Another question about the Deron trade..

[Dozer!]

I think we could of got more from New Jersey.

[yonexpro1]

Honestly....

Devin= Deron the past 3 months.

Devin has been a surprise, plus we got favors.

Tonight Harris 21 and 9 with only 1 turn.

Thats better than deron right now

[BarneyGumble]

I'm gunna wait until the draft picks to evaluate this trade. Knowing O'Connor and his Gordon Haywards, I think we essentially gave up Deron for Favors and Harris.

Yes, I think Hayward sucks. Worst #9 pick in history.

[sendai91]

Yes, I think Hayward sucks. Worst #9 pick in history.[/quote]

Patrick O'Bryant, Ike Diogu, Rodney White, Michael Sweetney would like a word with you.

[The59Sound]

Patrick O'Bryant, Ike Diogu, Rodney White, Michael Sweetney would like a word with you.

As would Samaki Walker, Ed O'Bannon, Eric Montross, Willie Burton, and Brad Sellers.

[BarneyGumble]

Patrick O'Bryant, Ike Diogu, Rodney White, Michael Sweetney would like a word with you.

As would Samaki Walker, Ed O'Bannon, Eric Montross, Willie Burton, and Brad Sellers.

I'm failing to see how Hayward automatically jumps these guys? I mean rookie Adam Morrison is an upgrade over Hayward....what does that tell you?

[yonexpro1]

You are a hater, this team isnt a dwont team. Go be a net.

Gtime is a solid player.

[StocktonShorts]

Patrick O'Bryant, Ike Diogu, Rodney White, Michael Sweetney would like a word with you.

As would Samaki Walker, Ed O'Bannon, Eric Montross, Willie Burton, and Brad Sellers.

I'm failing to see how Hayward automatically jumps these guys? I mean rookie Adam Morrison is an upgrade over Hayward....what does that tell you?

I don't think Adam Morrison would get more time than Hayward under most NBA coaches.

[The59Sound]

Patrick O'Bryant, Ike Diogu, Rodney White, Michael Sweetney would like a word with you.

As would Samaki Walker, Ed O'Bannon, Eric Montross, Willie Burton, and Brad Sellers.

I'm failing to see how Hayward automatically jumps these guys? I mean rookie Adam Morrison is an upgrade over Hayward....what does that tell you?

Oh, really? Adam Morrison is an upgrade? Gordon is light years ahead of where Morrison was in terms of defense, offensive efficiency, and basketball intelligence.

Per 36 stats for their rookie seasons.

Morrison

14.2 PPG
.376 FG%
.337 3P%
.71 FT%
3.6 TRB
2.5 AST

Hayward

9.9 PPG
.443 FG%
.355 3P%
.73 FT%
4.7 TRB
2.1 AST

Even if we're looking only at the statistical comparison, Morrison wins just two out of six categories: PPG and Assists. The difference in assists is negligible, and the difference in points is the result of Morrison's 14.6 FGA, versus Hayward's 8.1.

I mean, really, who backs Adam Morrison in an argument about busts? Don't bring Ammo to a knife fight.

The vast majority of the guys listed were out of the league within a few years. Hayward's a much better defender than everyone listed, his ability in the open court is already very good, and his intelligence for the game is extremely high.

Gordon's gonna be in this league for a good, long while, barring a freak injury.

[BarneyGumble]

Oh, really? Adam Morrison is an upgrade? Gordon is light years ahead of where Morrison was in terms of defense, offensive efficiency, and basketball intelligence.

Per 36 stats for their rookie seasons.

Morrison

14.2 PPG
.376 FG%
.337 3P%
.71 FT%
3.6 TRB
2.5 AST

Hayward

9.9 PPG
.443 FG%
.355 3P%
.73 FT%
4.7 TRB
2.1 AST

Even if we're looking only at the statistical comparison, Morrison wins just two out of six categories: PPG and Assists. The difference in assists is negligible, and the difference in points is the result of Morrison's 14.6 FGA, versus Hayward's 8.1.

I mean, really, who backs Adam Morrison in an argument about busts? Don't bring Ammo to a knife fight.

The vast majority of the guys listed were out of the league within a few years. Hayward's a much better defender than everyone listed, his ability in the open court is already very good, and his intelligence for the game is extremely high.

Gordon's gonna be in this league for a good, long while, barring a freak injury.

I dont think that stats comparison backs up your argument very well, but look....I really hope you are right and I am wrong on this...as Gordon is a Jazzman and I am a Jazzfan. But he doesn't look lottery-worthy to me. His performance on the court, IMO, is a far cry from the picture you paint of him with your posts.....

[The59Sound]

Fair enough. We are obviously both sure of our positions, so we'll just see how it turns out.

[BarneyGumble]

Fair enough. We are obviously both sure of our positions, so we'll just see how it turns out.

Well this is one argument I am hoping to lose....

[StocktonShorts]

Morrison got a ton of playing time for a terrible team that had to justify picking him that early. His winshares per 48 minutes were negative (-0.030), meaning they probably would've been better off not playing him at all.

Hayward's current winshares/48 aren't great, but they're positive (0.018).

[Xanthis]

DWill_daShizzle I was with you about Gordo not being #9 worthy at the time of the draft. However, whom after Hayward would you have picked that is tearing it up this year? Also did you watch last nights game? Hayward helped slow down JR Smith and had great defense. The guy doesn't get burned easily when he is playing on the ball defense.

[StocktonShorts]

DWill_daShizzle I was with you about Gordo not being #9 worthy at the time of the draft. However, whom after Hayward would you have picked that is tearing it up this year? Also did you watch last nights game? Hayward helped slow down JR Smith and had great defense. The guy doesn't get burned easily when he is playing on the ball defense.

First of all, mad props for using "whom" correctly.

Second of all, like you and many others, I was mad as hell with the Hayward pick at the time. I'm less mad now. In a strange way, Raja Bell's awfulness has made Hayward seem better than he would have if we had kept Wesley Matthews. Maybe this was KOC's plan all along!

As far as guys after Hayward: Paul George (10), Ed Davis (13) and Landry Fields (39) are all having decent years.

[jazzfan1971]

Well, I wanted to draft Davis. But, I'm not sure there is much place for him on this team now.

[The59Sound]

Ed Davis and Paul George are both having solid years, and Fields is having a quite a good year (though no one could have seen his coming). But I feel strongly that Favors will have a better career than Davis and George, and since we already have Jefferson and Millsap, I think everything worked out.

[outerspacefella]

I don't think it was a home run. That ruins the consensus. Do you need a diagram?

Perhaps in time it will be. But for the moment, a 2nd tier PG, a project bigman. and some draft pics that we can't forsee the result of for one of the top 5 in the world point guards isn't a "home run"

I guess you and I are the only ones waiting to drink the Kool-aid...

Kool-Aid would have tasted worse after Deron pissed in it and left.

+1000