Prospect Watch Thread

[Krapinsky]

Barnes moves up to #4 in latest DX mock and rankings: http://www.draftexpress.com/nba-mock-draft/2011/

There's plenty of room on the bandwagon.

LMAO at giving us Sullinger instead of Barnes

DX never takes into account team needs until after the lottery. My understanding is that at this point rankings = DX version of best prospects and mock = general consensus

[Krapinsky]

http://www.nbadraft.net/2011mock_draft

Barnes is #5 on that site which I've used for the past few years. Jonas is way too high. I think Dontas will be a better NBA player than Jonas. Jonas just fits better with our team.

draftnet is rather amateur. just about everyone thinks dx > draftnet

[moss_is_1]

http://www.nbadraft.net/2011mock_draft

Barnes is #5 on that site which I've used for the past few years. Jonas is way too high. I think Dontas will be a better NBA player than Jonas. Jonas just fits better with our team.

draftnet is rather amateur. just about everyone thinks dx > draftnet

Agreed.

I think we better be using our ammo to get Barnes, that means everyone is on the table but Wes/Love/Rubio. Hopefully we can get #2 or #3.

[Worm Guts]

I still have a hard time getting excited about Barnes. He doesn't shoot high percentages, he doesn't get to the line, he's not a great passer, he's not all that athletic. I'm Ok with drafting him high because there's not really anyone else, but I'm not huge on trading up to get him.

[jpatrick]

I still have a hard time getting excited about Barnes. He doesn't shoot high percentages, he doesn't get to the line, he's not a great passer, he's not all that athletic. I'm Ok with drafting him high because there's not really anyone else, but I'm not huge on trading up to get him.

I agree with this. After Irving, I think the next 5 or 6 guys are all about the same and none are elite prospects. I might like Barnes more than the rest of them because of fit, but I don't watch him and think future superstar.

Would we be disappointed if he became Luol Deng? I see his ceiling as Joe Johnson, more likely scenario as a Deng type and floor as Marvin Williams. Outside of not being elite athletes, I don't see the Pierce comparisons personally, and for the record, if you can get a above average starter, like Deng, out of this craptastic draft, then that's a good pick.

If we were lucky enough to win the lottery and picked Irving, would anyone have a problem shipping Rubio for Barnes? Does Rubio have enough value to get a top 5 pick in this draft? I would think teams like Sacramento, Toronto, Cleveland and even Detroit would need a young PG who could add a little sizzle to their marketing campaigns. The other option is moving him for a veteran wing but I don't see one that we could get (I don't see Gordon or Iggy coming for Rubio). But heck, we're the Twolves, we're not winning the lottery anyway.

[GDG]

I still have a hard time getting excited about Barnes. He doesn't shoot high percentages, he doesn't get to the line, he's not a great passer, he's not all that athletic. I'm Ok with drafting him high because there's not really anyone else, but I'm not huge on trading up to get him.

I'm afraid that adding Barnes to the Wolves would just be adding another good rotation player. Nothing transformational or transcendent. I think I'd almost take a risk on someone who was more boom or bust. I'm not sure who represents that in this draft... people like Jimmer and Walker are electrifying and transcendent college players, but scare the hell out of me at the NBA level for multiple reasons.

Any way I slice it, it seems like this draft just sucks for the Wolves. Maybe we should just try to trade our pick for an unprotected first for next year's draft?

[AQuintus]

If we were lucky enough to win the lottery and picked Irving, would anyone have a problem shipping Rubio for Barnes?

I would. If we were to trade Rubio, I'd want someone who can come in and help make us a playoff team now. For the short term, I'm not convinced at all that Barnes would be better than the players we currently have, and for the long term, I'm not even sure he's going to be much better, if at all, than Johnson and/or Beasley either.

If we can get Irving (or even if we don't), I'd package everyone expect Irving (or Rubio if we don't get him),Love, and maybe Johnson to try to bring in Iguodala and a big upgrade at Center (Horford, Bogut, Nene, Gasol, or Chandler). Then we'd fill in the rest of the roster with the guys we didn't trade and veteran FA players.

[phonzadellika]

I think I'd rather have Rubio than Irving at this point...Rubio has been playing against NBAish caliber players forever, so I think he'd adapt to the league faster. I've waited two years to see Rubio in a Wolves uniform. I'll understand if they draft Irving, but I won't enjoy it.

Outside of Irving, I think that most of the players in the lottery are similar potential-wise, except for Perry Jones who could be a star but will probably bust instead.

I don't know that Barnes is going to be the franchise guy that others do, but at this point I'd be willing to trot out a Rubio/Johnson/Barnes/Love/Randolph lineup for the defensive potential alone provided AR bulks up in the off-season...in my heart of hearts though I want to see us trade back up into the lottery and trot out Rubio/Johnson/Vesely/Love/Valanciunas. Randolph instead of Jonas V if he bulks up.

What I really, really want to see, though, is a competitive ball club night in and night out. Make it happen Kahn.

[Krapinsky]

I still have a hard time getting excited about Barnes. He doesn't shoot high percentages, he doesn't get to the line, he's not a great passer, he's not all that athletic. I'm Ok with drafting him high because there's not really anyone else, but I'm not huge on trading up to get him.

I'm afraid that adding Barnes to the Wolves would just be adding another good rotation player. Nothing transformational or transcendent. I think I'd almost take a risk on someone who was more boom or bust. I'm not sure who represents that in this draft... people like Jimmer and Walker are electrifying and transcendent college players, but scare the hell out of me at the NBA level for multiple reasons.

Any way I slice it, it seems like this draft just sucks for the Wolves. Maybe we should just try to trade our pick for an unprotected first for next year's draft?

I think Barnes will be better than anyone we currently have on the wings. I also think Barnes and Jones are the only guys no named Irving that have a ceiling above "good rotation player." Barnes is a better fit than Jones and probably has less bust potential.

I have a hunch that Jordan will try and get Barnes by trading up from the Bobs pick if they don't get lucky (i bet they do).

[Esohny]

I think Barnes will be better than anyone we currently have on the wings. I also think Barnes and Jones are the only guys no named Irving that have a ceiling above "good rotation player." Barnes is a better fit than Jones and probably has less bust potential.

I'd agree with that.

edit: I agree with Barnes's talent vs. our wings and his fit/risk. I think that the two center prospects Kanter and Valunciunas have higher ceilings than rotation players.

[Worm Guts]

Barnes may be a better wing than anyone we have, but I don't any reason to say that with any confidence. And honestly, being better than any of our wings may be too low of a bar to have any meaning.

[Esohny]

Barnes may be a better wing than anyone we have, but I don't any reason to say that with any confidence. And honestly, being better than any of our wings may be too low of a bar to have any meaning.

Shrug. I understand why you wouldn't want to trade up for him, I actually wouldn't either. It seems like the Wolves are going to be in a lame spot yet again during the draft, with flawed talent and/or questionable fit for the prospects that will be there.

Personally, I'm liking what I've seen/read about Kanter (I've seen him described as a legit center sized Al Horford in a number of places, but he looks like he's better on offense and not quite there on defense), and would like to draft him pending a doctor's check of his knees, and trade for a vet SG with any of the assets besides Love, Rubio, and one of Beasley/Johnson.

But if the Wolves drafted at 5, and the first 4 picks came down something like Irving-Jones-Valunciunas-Kanter, Barnes might be the pick.

[eyeteeth]

I strongly suspect we will make some kind of draft-day move. The question, of course is what move? If the Wolves land the number one pick, I would hope we trade for a proven player, though. I don't think Barnes is going to be good enough soon enough for us to target him this way.

I think my ideal post-draft scenario right now might be Valenciunas in the draft and trade any asset not named Love, Beasley, Randolph or Johnson for a solid veteran or two. I honestly was hoping we could land Raja Bell for cheap at the deadline. He would be a great off the bench mentor to our wing players and could teach them more than a thing or two about defense and consistent effort.

I think Rubio, Johnson, Beasley, Love and Randolph will all be really good NBA players in a few years. Just because we had hoped for twice as many wins this year is no reason to throw good players away.

[GDG]

Barnes may be a better wing than anyone we have, but I don't any reason to say that with any confidence. And honestly, being better than any of our wings may be too low of a bar to have any meaning.

Shrug. I understand why you wouldn't want to trade up for him, I actually wouldn't either. It seems like the Wolves are going to be in a lame spot yet again during the draft, with flawed talent and/or questionable fit for the prospects that will be there.

Personally, I'm liking what I've seen/read about Kanter (I've seen him described as a legit center sized Al Horford in a number of places, but he looks like he's better on offense and not quite there on defense), and would like to draft him pending a doctor's check of his knees, and trade for a vet SG with any of the assets besides Love, Rubio, and one of Beasley/Johnson.

But if the Wolves drafted at 5, and the first 4 picks came down something like Irving-Jones-Valunciunas-Kanter, Barnes might be the pick.

This all sounds pretty much like where I am at too. Even the "coming around on Kanter" part... up until a day or two ago, I was down on him. But the more I read, the more "up" on Kanter I become. I'm probably grasping at straws.

Generally, though, I come back to this line of thinking every time...

It seems like the Wolves are going to be in a lame spot yet again during the draft, with flawed talent and/or questionable fit for the prospects that will be there.

[horaceworthy]

Shrug. I understand why you wouldn't want to trade up for him, I actually wouldn't either. It seems like the Wolves are going to be in a lame spot yet again during the draft, with flawed talent and/or questionable fit for the prospects that will be there.

Personally, I'm liking what I've seen/read about Kanter (I've seen him described as a legit center sized Al Horford in a number of places, but he looks like he's better on offense and not quite there on defense), and would like to draft him pending a doctor's check of his knees, and trade for a vet SG with any of the assets besides Love, Rubio, and one of Beasley/Johnson.

But if the Wolves drafted at 5, and the first 4 picks came down something like Irving-Jones-Valunciunas-Kanter, Barnes might be the pick.

The Wolves have actually been in pretty good spots during the draft of late (say, post- Brewer), but have lamed it up with their selections. That looks to be the case again to me (possibly for both the picks), although hopefully better choices are made this time.

Right now it's sort of a top 1, the next 6 (with a couple less than perfect fits for the Wolves), and a freakishly muddled rest of the lottery. That could change by the end of the tournament, depending on how Irving, Barnes and Sullinger play.

If the Wolves are in position to take one of Irving/Barnes/Kanter/Valanciunas I'll be happy, I wouldn't be upset with Perry Jones, and I'd at least be intrigued by Derrick Williams (although if that would likely result in a Beasley trade). Sullinger's really the only guy from the top 7 I'd be irked about the Wolves drafting.

With the Memphis pick I like Burks, Kawhi Leonard, Brandon Knight, Cory Joseph, Jimmer, Nolan Smith, and I've got my eye on Will Barton during the tournament.

EDIT: Forgot to mention Jeremy Lamb. He's likely going to stay in school, but if he did declare he'd be in the running for the Memphis pick.

[eyeteeth]

Shrug. I understand why you wouldn't want to trade up for him, I actually wouldn't either. It seems like the Wolves are going to be in a lame spot yet again during the draft, with flawed talent and/or questionable fit for the prospects that will be there.

Personally, I'm liking what I've seen/read about Kanter (I've seen him described as a legit center sized Al Horford in a number of places, but he looks like he's better on offense and not quite there on defense), and would like to draft him pending a doctor's check of his knees, and trade for a vet SG with any of the assets besides Love, Rubio, and one of Beasley/Johnson.

But if the Wolves drafted at 5, and the first 4 picks came down something like Irving-Jones-Valunciunas-Kanter, Barnes might be the pick.

The Wolves have actually been in pretty good spots during the draft of late (say, post- Brewer), but have lamed it up with their selections. That looks to be the case again to me (possibly for both the picks), although hopefully better choices are made this time.

Right now it's sort of a top 1, the next 6 (with a couple less than perfect fits for the Wolves), and a freakishly muddled rest of the lottery. That could change by the end of the tournament, depending on how Irving, Barnes and Sullinger play.

If the Wolves are in position to take one of Irving/Barnes/Kanter/Valanciunas I'll be happy, I wouldn't be upset with Perry Jones, and I'd at least be intrigued by Derrick Williams (although if that would likely result in a Beasley trade). Sullinger's really the only guy from the top 7 I'd be irked about the Wolves drafting.

With the Memphis pick I like Burks, Kawhi Leonard, Brandon Knight, Cory Joseph, Jimmer, Nolan Smith, and I've got my eye on Will Barton during the tournament.

This seems like the kind of thing I should stick somewhere to copy and paste. Drafting Williams does not mean Beasley gets traded. Most teams put draftees on the bench and play them second string their rookie years at least. It might put a fire under Beasley to know there's a playmaker behind him, and at the least it gives us options when it's time to deal with Beasley's contract. Williams looks like a real player in the NBA. It wouldn't hurt us to draft him. I'd certainly rather have him than the mystery man Perry Jones.

[horaceworthy]

This seems like the kind of thing I should stick somewhere to copy and paste. Drafting Williams does not mean Beasley gets traded. Most teams put draftees on the bench and play them second string their rookie years at least. It might put a fire under Beasley to know there's a playmaker behind him, and at the least it gives us options when it's time to deal with Beasley's contract. Williams looks like a real player in the NBA. It wouldn't hurt us to draft him. I'd certainly rather have him than the mystery man Perry Jones.

Derrick Williams does look like a real player. I have no objections to him being the pick, as I said, I'd be intrigued. He's smart, tough, athletic and makes shots at an absurd rate. He's also a combo tweener, like Beasley. I guess they could see time together in the frontcourt, like Atlanta's forward duo, but they'd mostly be in each other's way. The Wolves would eventually have to cut ties with one (I didn't say the trade would be immediate).

I'm not sold on Beasley having the focus to live up to his potential on either end of the court, combine that with his coming up for an extension sooner and I think he'd be the one to be dealt for a piece that fits better.

[Devilzsidewalk]

hard to knock Williams, but I have an easy time envisioning Sullinger's success @ the NBA level by using his size to control paint, but I'm not sure how Williams fits yet. He's shown range on his shot, but I haven't seen a handle to show he can be a SF. Beasley can barely pull it off and he had shown far more face up ability at this point in their respective careers. As a PF I wonder how he's going to score, he's not going to have any strength or size advantage and his athleticism is very good, but I think there's a big gap between a dominating PF athlete like Amar'e or Griffin vs Williams who seems closer to the norm than the elite.

[horaceworthy]

Williams has shown good ability to face up from the high post, he's quite deadly there, and while he has made plays off the bounce from around the three point line, you're right in that Beasley did it more often.

I also don't know how he fits exactly, but his shotmaking ability's so ludicrous from so many places, and he's shown the ability to create space to get it off. He's like some weird David West/Paul Pierce hybrid.

At PF he'll have a skill advantage, and should be a real weapon in screen action, as well as being a threat facing the basket.

[moss_is_1]

I still have a hard time getting excited about Barnes. He doesn't shoot high percentages, he doesn't get to the line, he's not a great passer, he's not all that athletic. I'm Ok with drafting him high because there's not really anyone else, but I'm not huge on trading up to get him.

He's now up to 47% from field and 35% from 3, that's pretty good %'s for a wing. I know his #'s don't show it but from what I've seen and from what I've read he shows good passing skills. His defense is pretty good for being so young, mostly on the ball. Also the thing I and I believe Krapinsky like the most is that he's a great kid, who has an elite work ethic. That's something you can't teach. He gets to the line at an okay rate despite not being a great ballhandler or elite athlete, I think once he shores his handle up some more he could get there a lot more.

It depends what we would trade up with I spose, and were we land.