Official Raptors 2011 NBA Draft Thread, Part 3

[alpha]

-at least in Europe -

Europe, where Andrea Bargnani shines on defense.

You'd be hard pressed to find Europe on a map.

[TheRealDeal]

It's also sayonara from the Euroleague today for Valanciunas, who team, Rytas of Vilnius, was abused on the perimeter all day.

Valanciunas finished with 9 points (4/5 shooting, plus 1/2 at the line, which included his first miss at the stripe after 17 consecutive makes). He had 11 boards (two offensive) and a block.

One interesting Tweet about his rebounding.

ChristopheEPcom
RT @inthegamebasket: The percentage of shots Valanciunas rebounds is right on the level of K.Love and D.Howard's numbers in NBA,over 20%.

Jonas sounds like he might eventually win me over if the first few guys are gone. The thing about him is I know a lot of Wizards fans want him badly. They rarely mention Kyrie and I don't see them picking him. Their fans want a tough inside presence like we do and they don't need a PG. I can almost guarantee that Washington will finish with a worse record than us so we'll have to jump them in the lotto. If I were to bet I'd say all JV needs to do is impress in workouts to make him a Wizard. If Jared Sullinger declares they'll be interested in him too, especially if he keeps producing down the stretch. Kanter probably isn't out of the race yet either. It's hard to tell who the GM's would prefer between the wings but hopefully someone distinguishes themselves and becomes "can't miss" after a tournament run.

[5DOM]

Anyone who thinks Derrick Williams is a better prospect than Harrison Barnes really needs to consider watching a different sport.

Unfortunately that's more like the majority of people right now.

[HSOB SIRHC]

If we draft him I wouldn't be happy, but I wouldn't be upset either.

[Reignman]

What he's shown and what his stats say are two different things. When it comes to prospects you have to be able differentiate.

Blake Griffin wasn't the next coming in his freshmen year.

Tim Duncan wasn't the next coming in his freshmen year.

Paul Pierce fell in the draft because of the same things Barnes is going through.

Vince Carter was Jamieson's side kick at UNC.

I could go on and on about players that became much better than they looked in their freshmen year.

What I'm looking at is the skills that Barnes has at his disposal and his ceiling if he improves on his weaknesses. He looks like the 2nd best prospect to me.

And you won't have to refer me as a scout, I'd bet money Barnes goes top 5 in this draft.

If people just base it on stat I think 5DOM and rudeboy would definitely draft Adam Morrison as number one overall pick and would praise him as the best player since Lebron James.

I don't why why you keep saying I only look at the stats when in fact I barely mentioned them. I did mention his low 3 pointer % because you said he's a great 3 point shooter which is obviously false. My main knock on him has always been that he's not very polished at all offensively. He basically can't create his own shot and looks awkward at the college level. And is it really that crazy for me to think that Williams, Sullinger, Terrence Jones and Perry Jones have been more impressive than Barnes this season?

As for Reignman's comparisons to Griffin, Duncan and VC, what if Barnes is the next Marvin Williams? And I very well know the difference between what he's shown and the stats he posted. And I repeat that Barnes really hasn't shown much to be the 2nd overall pick (and I don't just mean his average stats)

Well, looking at 3 pt % it doesn't show he's a great shooter but when I look at his form/mechnics I think he'll be a great shooter in the NBA.

And yes, it's possible he's the next Marvin Williams but I also don't see the next CP or DWill behdind him in this draft.

D will, Sullinger and T Jones just don't look like they have high enough ceilings / or they are classic tweeners. Barnes has the ceiling you want from a high pick. I like P Jones as well but if he's not an NBA SF then I have no interest in him. At the SF spot I think his ceiling is higher than anyone else in this draft so I'd be cool with taking him as well.

[HEDOBALL]

Next year's lineup consisting of


______
derozan
barnes
davis
________


my pants just 'sploded.

[5DOM]

Well, looking at 3 pt % it doesn't show he's a great shooter but when I look at his form/mechnics I think he'll be a great shooter in the NBA.

And yes, it's possible he's the next Marvin Williams but I also don't see the next CP or DWill behdind him in this draft.

D will, Sullinger and T Jones just don't look like they have high enough ceilings / or they are classic tweeners. Barnes has the ceiling you want from a high pick. I like P Jones as well but if he's not an NBA SF then I have no interest in him. At the SF spot I think his ceiling is higher than anyone else in this draft so I'd be cool with taking him as well.

Fair enough

[dagger]

It's also sayonara from the Euroleague today for Valanciunas, who team, Rytas of Vilnius, was abused on the perimeter all day.

Valanciunas finished with 9 points (4/5 shooting, plus 1/2 at the line, which included his first miss at the stripe after 17 consecutive makes). He had 11 boards (two offensive) and a block.

One interesting Tweet about his rebounding.

ChristopheEPcom
RT @inthegamebasket: The percentage of shots Valanciunas rebounds is right on the level of K.Love and D.Howard's numbers in NBA,over 20%.

Jonas sounds like he might eventually win me over if the first few guys are gone. The thing about him is I know a lot of Wizards fans want him badly. They rarely mention Kyrie and I don't see them picking him. Their fans want a tough inside presence like we do and they don't need a PG. I can almost guarantee that Washington will finish with a worse record than us so we'll have to jump them in the lotto. If I were to bet I'd say all JV needs to do is impress in workouts to make him a Wizard. If Jared Sullinger declares they'll be interested in him too, especially if he keeps producing down the stretch. Kanter probably isn't out of the race yet either. It's hard to tell who the GM's would prefer between the wings but hopefully someone distinguishes themselves and becomes "can't miss" after a tournament run.

One thing with Washington, they can't sell a European like they could an African American. So the marketing guys in DC will push for the guy who can sell tickets. It doesn't say much about JaVale McGee - often mistaken on the Raptor board for the second coming - that the Wiz fans want an inside presence. McGee, together with Blatche, have the combined IQ of a simpleton. I still say they will go for Sullinger. Leonsis is going to be even more impatient than BC and there is a risk that Valanciunas will remain in Europe during the lockout, meaning he isn't available to report if there is a partial season, whereas Sullinger would be available. Of course, Sullinger is one of those claiming, through family members, that he will stay in college.

[mappiah19]

We do not need Vesley (a person of his skillset) on this team. We have JJ and athletic SF. Barnes would add an element to the Raptors which is an athletic guard who can play defense and has good 3pt range. Simply put, he is a shooter and the Raptors don't have that now.

I like what I've been reading of Valanucias but I'd rather go for a veteran center if possible (Gasol or Chandler). One o Gasol/Chandler in addition to Davis, Amir, Bargnani, would be a good front court rotation.

[kwamebargnani]

Next year's lineup consisting of

Rubio
______
derozan
barnes
davis
________
Gasol


my pants just 'sploded.

[5DOM]

Vesely sounds very intriguing but what's with his FT%?

[RomaniaLuvTR]

Vesely sounds very intriguing but what's with his FT%?

i did not cheer the whole season for us to lose games and end up with vesely kanter motiejunas or valanciunas...i`m european and all 4 are nice players to have but this draft i want irving barnes or t jones..

[Rude Boy 1]

I guess we'll just have to wait and see. I think Barnes is going to make a lot of people feel foolish if he drops down to far.

Those numbers aren't great and when I look at Barnes' game I'm not looking at numbers. I look at things like the form on his shot, his footwork, his ability to hit clutch shots, his work ethic, his athleticism, his ceiling, etc.

All of those things lead me to believe he'll be one of the better, if not the best, player from this class.

In a couple of years we can talk, if I'm wrong I hope you remind me because if I'm right I will definitely remind you.

His numbers are terrible and unless he absolutely lights it up in the coming months I see no reason to draft him. He has nice form on his jumper but what difference does it make if he's not hitting them? His footwork is decent but he lacks aggressiveness. He hits the OCCASIONAL clutch shot much like Bargnani or Derrick Martin. I don't know how to evaluate ones work ethic watching a couple of games work ethic for me is determined off the court mostly. He is athletic I can't deny that just not super athletic that leads me to believe he can dominate at the next level.

The other thing I don't like is he's far from Alpha male. everything about him just screams Marvin Williams to me and its not just the school.

In a couple of years I will gladly eat crow or whatever you want me to eat if he becomes an allstar. I'm not interested in serviceable NBAers like Marvin Williams with a top three pick. For once I just want the Raptors to select the best player not the guy they foresee with the most upside or the highest caliper test scores. There is still time but all signs point to Barnes beinga huge mistake at anything higher than 7

[Rude Boy 1]

Hilarious... I just question if you guys watch the game or just focus on mixtapes.

[Reignman]

I guess we'll just have to wait and see. I think Barnes is going to make a lot of people feel foolish if he drops down to far.

Those numbers aren't great and when I look at Barnes' game I'm not looking at numbers. I look at things like the form on his shot, his footwork, his ability to hit clutch shots, his work ethic, his athleticism, his ceiling, etc.

All of those things lead me to believe he'll be one of the better, if not the best, player from this class.

In a couple of years we can talk, if I'm wrong I hope you remind me because if I'm right I will definitely remind you.

His numbers are terrible and unless he absolutely lights it up in the coming months I see no reason to draft him. He has nice form on his jumper but what difference does it make if he's not hitting them? His footwork is decent but he lacks aggressiveness. He hits the OCCASIONAL clutch shot much like Bargnani or Derrick Martin. I don't know how to evaluate ones work ethic watching a couple of games work ethic for me is determined off the court mostly. He is athletic I can't deny that just not super athletic that leads me to believe he can dominate at the next level.

The other thing I don't like is he's far from Alpha male. everything about him just screams Marvin Williams to me and its not just the school.

In a couple of years I will gladly eat crow or whatever you want me to eat if he becomes an allstar. I'm not interested in serviceable NBAers like Marvin Williams with a top three pick. For once I just want the Raptors to select the best player not the guy they foresee with the most upside or the highest caliper test scores. There is still time but all signs point to Barnes beinga huge mistake at anything higher than 7

He has been putting up pretty good numbers for the last 2 months. He has hit the most game winners in the NCAA this season (4), that's not occasional. His work ethic has been reported by his HS coach and now Roy Williams as well as his teammates.

Look, I'm not suggesting he's Lebron, not even close, I'm just comparing him to the rest of his class and he seems like the 2nd best "prospect"' to me.

And with respect to him being an alpha male, you could be right. He was an alpha male in HS and an alpha male in every "showcase" event he has been in but in college he seems to have taken a more passive role so who knows, maybe he's more of a team player than a guy that is just going to dominate the ball.

I just want people to show who the better option is. You say it's a mistake taking him before 7 so point out the 6 players better than him that have all the qualities you're looking for. Irving is clearly the best player but after that it becomes extremely murky.

Sullinger is an undersized guy that's killing smaller competition.
D Will is a classic tweener that doesn't play D
P Jones has the physique and athleticism but he's even more passive than Barnes, possibly a tweener and hasn't really done anything to stand out.
T Jones seems like a good all-around player but his ceiling seems fairly low when compared to Barnes or P Jones.

So who do you want?

[mirrornick]

He is not going to become a (great) player. I want a Point Guard more than anything else.

[michaelc204]

Isn't he supposed to be the next Kobe? I'd take him with our pick

[Reignman]

Hilarious... I just question if you guys watch the game or just focus on mixtapes.

I think we should ask you that question because you seem to have only followed Barnes in Nov and Dec.

I asked you in the other thread but I'll ask you here as well. Who do you have ahead of Barnes and why? Outside of Irving I can find major flaws in every prospect.

[Comeatme_Bro]

Yo real talk, Kyrie Irving will be a Toronto Raptor on June 26, 2011. So there really is no point in over analyzing all these other prospects that just fail in comparison to Irving.

[dagger]

Yo real talk, Kyrie Irving will be a Toronto Raptor on June 26, 2011. So there really is no point in over analyzing all these other prospects that just fail in comparison to Irving.

If it's a done deal, just humor us and let us talk about other prospects.