder or something and that goes to Denver for Billups as part of the deal. That makes more sense to me, but who knows. -Jitpal

[god shammgod]

hmm, is it worth holding on to moz more then gallo or fields. i'm really not sure.

A big no. Fields is the perfect 2 if he's surrounded by scorers.

and quality size is hard to come by. out of the 4 - fields & moz would make the most sense with this group and yet, chandler & gallo might have more talent. tough choice. because of his contract chandler is sure to go though.

[knicks9784]

I don't want to get into a complicated and irrelevant discussion with you.

If I'm Kroenke Melo has to either sign the extension pre 24th or he gets traded. Obviously if Melo is going to remain a Nugget then you don't trade him. However, he has made it clear for 8 months that he doesn't intend to sign TWO extension much less one. Therefore, you ask him one last time if he will commit pre 24th and if he refuses you trade him. You don't play guessing games when all signs are pointing to you losing...

At the end of the day, I think you're right. Kroenke will have to cut his losses. But there's a flipside that often gets ignored. I'll attempt to break it down mathematically (values not accurate, just being used for illustration):

A = Nuggets value with Carmelo
B = Nuggets value if Carmelo traded
C = Nuggets team value if Carmelo walks away for no compensation

A = $300 million
B = $225 million
C = $224 million

If you were the owner, would you really care about the difference between B & C? Or would you do everything you possibly could to get choice A?

Yes, Carmelo has turned them down ten times before. But by letting the deadline pass, Kroenke could play a high-stakes game of chicken by trying to call Melo's bluff. Nothing could be worth more to the value of his franchise between February and July than the opportunity to convince Melo to stay.

That's the devil's advocate argument that never seems to play on this board. To me it's very logical, and probably our biggest concern. Now this obviously doesn't mean Carmelo would sign that extension, but I for one wouldn't be shocked if he did.

the thing with melo now is if he just stays now, he risks receiving a lebron like backlash. i mean hes drums up this drama for months on end always cryptic and indirect with his words, only to resign, something he couldve a year ago. outside of denver he would not be very popular.

[NYK0605]

hmm, is it worth holding on to moz more then gallo or fields. i'm really not sure.

You can not be serious.

My God....it is unreal how much people are overrating Mozgov right now. Anyone who would keep him over Gallo or Fields is a complete moron.

[NoLayupRule]

SAS says Felton isn't a sticking point. Denver just "inquired" about Felton in an effort to jettison Billup's contract. -Jitpal

How can Denver keep melo, billups or nene at this point the way they've been acting?

Talk about burning bridges

[czoneny]

could make a real playoff run if we get Billups/Melo and can somehow turn some other expirings into a big whos expiring (Dalembert). No I am not for keeping Dalembert past this season or resigning him but for the playoffs this season..

Sammy Dalembert
Amare
Melo
Fields
Billups

Douglas (decent defender, maybe billups can mentor him)
Gallinari (assuming hes kept)
Shawne Williams
Mozgov (assuming hes kept)

lots of length and size on the bench, now if the coach would be willing to use the size and rebounding is another thing.

[johnnywishbone]

I don't want to get into a complicated and irrelevant discussion with you.

If I'm Kroenke Melo has to either sign the extension pre 24th or he gets traded. Obviously if Melo is going to remain a Nugget then you don't trade him. However, he has made it clear for 8 months that he doesn't intend to sign TWO extension much less one. Therefore, you ask him one last time if he will commit pre 24th and if he refuses you trade him. You don't play guessing games when all signs are pointing to you losing...

At the end of the day, I think you're right. Kroenke will have to cut his losses. But there's a flipside that often gets ignored. I'll attempt to break it down mathematically (values not accurate, just being used for illustration):

A = Nuggets value with Carmelo
B = Nuggets value if Carmelo traded
C = Nuggets team value if Carmelo walks away for no compensation

A = $300 million
B = $225 million
C = $224 million

If you were the owner, would you really care about the difference between B & C? Or would you do everything you possibly could to get choice A?

Yes, Carmelo has turned them down ten times before. But by letting the deadline pass, Kroenke could play a high-stakes game of chicken by trying to call Melo's bluff. Nothing could be worth more to the value of his franchise between February and July than the opportunity to convince Melo to stay.

That's the devil's advocate argument that never seems to play on this board. To me it's very logical, and probably our biggest concern. Now this obviously doesn't mean Carmelo would sign that extension, but I for one wouldn't be shocked if he did.

This is a situation too where we don't really understand the personality of Kroenke. It's amazing what people can make themselves believe when it's in their benefit. Comment not directed at the board whatsoever.

[macman411]

If Donnie doesnt get Melo he should be fired. Melo put himself on a silver pladder for us. No Melo=no chris paul= mediocrity the next 4 years.

[ComboGuardCity]

could make a real playoff run if we get Billups/Melo and can somehow turn some other expirings into a big whos expiring (Dalembert). No I am not for keeping Dalembert past this season or resigning him but for the playoffs this season..

Sammy Dalembert
Amare
Melo
Fields
Billups

Douglas (decent defender, maybe billups can mentor him)
Gallinari (assuming hes kept)
Shawne Williams
Mozgov (assuming hes kept)

lots of length and size on the bench, now if the coach would be willing to use the size and rebounding is another thing.

I'm pretty sure Curry + Douglas + 2nd Rounder could get Daly. That would make this team a contender this year, especially if the heat get the first seed.

[Fury]

If Donnie doesnt get Melo he should be fired. Melo put himself on a silver pladder for us. No Melo=no chris paul= mediocrity the next 4 years.

We probably can't get Chris Paul if we trade for Melo. Not enough cap space.

[Jitpal]

hmm, is it worth holding on to moz more then gallo or fields. i'm really not sure.

A big no. Fields is the perfect 2 if he's surrounded by scorers.

and quality size is hard to come by. out of the 4 - fields & moz would make the most sense with this group and yet, chandler & gallo might have more talent. tough choice.

I wouldn't be so sure about Mozgov not having talent like that. 7 foot mobile centers aren't exactly growing on trees. He looks like he can become a good rebounder. Even with his raw defensive abilities, you see him altering shots around the rim. No hands up, just his size down there. He has a good stroke too, so the ability to hit that 10-12 foot jumper and free throws are huge too. He can finish, we know that. There really aren't a lot of big guys like that out there. -Jitpal

[duetta]

Honestly, if I were Donnie, I would resign - and let the next guy bend over, with Isiah eager and ready to provide the lube.

[Jay10]

lol@SAS saying carmelo has a butt the size of j-lo to back down defenders

[NoLayupRule]

If Donnie doesnt get Melo he should be fired. Melo put himself on a silver pladder for us. No Melo=no chris paul= mediocrity the next 4 years.

Oh grow up with the calling for peoples heads. I hope you have more reasonable people watching you in life